Set and forget tensioner (For XJs too)

[motoman]

Interesting, as that was my first thought being diamater of contacting rod. Spring pressure being same would'nt really be an issue IMO, as common practice among some old schoolers in shops was to back off housing mounting bolts a hair, undo retainer bolt, lock it down then tighten mounting bolts, putting ever so slight more tension against guide assembly. Seems to have work fine for me here couple yrs' ago. Prior to that, seemed like I would have to do it bout every 3000miles from time it was new. Couple weeks ago, just loosened lock bolt witout loosening housing, and didn't hear anything move, so locked it back down. It had bout an additional 8-9K since last done, so not really sure if that is really a good practice either, with the additional bit of load put on things. Don't really want to experiment much as I'm not really interested in overhauling my motor, very capable, but not interested. Always figured if it "chucked" that would be the end of my 28yr. XS "thing". During that time period there were a few scoots that used a self adjuster, so maybe the XS's style was for a reason. Can see where an adbrupt decel could force the rod back, but then I would first suspect operator error when it was adjusted rather than inferior design. Seems to me these air-cooled motors were built a little on the forgiving side anyways. Even tho I have some three sets on "watch" on fleabay, gonna hold off same as the guys on the other side of the pond........no big......if turns out to be "the cats meow", I have no issue paying the $105 new that they now list for if I were to feel it desperately needed to be done.

[Ivan]

I highly doubt there is much more pressure than stock. Even if it were so, it shouldn't wear on the guides, since the spring pressure on the cams would supposedly put more pressure on them than the tensioner. Remember, the C mark is positioned so the cams pull the slack toward the tensioner, in operation, I suspect the pull of the cams is much harsher than that of the tensioner spring. As far as that goes, it'll probably wear the chain out long before the guides crap out. Also, the carriage bolt mod would easily put exponentially more force on the chain with out knowing, due to the mechanical advantage of the thread pitch, and I have seen nothing as to the wear on that gent's scoot. Further more, if the extra pressure is truly a concern to someone, they could just push the rod in with an allen wrench or screwdriver and leave the spring out, or shorten the spring a bit.

[motoman]

Also, IMHO, the guys on other side of the pond, Aus. included have regularly come up with innovative upgrades and mods over several decades on scoots that even amaze me, even though some styles are not my style and a bit different. Gonna be taking my XS down to a shop here to have valves checked and re-shimmed as necessary this week(mechanic there I've known for years and owns a 1300Venture is very sharp on these scoots), so gonna ask his opinion on this possible upgrade also. Yeh, I know, should do it myself, and can, but some things like that, unless it's a project with challanges and curiosity, just don't care to do much anymore. If I get any feedback from him that's seems to be legitimate as to "why not to do", I'll definitely post it here in this thread rather than see someones scoot down the road in the future have a premature failure of some sort related to this upgrade. Other than that I think this is the next best upgrade to a fork brace and still leaving bike stock.

[TopCatGr58]

I've been away at a continuing education conference this past week, didn't have much time or access to the internet.

I'm no engineer or even a professional mechanic, but from what I've seen of this device, that the little spring it has to keep and push the plunger against the chain guide would not provide anywhere enough tension to cause any undo wear. The ratchet mechanism prevents it from retracting under cam chain tension, but when some slack were to develop in the chain, the plunger would just move in and out slightly within the small range that it has. And then only when the slack becomes enough then the plunger moves just far enough to slip past the next ratchet point resetting the adjuster and maintaining just optimum minimal chain slack. No excessive tension is really ever put on the chain guide or chain. I do agree that "improper" tension of the carriage bolt type could cause/induce premature stretching, but I would still not hesistate to put that type on my machine if my oem crapped out.

Depending on how old and how much slack is already being taken up by the OEM tensioner is what would determine your risk factor for the excessive slack to drop around the crank during the replacement process. Regrettably, the OEM style tensioner does not allow you to see how much slack it's taken up WITHOUT removing it. The whole purpose of doing this mod is to reduce the risk of the cam chain slipping around the crank sprocket and skipping teeth, throwing the cams out of time and possibly bending valves, so why would a person want to take the chance of not removing the valve cover to ensure that the chain slack is taken up and not allowed to drop around the crank? Otherwise, why bother doing the mod at all? JMHO.

