1980 XS11 Special - Mayberry Duck Rebuild

[kboehringer]

XS11 Friends,

Well I did it again!



Bought another piece of junk SG and I am going to TRY to make it into a nice drive-able bike.

Having been through this before... (Ugly Duckling "The Duck") I probably should have known better but I do very much enjoy the rebuild process. I shouldn't need quite as much help as last time but this one has a couple issues the others didn't have.

Strangely, this one actually ran and I was able to take it for a short test drive. which I could not do with either of the previous bikes on purchase day. That doesn't mean it doesn't have some SERIOUS issues!

I've already started digging in and replaced a bunch of crap work-around stuff to avoid replacing the busted glass fuses. I replaced all the messy crap with ATM fuses and now I'm trying to fix a royal mess with the ignition pick-ups. The PO was fond of using wire nuts (for home wiring) to splice wires..... Removed three or four yesterday and found a couple more today.



The baby blue wire from the pick-ups is "spliced in not less than six(6) locations.



I'm going to use some wire from an old set of Fluke Meter Leads to replace the busted junk. Wire is very similar and I read on the board here others had done the same.

Hopefully, some of you will have some fun watching this idiot from ATL buy up every POS in the Southeast and try to make it run properly again?

If nothing else, ya'll can be happy your XS is in better shape than mine It's starting to look like a Yamaha Dealership at my house.

Had to get 'em all out and washed on Sunday. Two of the Five run properly so I'm batting .400 at the moment!



Respectfully,
KURT

[aquamantx]

Well Kurt it will be fun to see what you do. When I was first married I tried a little dabble in the multi bike area. Wife was ok up to the tenth one until I parked the 76 wing in the dinning room for a winter rebuild.

[kboehringer]

A good gal......

.... until I parked the 76 wing in the dinning room for a winter rebuild.

Some people mistake my Man Cave for a Living Room, which it once was when we had kids at home. It was converted to Living Space and is now back to being a Garage.



I am fortunate to have a wife that really enjoys the bikes (and the Hot Rods). Probably has a better knowledge of automotive/repair tools than any woman I ever met. She's use to me screwing around with cars and bikes for the 30+ years we've been married.

Honestly, we've both had more fun and met more great people with these recent XS11's than we ever had with any of the Car Clubs

Maybe that's why I get no crap about the THREE XS11's, XJ, or CT70.

KURT

[aquamantx]

Well we are still together after 23 years. The wing bit it back in 96 when a lady decided I needed to be on her hood instead of the bike. The wife actually made me buy the vstat after the xs went down. Something about me getting grumpy lol.

[Radioguylogs]

She's use to me screwing around with cars and bikes for the 30+ years we've been married.

KURT

Beats the alternative as far as Nancy is concerned?

[kboehringer]

Getting the ignition timing correct?

XS Friends,

Last evening I finished the repair of the ignition pick-up (sorry no photo at the moment).

In order to repair the wiring, the vacuum advance lever mounting, and return the mechanical advance to a functional condition, the entire assembly had to be removed from the bike and completely taken apart. Everything was cleaned, lubricated where needed, and reassembled. I went so far as to pull the shield on the bearing cleaned it, lubed it, and re-assembled. The re-purposed silicone wires from an old multi-meter are a dead ringer for the stock wires. Before I started cleaning and lubricating the mechanical would NOT even move 1mm. Everything moves nice & free with no binding, rubbing wires, etc.

The spark is big and bright blue and looks fantastic on all plugs! But, I have not attempted to start the bike as the timing could be far enough off to cause piston damage.

It is obvious the PO had done a bunch of messing around with this device and "RIGGED" a connection for the vac. advance to the plate that was garbage because he didn't know how to pull the plate (i.e. torque break off bolts). It was also clear he had at some point removed the pointer and adjusted the pick-up proximity to the rotating shaft.

With all the rigging and now repair work done this entire device(s) can not be assured to be in the proper location(s). I marked the base plate but since the whole thing is on a bearing that won't matter much? The pointer is adjustable as well and it's unknown if it's in the proper location.

Fortunately, the mechanical advance assy. can only be installed in one location as the crank has a locating pin. The timing wheel can also only be attached in one location as it's locating slot is offset to one side. I have to figure out how to assure the pointer is pointing at TDC when the #1 piston is actually at TDC. After that, my timing lamp should have no problem getting me where I need to be?

I have a dial indicator that I MAY be able to rig up to the #1 but it's magnetic base works great on a car... not so much on an Aluminum Bike head. It's also quite a tight fit in there.....

I thought maybe I could just use the line-up dots on the cams and when they are both at their location and I SHOULD be good. But, the cams can also be off if the thing was ever taken apart they may not be a correct representation of where the piston actually IS.

Anyone that has ever COMPLETELY disassembled this ignition pick-up please chime in with any suggestions.....

