Boorrrringggg Build/Rebuild/Refres&restore

[puskrat]

Christmas in November

Christmas in November

[DiverRay]

Yeah, I DO drink wine but have never used one of those, as I always just toss them. There is no cost for them, and they are just trying to suck you in to buying wine online because it's "a cheap way to get good wine". As I live in the oldest wine growing area in California, and know a few wine makers, I don't need it.

[3Phase]

Feliz Dia de Accion de Gracias! I have a bunch of those wine vouchers -- want some more?

This's a timely thread update. I was getting lazy, thanks, puskrat.


The metal drain plug gaskets are reusable.

The two rubber oil filter o-rings are not supposed to be reused.


The filters I buy come with both o-rings so I usually pop out and flip the large o-ring to make sure it's still flexible and I try not to disturb the small o-ring on the oil filter bolt. I replace both o-rings every second filter change.

Hmm, it looks like the NAPA PFI PS4933 (Power Sport) is out of stock, I think they might be discontinued. Bummer, I have three XS/XJ1100s.

Ah! The WIX part number is still good. The picture shows both o-rings so I ordered a case of 12 from Discount Fleet Supply @ $3.48 each, $56.47 delivered. I hope they do have the o-rings.

http://www.discountfleetsupply.com/n...ml?query=24933

[puskrat]

Haven't followed the fleetsupply link yet.

I got a new big o ring with my first filter. I got a new small o ring with my replacement bolt/bypass. I remember a dispute in the past regarding reuse of oil pan plug gaskets. Seems really similar to a crush washer. Once crushed, it's no longer a crush washer. As I recall, the gaskets could be reusable, but best practice called for them to be replaced. That was automotive, not moto.

[3Phase]

You're probably thinking of the crush washers for the brake system, those are supposed to be replaced. The aluminum washers are single-use but you can anneal the copper ones and reuse them. It's not that big a deal to get a stack of new copper washers and start over.

The washers for the drain plugs aren't meant to be replaced unless you buy a new bolt and want a matching washer to go with it or if you somehow manage to lose/damage the original washer. You can cut new ones out of soup cans but the stamped washers look better and are a little less expensive than a trip to the ER to stitch your fingers if you slip up.


Some of the oil filters come with the o-rings, some don't. The one OEM Yamaha filter I bought didn't have any and they wanted, like, $25 so guess which o-rings got reused that time. If the aftermarket filter you buy comes with the rubber o-rings there are supposed to be two of them. If one's missing then it fell out or got scavenged by someone else that either didn't want to pay or discovered they were worth $25 before the box made its way to you.

[motoman]

Haven't followed the fleetsupply link yet.

I got a new big o ring with my first filter. I got a new small o ring with my replacement bolt/bypass. I remember a dispute in the past regarding reuse of oil pan plug gaskets. Seems really similar to a crush washer. Once crushed, it's no longer a crush washer. As I recall, the gaskets could be reusable, but best practice called for them to be replaced. That was automotive, not moto.

For replacement of the oil pan drain bolt washer, I found that a snug fitting around drain bolt threads that a normal copper washer works well.......least the same one has worked for my Venturer for the past 5+yrs, with not so much as a weep. No special washer is needed, just a copper one.

[puskrat]

Pods

I think Doug has the Mike's pod filters. I'm sure others do as well. Somewhere in marketing world, I read the OE manifolds can't support carbs without the airbox. Granted, this was in a product description for replacement manifolds. I don't even think "manifolds" is the proper term which increases my skepticism. Nonetheless, I'm floating the question: has anyone had a problem with the carbs pulling away after "podding"?

[motoman]

I think Doug has the Mike's pod filters. I'm sure others do as well. Somewhere in marketing world, I read the OE manifolds can't support carbs without the airbox. Granted, this was in a product description for replacement manifolds. I don't even think "manifolds" is the proper term which increases my skepticism. Nonetheless, I'm floating the question: has anyone had a problem with the carbs pulling away after "podding"?

Several here use the pods without any issue of needing support. Stock airbox is STILL the best option for smooth running and performance........reason being, it is all designed to operate correctly(the vacuum carbs especially)together as a unit. If your installing pods just for grins and giggles as opposed to the stock airbox, expect to miss the 'grins and giggles' part.

