money vs horsepower/CHAINDRIVE

[pggg]

T.C. those figures of mine are from comparing my 12T against my 17T(XS650). I should have said centre to edge, not diameter. My goof. The distance to edge difference between 12T and 17T is 13mm. Which will make the difference between 13T and 14T as 4.3mm? I'm thinking that's correct?

Yeah, I went thru all the sprocket books at the local bike shop at the start, and the range is bewildering to say the least! The best I could find was the good old XS650 with a 17 as smallest available(530). Still too big for clearance. Jim from Aussie says the TZ750 has the same pattern also, but if it comes as a 14T, I don't know, but I very much doubt it. BUT maybe there's a chance it does. A 530 pitch sprocket will fit the spline without needing a collar, but the rear wheel/sprocket will need to come as 530 as standard. My Kawasaki wheel came as 525 as standard, but 520 was available in conversion sprockets.

[pggg]

P.S. the smallest available XS650 sprocket is actually a 16T. Still too big. Chopping a small hole in the crankcase area, to allow clearance, then somehow? sealing up the inside to stop oil leaks - would be an option - assuming nothing inside the crancase gets in the way of the protruding sprocket and chain. That way, 16T and 17T sprockets would be available over the counter to use. No hassles about having to use custom- cut sprockets then. Possible to do? Maybe.

[GNEPIG]

.. hey pggg, this might be an option to consider, but how about a jack shaft set up.. i know this would be a little more weight and a little more resistance but you wouldn't have to hack into the cases, i don't think there is much room inside there and keeping it sealed might prove to be a pain..if you could fit a jack shaft your gearing choices would be unlimited ..your shaft could have a spline for a more popular/comon sprocket and what ever size/pitch chain you wanted
.. just a thought..
. ever notice how easy it is to think about other peoples projects?
it would be nice if would think about my own projects more often

[pggg]

GNE, these ideas and suggestions all show there's still a few different options that can taken to setup a chaindrive and it's just a matter of deciding which would be the easiest for any one person. For me, I'm not worried about using custom made sprockets, as there's an actual SPROCKET FACTORY 10 miles from home! They make any size/shape sprocket anytime you want. Quote from the factory guy who made me some sprockets when I asked can they make up what I wanted - "It's a peice of piss mate"

[TopCatGr58]

Well, I wrote to Bike Alert, the web site that has the JT Sprockets line, and inquired about the XS650 spline pattern, JTF568, and whether it was available in smaller sizes than the 17, here's the response. Note they talk about the 530 chain, however, you had already stated that it was better to use the 520 series!!

Mr. Curtis

We do not have have any sprocket with the same spline that is smaller
(in fact we carry only 16 and 17 tooth for North America).

I am not aware of this sprocket being made in 13 and 14 teeth and would
recommend against using one if you can find it. The 530 chain on a 13
tooth sprocket would wear very quickly because of the severe bend around
the front sprocket because of the sharp bend.

I would strongly recommend trying to find a larger rear instead.

Regards,

Richard Brice
Bike Alert USA

So...it looks like I, too, will be having to find a machine shop that can manufacture the required sprocket! How much was the one they made for you, and how much does it weigh? Might have to place an order with them THRU you, and have you ship US some, at least for Chevy and Me!!
T.C.

[pggg]

TC, I wouldn't take too much from what that guy says. He should have said a 'smaller' rear, not larger. The bend on the 13T isn't really that severe. Can't comment on the 530, but after about 1200 kilometres on my 520, 13T - 35T setup, the sprockets are not even slightly worn, and the non-O ring chain I'm using needed adjusting a few times when breaking it in, but now sits nice and firm for ages without needing a tweak.

750 Katanas run 530 13T fronts as do GS750's and some GSXR750's. There's also bikes running 630 (3/4 pitch - even coarser) with 13T fronts. GS1100 is one of them. Various GSXR1100's run 13T 532 pitch. Even Hayabusas and Bandits have 13T front available in 530. Gsxr1000's (160 horses!) have 14T available. And so on and so on. I'd take that guy's comments with a grain of salt. He's right in that a larger front is preferable to a too small one because of the shallower bend though.