Thanks,
KURT

[DiverRay]

Just go with the TDC of the #1 piston, and yes, you will need to pull the valve cover to make sure you are on the Intake stroke. Once you have TDC, set the pointer on the TDC mark. This will get you as close as you need to run and use a timing light to get everything in spec.
I used a pencil or small screw driver in the plug hole for #1 to get as close as possible to TDC, and it worked well for me. I was off about 5 degrees, so it would still start and run OK.

[tomcos67]

Just thinking.!

You got the fever!!!!One year and four bikes...Just think next year ,,what will be back there.!!Anyways good luck on all projects. Like reading your posts....

[TopCatGr58]

Hey Kurt,

Take a look at this thread, lots of good pictures and info on determining TRUE TDC. He/TadRacer had a plate base for his dial gauge that he bolted to the head, but you could probably just use a STEEL/IRON Plate drilled to temporarily bolt the head so you could set your magnetic gauge onto while you're rotating the crank back and forth to find the drop zones on both sides of the crank where the piston just ends rising as well as starts dropping again, and then split the degrees difference to find true TDC.

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread...t=degree+wheel

T.C.

[bikerphil]

The reluctor tab should be pointing up towards the 1+4 PU coil when the cam dots are at their marks and the crank is at TDC. As you probably know, the reluctor assembly can be inadvertently installed 180 deg. out.

[kboehringer]

A bit of work to find TRUE TDC...

Take a look at this thread......just use a STEEL/IRON Plate drilled to temporarily bolt the head so you could set your magnetic gauge.....
T.C.

Wow! That guy is detail oriented! I think I can just make a "Little" plate to mount to two of the VC bolt holes. I only need it for the #1 cylinder. I won't be dial indicating all the lobes, etc. Hopefully, I can get this done tomorrow......

The meter test leads (RED) worked very well. My parts guy at work found 50' of silicone coated wire of the same gauge as OEM Yamaha for about $30 from Grainger. Since I now have three of these bikes, and no more spare meter leads, I'm going to get a roll.



Phil, RE: reluctor tab
I noticed when I pulled it apart it could be installed "backwards". I made sure to put it back EXACTLY like I found it. But.... I will check that it points the right direction when I'm checking TDC. Thank you!

As ya'll can see in the photo.... at this time, this may be the only CLEAN are of the motor. It should be a bit more reliable than the orange wire nut the PO installed on poor ole' Mayberry

Respectfully,
KURT

[TopCatGr58]

The meter test leads (RED) worked very well. My parts guy at work found 50' of silicone coated wire of the same gauge as OEM Yamaha for about $30 from Grainger. Since I now have three of these bikes, and no more spare meter leads, I'm going to get a roll.

KURT

Hey Kurt,

With that much wire, you might feel like selling a few feet to folks on here after you get done what you need to do. Very Nice repair. Not sure if you had seen some of the threads about where some folks suggested using some extra length of wire to go around the timing plate, so that when the plate rotates, the wires wouldn't have to flex at such a sharp angle. Just have to route it so that it doesn't rub against the spinning plate.

T.C.

[BA80]

Hey Kurt,

With that much wire, you might feel like selling a few feet to folks on here after you get done what you need to do.
T.C.

Or a link to buy it or at least a part #.

[BA80]

Hey Kurt,

Take a look at this thread, lots of good pictures and info on determining TRUE TDC. He/TadRacer had a plate base for his dial gauge that he bolted to the head, but you could probably just use a STEEL/IRON Plate drilled to temporarily bolt the head so you could set your magnetic gauge onto while you're rotating the crank back and forth to find the drop zones on both sides of the crank where the piston just ends rising as well as starts dropping again, and then split the degrees difference to find true TDC.

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread...t=degree+wheel

T.C.

I bought a dial indicator with a flexible arm that has a set of vice grip type pliers on the end to get mine to TDC and set the pointer. I think it was $35 at Harbor freight.

http://www.harborfreight.com/clampin...tor-93051.html

Had to use a deep1/4" socket to reach into the spark plug hole to the top of the piston and get a reading though.

BTW, don't forget to take the socket out before rotating the engine. It's kind of a bitch fishing that socket out of the cylinder with a pocket magnet.

[kboehringer]

What's this stuff......Wire in oil pan

Hey Kurt,
With that much wire, you might feel like selling a few feet to folks on here after you get done what you need to do.
T.C.

TC,
That's a good idea ,to share it. We don't buy too much from Grainger (we prefer McMaster-Carr) the parts coordinator orders Grainger only once or twice a week or so. He'll be adding my roll of wire to the next order. I should have it within a week.

The parts guy printed out the spec sheet with the numbers & etc. and it's sitting on my desk at work. When I get back to work Monday I'll post up the numbers & a link.

NEW TOPIC: WIRE IN OIL PAN
I pulled the oil pan to see what I could find and found something I didn't want to find....

Anyone have any idea where WIRE would come from? This is not shavings from a bearing it is truly metal wire. Could this be from the clutch?
Thoughts?

KURT