Transmission

[tarzan]

I posted about this in my old thread called pile of parts . IT hasn't garnered much attention, so I figured this may get some advice.
I got the MNS I have been working on back together and running last Sunday. It ran good but the trans wouldn't stay in 1st. And 2nd wasn't much better.
So I pulled it apart. I will post a couple pics here and also a link to the album with all of the pics I took.
I had tough time getting the gears out.I have the bike upside down, and removed everything I could. I finally got it out after about an hour of struggling.
Is there and easy way to line it up to remove?I have to remove the trans from the engine in my shed for parts, and would like to know the secret.I have read the Tech tips and may have missed it.I remember reading a few posts about it before, but can't find them now.
Also, can I use Tri-BOND instead of getting new gaskets for the pan and side covers.or will I have problems doing that. please take a look and offer opinions.





http://s222.photobucket.com/user/tar...y/XS11%20Trans

http://s222.photobucket.com/user/tar...y/XS11%20Trans
star plate bent up

shift fork galled


bad gears

Found this sludgy mess in the pan

[jetmechmarty]

Go here:
http://www.xs11.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=39

[3Phase]

Tarzan,

I have some spare gears, shift forks and other stuff if you need them. Whatever you decide to do I would strongly suggest buying new circlips instead of trying to re-use the old ones; save yourself some grief after you get everything all nicely cleaned, reassembled and buttoned up.

For that dead starfish you need take a close look at the shift pawl and the shift drum:-

Why the shift drum starfish washer breaks

Basically, just getting another washer doesn't fix the problem. You have to find out what caused the problem or you'll be replacing more of them at... inconvenient times and in some truly interesting places.

There isn't much space between the shift pawl and the shift drum washer and its pins. When the shift pawl is worn and/or the circlip on the opposite end of the shift drum is worn (or missing) the shift pawl will flex on its shaft every time you shift and the shift forks will pull the shift drum sideways, sort of.

[BA80]

Those pins get hammered out and the star washer gets bent mostly because of someone trying to hold it in gear when it's chattering and popping out of gear.

Do the dremel fix on 1st and 2nd and do the second gear washer swap. Replace the star washer and I can almost guarantee you'll be golden.

[donebysunday]

Good Work

Hi Guys !

Keep up the good work as I'm soon to be doing this too !

Thanks ! Done };~)

[3Phase]

Greg,

Mine just flat wore the heck out and it flexed during shifts because the hole was semi-sort-of-ovaled. The trans never popped out of gear or chattered and I didn't have to hold it in gear -- ever.

I did the 2nd gear fix preemptively when had to change the starter clutch and deal with a few other items that reared their ugly heads and glared menacingly at me after I naively opened up the engine. I completely missed the worn shift pawl because at the time I had no idea the that it even could wear out or what would happen when it did!


Of course now I know!

[tarzan]

I looked at the shift pawl.The pins look good and the casting is ok.I took the side cover off my spare engine and the plate is good on it as well as the pawl.I will probably use the whole shift drum from it too.I will remove the trans from it tomorrow. Hopefully the gears in the spare will be in better shape. The inside of the spare looks way cleaner than the one I'm working on. I'm half tempted to use the spare motor.But it doesn't have pistons and cylinders, as I gave them to a friend to fix his a few months back.I'd have to use the pistons and jugs from the one I'm working on anyway.

http://s222.photobucket.com/user/tar...y/XS11%20Trans

[DiverRay]

Hey, the trans is EASY to replace. Just ask 3-Phase about Special Ed's trans.... Do the 2nd gear fix on the "spare" trans shaft, and put it in the bike. DONE.

[BA80]

Greg,

Mine just flat wore the heck out and it flexed during shifts because the hole was semi-sort-of-ovaled.

Which hole are you talking about?

[3Phase]

Greg,

It's the one in the middle of the pawl where it mounts to the transmission:



You can see a worn spot at the 'top' of the hole in the picture. It doesn't seem like much wear at all and still looks round by Mark 1 eyeball but it's just enough to let the pawl flex and hit the washer. Eventually it doesn't just hit, it rips the leg(s) up and off the washer.

I started to get all fancy and complicated and measured it sixteen different ways from Sunday to fix the spring arm, re-pin, shim, and sleeve it (No, no, Donald...) before I woke up and dug a good spare out of the shed.

[BA80]

I see what your saying. The pawl jumped out of the shift drum on Ivan's SF once while we were riding and upon investigation it was found the when he put the engine back together he had left a washer/spacer off the shaft behind the oil pump idler gear and was allowing the shaft & pawl slide too far to the shifter side.

Installed that spacer behind the idler and hasn't had an issue since.

[3Phase]

Heh, yeah, that'll happen when you forget those small, insignificant parts!

The thing is, the pawl and the shift drum both normally move a just little bit during a shift. After doing Donald Duck math and digging out the good pawl I found a frog hair shim for the far end of the shift drum that tightened it up so it would last another thirty years. Ehh... nope, you bumped your head there, Scooter!

Run the engine and trans up two-fiddy' degrees F in the desert and trying to play with cold parts and loose shims was not such a good idea. Trying to play with hot parts and tight shims is not much fun either.

[tarzan]

I pulled the countershaft from the spare engine today after work. Wow, what a difference. The spare motor and trans are in great shape. I'm considering doing the washer swap and reinstalling the spare trans and not doing the dremel fix. Please take a look at the pics and offer an opinion.


This is the main gear in the spare motor. Makes me want to use that motor.

[DiverRay]

I it was mine, and I was going to ride it for another 100K miles, I'd STILL do some work with a dremel tool. Back cutting on GOOD gears will be just a little, and probably keep it shifting well for the life of the engine.
That's MY opinion, and it's worth every penny you paid for it.
The swap and install WILL last for quite a while, but it just seems to shift and stay better with the undercut.

[tarzan]

I appreciate the advice. I will go ahead and lightly grind them.