I am stumped

[dbeardslee]

I may fully disassemble the carbs and ultra sonic clean them with lacquer thinner but I need to research that first to make sure I am not making a bomb in my garage. I could of course run the machine in the yard. I do know that some people do use flammable cleaners in these units.
Rob

I'm not sure what lacquer thinner will do to the rubber parts that are in the carbs. You've had two sets of carbs on the bike, and each one has exhibited the missing problem. With the fix on the butterfly the situation improved, but you've still got some issues. To me that suggests that you probably had multiple issues.

I had an issue with Betsy some years back and I was convinced it was the carbs. Backfiring, rough idle, stumble at low rpms, etc. So I opened up the carbs and tweaked on 'em five times. Then I found out the problem was bad coils.

I'm not saying your coils are bad - I'm just saying you can get buck feaver on carbs, but if they're not the problem then they're not going to fix the problem either. I would adjust them, and I'd definitely see what the colortune has to say, but I don't think I'd clean them again after all the cleaning they've already had.

I'd start with a DMM and check the resistances and the voltages at the TCI. I'd also take a real good look a the wires under the timing cover. My brother had an issue with a bad miss in his about a month ago. It was intermittent, and his resistances to the pickup coils looked good. But in checking the wires under the timing cover I found one with the insulation rubbed off just enough to expose the core. That wire would move around, and every now and then it would make contact with metal and short out the pickup. I had to really feel around on those wires to find it.

Your mention of the neutral indicator kind of made me think of that. IIRC there's a splice in the lines under that gold colored sheath that runs out of the timing cover. There's also a hole in the sheath where the neutral switch wire goes in, and I've had oil get down inside that sheath before and cause issues. Might not be a bad idea to check those connections. JAT

[79XS11F]

I may fully disassemble the carbs and ultra sonic clean them with lacquer thinner but I need to research that first to make sure I am not making a bomb in my garage. I could of course run the machine in the yard. I do know that some people do use flammable cleaners in these units.
Rob

[79XS11F]

What do your plugs look like after the carb butterfly fix and running it around a bit?

They are inconsistent at best with #2 looking the richest. I'm going to grab new plugs today and put the color tune plugs in her to see what's up
Rob

[dbeardslee]

What do your plugs look like after the carb butterfly fix and running it around a bit?

[79XS11F]

I went for a run around the outskirts of the city yesterday evening after dark and the bike runs pretty good but still needs some work as she is running rather rich. She sounds like a bike with a jetting problem that would occur after putting a header on it. When I down shift or back off the throttle I can hear unburned fuel igniting in the mufflers so the timing must be off just a tad or the occasional miss is putting fuel into the exhaust system.
I also noticed that the neutral light is dimly illuminated without blinking. and I don't recall that from the past.
If the neutral light is dimly illuminated there must be an electrical leak somewhere in the system so I will have to track that down. Any ideas as to where that might occur? Maybe that is related to the miss I am still experiencing. I know that the neutral light lead does come out of the timing cover so perhaps this is a clue to the missing issue.
Rob

[madmax-im]

That is awesome news Rob...glad you stuck with it...I always thought this was a carb issue...

[Blank Slate]

Congrats Rob! After I pass my safety course in two weeks I'll insure my bike and drive down the road see you

[79XS11F]

Just in from a quick around the neighborhood test run that includes speeds up to 120 KM/HR and she is running pretty good. Still the occasional miss but she is for sure running rich. I can hear her babbling in the mufflers when coming off throttle. Idle managed to get up to 1500 once she was fully warmed up so I had to dial that back to 1100 and the RPMs seem to float a little when the throttle is released.
Rob

[s63921c]

congrats

Congratulations on finding the solution! I've been wondering what became of your issue...and great job in persevering to track it down and not give up! And thank you to all you guys that know and share so much of your knowledge and experience with these bikes-I would have sold mine long ago if it weren't for you all being so helpful. This forum is exceptional in my book. Thanks for sharing what you found!

[IanDMacDonald]

I just learned at the shop a few weeks ago about machined washers for a designed spec., so now I know what you mean by a "perfect" washer.

[79XS11F]

The issue has been found, corrected and the bike is idling pretty good with the carb sync done. There's still an occasion back fire as compared to a miss and I will look into that when the season is done.
So the "ghost in the machine" was this space between the end of the shaft and the washer on the spring side of the carb. The space is just wide enough for the spring to slip into and jam it up enough to prevent full closing of the butterfly valve.
To fix it I loosened off the Butterfly screws, remove the fold over washer and nut from the opposite side of the shaft, slid the shaft over that much and used a washer to make up the space on the other side. It's not a "perfect" washer so that bolt is now firm hand tight and held in place by the fold over washer.

[79XS11F]

Hey Rob,

It's not just that they are JIS, but also...I'm sure you know this, moreso stating for other newbies that may read this thread....the ends of the screws are PEENED to keep them from working loose and getting sucked into the engine. SO.....you'll need to use your dremmel to remove the peened portion of the screws before trying to loosent them....should allow you to loosen them easier and even with STANDARD philips driver. You'll just want to use some RED locktite when you put them back in.....or get some new ones so you can PEEN them again!?

T.C.

I knew they are peened but I was under the impression that they could be loosened just not removed without cutting the heads ends off.

[natemoen]

J-apenese I-ndustrial Steel

Make that Japanese Industrial Standard

[mack]

cheaper option

take a small drill bit and just deepen the hole a tad in center of the philips X

[CaptonZap]

Yeah I know they are different. I will ether have to go out and buy a JIS driver or find my best fit Philips and grind the tip down a bit. They are always shallower then true Philips and I really don't want to damage them.
For those who don't know, when you see a Philips screw and there is a single dot or sometimes an X on the head of the screw, it indicates that the screw is JIS which I think stands for Japanese Industry Standard. It's slightly different then a Philips.
Rob

The $1.99 on sale 4 in 1 blue handled screwdrivers at Habba Fleight are just what you need for those screws.

http://www.harborfreight.com/4-in-1-...dle-69470.html

CZ