[motoman]

To better explain is very simple.......if you think for one second to have a performance gain from using pods instead of stock airbox, your dreaming....never gonna happen......in fact, overall performance LOSS is gonna be the result...period. FWIW, pods for bike carbs where originally designed to be used on a bike that runs quarter mile(drag-racing) at wide open throttle only. Everyday riding with different throttle applications, stock airbox IS the best option. Using pods and having a smooth overall running bike requires a Dyno-Jet kit which requires vacuum slide to be drilled a specific size and at a specific angle, along with likely main/piot jet changes. Unless your really some sort of carb guru, I suggest not using pods.

[TopCatGr58]

Point, Counterpoint

Hey Puskrat,

I've had my bike since it was new in '83, rode it for 9 years with OEM box, but put on 4-1 pipes just a couple of years after getting it back to the states from Japan where I was stationed. Never rejetted it, ran just fine with the stock airbox and 4-1 pipes. Then tranny broke, sat 9 years, finally got rebuilt in 2000 and installed Pods along with a 1179 big bore kit. Rejetted the mains 3 sizes up. The original Pods were the spongy cylindrical type, no restrictive mounting lip on them. The intake boots/manifolds held the carbs just fine. Folks describe that the OEM box helps to stabilize the carbs so that they don't vibrate/bounce very much, and so the Pods allow them to "hang" on the boots and can bounce a bit more. Folks have rigged an extra brace bar from the frame to the carbs to help in stabilizing them in the absence of the airbox.

Brant/Motoman's knowledge and experience with tuning these and other bikes for racing and such is extensive. However, I think some of the statements about the detrimental performance from Pods is/was linked to our collective previous experience with the el cheapo Emgo cone shaped Pods with the restrictive mounting lips that interfered with the airflow of the inlet bell. And also folks were getting the crappy generic pilot jets that used the wrong metering, and both contributed to excessively rich conditions, poor throttle response, loss of power and topend.

Then, later on we learned/realized about the mounting lip, and the incorrect pilot jets, and came up with the mounting mods....pseudo velocity stacks and such that help to mimic the internal velocity stacks of the OEM airbox, straighten out the airflow into the carbs and also eliminated the inlet bell port restrictions. SO....many of us have installed POD filters, and with some modest rejetting adjustments, have had our bikes perform just fine, with good smooth throttle responses throughout the rpm range.

Like Brant stated, there really wasn't any increase in actual HP performance with the Pods, but due to either damaged airboxes, or just wanting easier R&R of the carbs, or a different aesthetic of Pods, or the extra "sound" affect with the Pods, folks have installed Pods and have been happy with them, and no report of carbs sliding off of the intake boots either. YMMV

T.C.

[motoman]

Appreciate the better detailed explanation T.C. Know I can either count on you, or Greg(BA80) to get my short, sometimes confusing explanations better squared away for the occassionable less knowing......it's all good. Besides, Greg likes the opportunity to pick on me anyways....any chance he gets.

[puskrat]

There'll be no picking. We're all going to get along or I'll just stop this thread and hijack someone else's.

[puskrat]

But since you brought up the displacement kits (after all, there is no replacement), who made those things, where were they purchased, and how nightmarish was the installation? Are any still available and what effect did they have or problems did they create?

[TopCatGr58]

Hey Again,

I bought my kit from WISECO, paid over $500.00 for it in ~2000...had Forged pistons, plus the rings, wristpins, head gasket, all of the basic parts needed for a top end rebuild aside from finding a machine shop to do the boring/matching to the pistons...last check was about $40.00 hole, may be more now?? I didn't touch the bottom end at all, just put the new pistons onto the OEM piston rods. The bike/engine only had about 50Kmiles on it and had not displayed any hint of problems, and I didn't want to split the cases, so I just put them in. Have put over 25K miles since then, still running strong.

ViperRon installed the Japanese Cast big bore kit, same parts as mine, wristpins, rings, head gasket, but only $150.00 for the whole kit. Has been working just fine for him as well over the past 2 years. They don't really provide much in the way of HP boost, more for just being able to keep an engine going when the pistons/rings wear out!

The only problem I had was ignorance in handling the head and valves ending up bending a few before realizing couldn't have both cams in at same time and rotate one without hitting other valves sticking out!

Recently we tried to find them on eBay, and they weren't there anymore, but it was because they had sold out of all of the kits they had made. Another member had a link to the eBay listing, and the company/person selling them, will need to a search for it??

T.C.

[puskrat]

Thanks Cat. I'd gotten the impression the bigbore kits were approaching obsolescence, but wasnt sure. Probably a good project for me to not tackle anyway LOL.