Cost me $95 for two machined and hardened front sprockets with the right spline pattern. The more you get, the cheaper they are, as once their machine is set, they can churn through any amount quickly. They weigh 4 oz, but there'd surely be machinists in the States who can do the same. Although NZ dollar is only about 1/2 a U.S. dollar. Good for U.S. importers

[pggg]

I see the guy means using sprockets on an actual XS650, not an XS11. That's O.K. Might even consider letting them off on that one. Here's a downloadable sprocket catalogue, it's not the special pattern/dimension type the bikeshops have, but it's quite helpful on these sorts of things.
http://www.worldofpowersports.com/ca...-sprockets.pdf

XS500 has 13T and 14T available. What spline pattern though? Notice some manufacturers supply some sizes that others don't. Can't find much on TZ750 sprockets - they apparently fit the XS11 spline. TZ750 was a fire-breathing 180mph 4 cyl 2 stroke. Pretty rare.

[TopCatGr58]

The XS500 uses the 650spline pattern, but JTSprockets only has a listing of 15T, but as they stated, they don't make this pattern in less than 17T And after seeing this picture, the TZ750 used the 17T sprocket but can't/couldn't find a listing for it for the spline patter?


I had never heard of the TZ750, but from what I've read, it was one powerhouse machine

Well, if NZ dollars are 2:1 US, then I just might have to order some from them. I've found several "custom" sprocket companies on the NET, more for Harleys and pricey custom V-twins! So...even with shipping, it might still come out much cheaper ordering them from your source than here!?
T.C.

[xs650mike]

Hey TC those TZ750 two-strokes were the ticket for road racers. Tuners said "If you're not breaking frames, there's something wrong with the engine!" Kenny Roberts tried out one in a flat tracker, said it scared him to death though he did win one mile race with the thing before the AMA outlawed it.

[pggg]

Mike, they pumped out so much H.P. if NOT restricted with reed valves that they weren't rideable. Even by king kenny. T.C. if the XS500 has the same spline pattern, that PDF has Sunstar sprockets for XS500 listed as 13T and 14T, as do Renthal. I'm 99% sure a 14T will fit the 11 with a touch of dremelling, but won't confirm unless I try it. A 15T will likely come tantalisingly close too. Maybe just 1mm in it too much

[xs650mike]

King Kenny & TZ750


Roberts & TZ750.

[xs650mike]

A question pggg, if I may. Was looking at the pics and I notice that the sprocket's located quite some distance forward of the swingarm pivot which would seem to require more than a bit of slack in the chain. Any problem with chain whip?

[pggg]

Mike, the front sprocket is 7 inches forward of the swingarms' pivots. Not sure if that's any more or less than usual. No problem with any chain slop. Stays firm and tight in all positions. Chain will skim the top of the swingarm pivot cross bar with no rider on board.. eg when wheeling the bike around. Has a thick plastic strip cut from an old fender hoseclipped to sit between the chain and the metal pivot bar.

With rider on board, chain is straight and clear right thru from front to rear. No clearance problems. I noticed with 13 and 35 gearing, which is pretty tall, probably as tall as you'd want to have, that if doing a drag-race standing start, the 13T may 'skip' for a second or two on take-off! With a bigger rear sprocket, I doubt it would happen though. Not an issue unless you're really into full-noise dumping clutches and burnouts! You should be running lower gearing then anyway.

The more I ride this thing, the more I like it. The XS motors' smooth flexibility with tall gearing is amazing.

[TopCatGr58]

Well, PGGG,

After closer scrutiny of the PDF file you posted, along with using the JT Sprockets web site which actually shows the spline patterns, there were 2 different styles that the XS500 used. One was like the XS650/TX650.....the JT568, but the others were the JT513 which is the smaller and more numerous splines, and the more common style...but won't fit the XS11

SunStar shows only the 51017 style for the XS650, and NO OTHER BIKE shares that style, the other bikes are the 51113 series! RENTHAL doesn't even show any model for the XS650.
And JT only shows the 17T size!

Does that company you got the sprockets from deal in International orders? Do they have a web site?
T.C.

[pggg]

T.C. these various catalogues seem to have contradictions on those XS500C & D and XS650 splines. But I can easily get 13T and 14T sprockets made up to send over anytime. Common widths would be 520, 525, 530. Your individual choice hinges on your rear wheel setup, as you're looking at all this drama again, next time with rear sprockets Anyway, before deciding, you can easily base a rear end setup, swingarm dimensions, chain line, alignment etc.. from a line based from a flat plate or suchlike set on the front spline. Job might be tricky, time-consuming , but it's enjoyable!