Got defeated this weekend

[trbig]

Service manual.. per rebuild installation procedure in quotes.

6. Rotate the crankshaft approximately 45* and align the "C" mark on timing plate with the timing pointer.

As per paragragh one... in order...

"He put the timing on mark on the C"

7. Compress the cam chain tensioner and lock in the retracted position.

"...removed the tensioner, pushed the plunger in all the way..."

8. Install the chain tensioner to the engine and torque the bolts to specification.

"...re-installed..."

9. Release the tensioner holding bolt, an audible click will be heard when the tensioner is released.

"...loosened the set screw and heard a "click", "

10. Torque the holding bolt and lock nut to the specifications.

"...then tightened it down."


Any verbal abuse you may have felt may be due to you coming on here and starting off sounding like a pompous azz, when it seemed pretty obvious to everyone that you really have no clue of what works and what doesn't with these bikes.. at least when it comes to the adjuster or cam installation/removal. While I will admit that I have never seen the part about actually pushing the plunger in all the way before installing it for an adjustment, I had only heard of doing from on here. This certainly does not "put undo stress on the chain" as you stated. If you would take a motor or two apart, you'll also find that the book isn't right in several places on procedure or sequence.. but in this case, I'm really not sure what it is you're getting at or why you keep posting, other than to be a PITA.

While the proper procedure for adjustment is to simply loosen the set screw, you will not hear any "Click" that way, so most people remove the tensioner and follow the procedure for installation to be sure they are getting the plunger against the adjuster bar. The reason Bohn removed his tensioner was because he had a small oil leak out of the tip which had previously been fixed, and he was trying to keep the couple drips of oil off his motor so he could continue to be able to eat off of it if desired.

I was told by a moderator yesterday to ignore your comments and let sleeping dogs lie... but aparently that isn't possible. I doubt even this will be the final say. BUT... if you have something of value to add, this is an open forum.

Tod

[Wildkat]

Gentlemen...

as entertaining as this thread has been... I've run out of popcorn...
and considering it is becoming more personal than beneficial at times... please keep comments to the subject at hand and refrain from making this a personal battle ground...

Thank you and have a great day

[wa407mpp]

I've have not said anything derogatory about any one's ability or their knowledge of these bikes, also I'm not the one acting with a closed mind to other peoples suggestions. In fact, I was talking about what trbig said in the first paragraph and what the owner did or more importantly, didn't do that caused his problem. By the mixing of two different but related procedures, adjusting the cam chain and installing the cam chain adjuster. My last post was to give everyone a chance to figure it out for themselves and see if they would come up with the same answer, giving them a chance to think out side the box, and have some fun. Now as for my knowledge of bikes and how to work on them, I have over 45 years with bikes, over 30 of them as a privateer.

[Bigfoot]

My last post was to give everyone a chance to figure it out for themselves and see if they would come up with the same answer, giving them a chance to think out side the box, and have some fun.

If you think that you know what went wrong, please just say so instead of just keeping us in suspense. You basically replied to this thread with "you are doing it wrong" while never saying exactly what you thought was done wrong or giving advice on how to do it right. The closest you came was saying to read the instructions in the book, which obviously has been done. I don't blame Tod for getting a little irritated.

[trbig]

By the mixing of two different but related procedures, adjusting the cam chain and installing the cam chain adjuster.

That's just it.. therer wasn't a "Mixing" of procedures. Both procedures tightens your cam chain. By removing the tensioner and re-installing, you can be assured that the tensioner popped all the way out by listening for the click. By simply loosening the set screw/bolt, you will get no click and won't know if the adjuster plunger had a burr on it and that kept it from extending any further. That's why most people remove it.. then re-install it according to the manual.. which will not put any undue tensions on a chain.

You are simply looking for spring tension from the adjuster onto the guide bar. By a simple adjustement without removing the tensioner, by removing the tensioner, compressing the adjuster plunger and re-installing, to leaving the plunger extended fully but loose... will all get the desired effect without anything getting too tight. The only one I see that can be a problem would be the proper simple adjustment due to the set screw/bolt putting burrs on the pl;unger shaft or bending it. The only way to know it has fully extended.. is one of the other two methods.