T.C.

[XSokieSPECIAL]

I've been away at a continuing education conference this past week, didn't have much time or access to the internet.

I'm no engineer or even a professional mechanic, but from what I've seen of this device, that the little spring it has to keep and push the plunger against the chain guide would not provide anywhere enough tension to cause any undo wear. The ratchet mechanism prevents it from retracting under cam chain tension, but when some slack were to develop in the chain, the plunger would just move in and out slightly within the small range that it has. And then only when the slack becomes enough then the plunger moves just far enough to slip past the next ratchet point resetting the adjuster and maintaining just optimum minimal chain slack. No excessive tension is really ever put on the chain guide or chain. I do agree that "improper" tension of the carriage bolt type could cause/induce premature stretching, but I would still not hesistate to put that type on my machine if my oem crapped out.

Depending on how old and how much slack is already being taken up by the OEM tensioner is what would determine your risk factor for the excessive slack to drop around the crank during the replacement process. Regrettably, the OEM style tensioner does not allow you to see how much slack it's taken up WITHOUT removing it. The whole purpose of doing this mod is to reduce the risk of the cam chain slipping around the crank sprocket and skipping teeth, throwing the cams out of time and possibly bending valves, so why would a person want to take the chance of not removing the valve cover to ensure that the chain slack is taken up and not allowed to drop around the crank? Otherwise, why bother doing the mod at all? JMHO.

T.C.

Nice to see you back TC.

Be careful with that " continuing education" you'll outsmart yourself.

I've got this mod installed on my bike and it's working great so far.

There is some question as to if it could be damaging though.

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25281

Read this thread if you haven't already.

[bikerphil]

why would a person want to take the chance of not removing the valve cover to ensure that the chain slack is taken up and not allowed to drop around the crank?

The way I look at it, if the bike is level on the centerstand and the engine is not rotated, even if the chain hangs down off the crank, it should go right back to the same spot when the tension is re-applied. JMT

[trbig]

Otherwise, why bother doing the mod at all? JMHO.

For me, it's a case of wanting a tensioner that is worry free. I have to re-adjust my tensioner a LOT. I ride a bit aggressively, and the plunger gets pushed out a lot... I assume from when I chop the throttle. It might be my fault as I am pretty leery about applying too much torque to the set screw/bolt, but feel that is better than stripping it.

So... I like the thought of having an adjuster that I don't have to mess with all the time... but most people probably aren't going to have the problems I do. Another plus, though, is I think this unit is going to be a lot more "Drip proof" than the OEM unit.


Tod

[Ken Talbot]

It might be my fault as I am pretty leery about applying too much torque to the set screw/bolt, but feel that is better than stripping it.

For me, knowing that my adjuster has a helicoil takes away all of that nervous felling about torquing the set screw. OTOH, the ratcheting unit certainly interests me too...

YMMV

[DenyP]

For me, knowing that my adjuster has a helicoil takes away all of that nervous felling about torquing the set screw. OTOH, the ratcheting unit certainly interests me too...

YMMV

I went the heli-coil route myself, great repair! I did generate a particular dislike for the stock adjuster earlier this year. A workable upgrade here is welcome!

Deny

[cajun31]

What is the verdict on this mod? Anyone using it, too early to tell? Getting one was not that difficult. I scored one for $9.95 on fleabay.

[Ivan]

I have just put over 500 miles on it and no signs of malfunction. No cam chain noise, and I have done several hard decels, which was usually when mine would loosen. It runs like it has a well adjusted cam chain. I think the best systems are those that you forget even having, and that seems to be the case here.

[DGXSER]

Does anyone have a link to a guide or directions on installing it. Seems like it will want to extend and get hooked on the ratchet extended before you get it in place. Maybe I am just not seeing the obvious.

[GARTHXS]

instalation

remove the big nut and spring , push the shaft in , install on bike, install spring and then nut the adjuster should just push itself out

[cajun31]

Of course you need to make sure you have the motor rotated around to the C mark before installing.

[CA]

Extra?

Anybody have an extra one they received when they got one? The only one on ebay is 50 bucks! Would love to get my sausages on one!