ACCT Installed Wrong?

[Rasputin]

Well, at least Ian is not unwilling to do some wrenching on his bike. He gets high marks for that! Timing with cams is definately critical with interferrance-type engines. Ian will end-up knowing more about his bike than most that just take it to the shop for everything.

I agree with you all the way Skids. I would just like him to take advantage of the help offered and learn as much as he can. An experienced guy like Scott can teach him so much. Combine that with Ian's willingness to tackle problems and work on things and we will have a new GURU soon.

[IanDMacDonald]

I respect everything you have to say 100% Doug. This is a big case of shoulda, woulda, coulda. I messed up big and take full responsibility. The ACCT was an unnecessary mod to the bike at this point, and I should have never tackled it without doing more research when it involved something so critical as messing with the mechanics of the bike. I'll have to get some money together for some of the parts of this re-build and definitely learn to practice a higher level of patience. I appreciate everyone's support on this forum, and everyday I am on here I learn more and more.

[James England]

he ACCT was an unnecessary mod to the bike at this point, and I should have never tackled it without doing more research when it involved something so critical as messing with the mechanics of the bike.

It was an excellent preventative measure, however, and is well worth doing. I suppose the way to look at it is that every piece on the engine runs strictly according to 'rules' set by the mechanical position of everything at a given time. The timing chain makes sure everything happens at the right.er.....time. So, always proceed with caution on anything that affects the relative position of the many moving components.

Your best bet is to post here before undertaking anything that you aren't familiar with or don't feel confident about. Yes, I'd trawl the previous threads etc but sometimes a quick post will give you an almost instant response. There are loads of people here who like to help, so when in doubt, just ask!

[Rasputin]

It's Saturday!!! Looking forward to an update on this as today is the day Scoot is supposed to help out. Hoping for the best.

[IanDMacDonald]

I'll be taking the bike upto Scott's tomorrow, and he'll go over the damage with me. He'll take his valves to his machine shop next week, and the hope is to have the bike back together whenever our schedules meet again.

[Rasputin]

Ok I am dying to know if Sott made it and if anything on this thread was resolved or where it stands at the moment.

[IanDMacDonald]

I ended-up having to work on Sunday, on top of it snowing up here that morning. So, I was not comfortable trailering the bike upto Scott's house. Him and I will have to get together soon before the real snow comes. As of now, I have not touched the bike. He told me not to touch it, lol.

[Larrym]

MouseTrap Got 'Nuther One.

. I messed up big and take full responsibility. The ACCT was an unnecessary mod to the bike at this point, and I should have never tackled it without doing more research when it involved something so critical as messing with the mechanics of the bike.

It is my opinion that even if you followed all the instructions perfectly in the following link that your chances of success or failure would still have been equally weighted.:

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showpost.p...08&postcount=1

"To install any of these.... (make sure the bike is level before starting, preferably on the centerstand)

1. Remove timing cover
2. Turn engine clockwise until the "C" mark lined up with the pointer
3. Remove the 2 bolts (5mm) from the OEM cam chain tensioner
4. Remove the cam chain tensioner and paper gasket from the engine
5. Loosen and remove large bolt (19mm I think) and underlying spring from the front of the auto tensioner.
6. Depress the ratchet arm on the tensioner and push the plunger all the way back in."

As I see things, the odds of skipping/jumping a tooth or having the chain fall forward/down (and therefore causing mechanical damage) is always 50/50 with this method. Those that didn't get bit by this moustrap swear it's perfectly good to do it this way. Those that do get bit are generally accused of doing it out of sequence or just plain WRONG (and then thought to be lying about making a mistake.)

I will be replacing the unit shown below:



I will NOT be using the above method outlined in blue text.

Period.

[jetmechmarty]

Larrym,

What is your method? In my case, the chain was stretched, so I replaced it at the same time and avoided any out-of-time issue.

[DGXSER]

Ok, the interesting thing about your post Larry is that for anyone to say they have used that method repeatedly with no problems, would simply imply they were just overly lucky, instead of confirming the system works. As you might have guessed, I am one of those "lucky" blokes. I have both removed and reinstalled the factory tensioner as well as installed the auto tensioner. Not had one skip a tooth on the chain to date.

Interestingly enough, it is the method given by the engineers that designed the bike. Now, I am not suggesting it is not a good idea to pull the valve cover and keep an eye on the timing while you do this. Simply saying it is not a requirement. I believe there are two things that may cause issues.

The C mark on the timing plate puts the engine at a point where the compression of the cylinders keeps tension on the back of the chain which will keep the crank teeth engaged with the chain providing friction against the chain falling. The other factor can be a well stretched cam chain, causing it to be looser than normal. So a over stretched chain may not keep the friction at the crank.

I do believe there are some who do not have a centerstand and do it on the side stand. I know, simply "calling those who had issues liars".

A possible point of confusion is that the proper method does not line up the timing marks, It would also be easy for someone to think they needed to line up the timing marks so they can be sure they stay aligned when they do the work. Easy enough for a rookie like I was when I first found this site to get confused on this.

At any rate, I look forward to seeing the method you recommend Larry. There is always a better way to build a mouse trap.

[IanDMacDonald]

Keep in-mind, common sense has a play in this, and I obviously did not follow that. What I did was follow that small instruction set and nothing more. I did not re-check the timing marks prior to cranking the engine, I did not rotate the crank two or three revolutions after I installed the ACCT, or anything else that somebody else would have done with more experience than me. I am 100% confident that those instructions are safe to follow as long as you know what you are doing. I did not and I admit that. When in-doubt (as I've learned), DON'T DO ANYTHING UNTIL YOU ARE 100% SURE WITHOUT A DOUBT THAT YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING! I really thought it was a simple operation, and that was it.

[crazy steve]

The only fool-proof method I can think of for replacing the CCT would be to pull the cams cover and manually pull all the slack out of the chain as you remove the tensioner and keeping this tension applied while the tensioner is out, and then allowing the tensioner to 'take' the slack during/after reinstallation.

To be honest, I personally use a different method, but it's different from both the one above and the factory procedure. With the cams and timing covers both off, I turn the motor to the 'T' mark at the crank, verify that the cam timing marks on the cams/caps line up, then remove/replace the CCT. I then rotate the motor (by hand) a few times to re-verify that all the marks still line up and that the ACCT has 'racheted' out to take the slack out of the chain. If everything still lines up, it's good to go....

[Rasputin]

I for one am wondering if this thread ever got resolved or if we are waiting on parts, funding, time , weather or what. I would hate to see a thread like this one die, lying dormant for years, when others could benefit from it.

[IanDMacDonald]

Hey oh. Scott and I may get together sometime soon to get that head replaced. I've been extremely busy with college finals and work. I'll get a trailer and get the bike upto him within the coming weeks. As of right now, I brought the gas tank inside, while the bike is still in the garage. Hopefully the carbs are not gumming up. I probably should go out there tomorrow and empty the bowls.

[LoHo]

My question applies to this thread, more or less, but I always wondered:

What is the magic of the C mark? What cam chain condition exists at C?