Tod

[Ivan]

Kat always runs out of popcorn when things start getting good.

[Wildkat]

Well... I did have an offer for someone to buy me some more...

[Crazcnuk]

Funny part is, when I did mine, I followed that procedure EXACTLY, as the other dozen times I have adjusted or replaced the tensioners, and it DIDN'T WORK!



9. Release the tensioner holding bolt, an audible click will be heard when the tensioner is released.

"...loosened the set screw and heard a "click", "


Quote:
10. Torque the holding bolt and lock nut to the specifications.

"...then tightened it down."

Then cranked the motor, spun the cam chain 160deg

Then loosened set screw AGAIN, heard 2nd, louder audible click.

Then pushed bike into junk pile.

All for about $.35 worth of engineering and materials, and this all the cam chain slipping would be impossible...

[Thee_oddball]

is is at all possible that this is a 2 fold problem consisting of worn teeth and chain causing the slip under load?

[Winterhawk]

The tensioner probably needs to be drilled and a Helli coil put in place to hold the bolt tighter. I'd use red lock-tight on the Helli coil maybe to lock it in place. Maybe the chian has strtched some. How long has it been since new cam chain was put in it?

[Korr]

"Kat always runs out of popcorn when things start getting good."
dammit lol coke came right out of my nose!!

Man...out of the three times that i have adjusted my cam chain tensioner it scares the crap outta me knowing what could possibly happen

I feel bad, hope you guys figure it out soon

[John]

Here's what I know about it.

The work Tod did on Bohn's bike was done in my garage with my tools, and it was on my hoist. I was assisting him. I was right there when he timed the cams to the crank shaft, after reshimming some of the valves. Many were too tight. He had pulled the tensioner, and Bohn disassembled it, expecting to find a burr on the shaft, but there was none. In fact it looked new. The threads for the lock bolt were not stripped. The tensioner plunger moved smoothly throughout it's entire length, and when it was reinstalled it made full contact with the back of the chain. All seemed well, but as soon as the engine was rotated, the timing jumped.
After a few attempts at timing it that first evening, I took a mirror and a bright light and was able to clearly see that the chain was indeed on the crank sprocket. We both verified that by looking down into the cam chain cavity, and we could see that the chain was in place. I had also noticed that when everything was in time, and the tensioner installed and set, there was a lot of slack in the back side of the chain. The only thing I could think of was either excessive chain stretch, or the rear portion of the cam chain guide had broken away. The bike is a well cared for, low miler, and I don't believe that the chain had stretched that much.
And to anyone that questions Tod ability to go through one of these engines, I have been present when a good portion of those overhauls were done, as he would come to my place to do a lot of the jobs, and he also had a couple split apart doing a second gear grind, or a set of main bearings during both of the Meeting of the Minds gathering, which has been held at my house for the past two years. Just recently we did some work for another member, who trailered his bike from New Orleans to my house to have us (Tod) work on it. The owners previous mechanic was Bob Jones, so if the owner thought enough of Tod's work to trailer it that far to have him work on it, then he must be pretty good. He may not be the best electrical guy for these bikes, but he knows the drive train. The electrical problems I handle.

[Bigfoot]

I had a scare 2 days ago with my tensioner. Took off on the bike in the morning and went about 15 miles. Slowed down for a light and noticed a pretty good rattle. Luckily I had the original tool kit with me and was able to adjust it in a parking lot. All seemed well and sounded right. Not sure what caused it to loosen all of the sudden, the locknut was still snug. Luckily it didn't seem to skip time or do any damage.

[Ivan]

Harry, it'll get REALLY loud before it starts slipping. Sounds like a bolt cut loose in the engine. You probably werent in any danger...

[trbig]

I heard from Bohn. He says that all his intake valves were bent. Thinking it may have happened on the last fire up. Otherwise, the tight clearances don't make much sense. BUT.. I sent him with enough valves from my and Cody's stash to get the job done. He didn't mention anything else wrong at this point, so the mystery is still there??


Tod