No neutral issue need help

[Itsdamadhatter]

78 xs11 E
Sorry beforehand on the long post but I want to make this clear as possible.




Ok some history of it.....
I've put 700 miles on it since I purchased it and it runs very healthy.
I've changed all fluids and did valve shim job. It has a pop in the exhuast if I downshift that I figured the valve shims would have corrected but may its a carb thing. But it runs great....

Now the issue....
Fired it up, idle for few minutes. Me and a friend getting gear on.sitting on it ready to go in neutral cluth out, I rev up two times kinda low and then one fairly high rev, not the max but up there. The bike makes a squeel kinda noise and lunges forward, still in neutral, I quickly killed power and check if I **** myself.

Now bike off I shift to 1 and then back to neutral and try to roll the bike, negative it goes a foot back and forth. Try to shift up gears and it only lets me if I roll the bike at the same time. So I pull the clutch, start the bike and it drives.... In neutral..... So I shift to 2 and it goes bat**** crazy and stalls.

So I pulled the clutch off the bike and attempt to roll it which it does so I cleaned the plates and put it all back together nope still stuck. The clutch housing touches two gears one up top I believe is the main drive gear and a small one which I'm unsure of. This small one rotates the same as the bike allows me to roll it, a little one way then it stops and the same the other way.

So now what should I go for I'm lost.

[DGXSER]

First, lets see if I can clear up for you the gears your seeing.



The green arrow points to the oil pump idler gear. The larger gear it meshes with is the oil pump. With the clutch out, as in this photo, the pump and gear should turn easily.

The gear in the upper right corner also meshes with the clutch basket and it is the primary shaft. It gets driven directly by the crankshaft Hyvo chain. So it will not turn easily, however, if you remove the timing cover on the left side and turn the engine by hand, it will also turn. So, with the clutch removed, your transmission is separated form the engine and will turn freely no matter the gear your in when the rear wheel is turned. You will also see the shaft the clutch mounts on turn when the transmission is in gear. If it is truly in Neutral, you can turn the rear wheel and that shaft the clutch mounts to will NOT turn.

Based upon your description, that shaft turns when you believe your bike is in neutral. So, my next best guess is to remove the shift cover on the left side of the engine and check for alignment of the shift pawls and the shift drum.



In this photo you see the shift pawls with their dots aligned (look close for the dots). You will also see a line at the top on the lever of the shift pawl mechanism that rotates the shift drum. You may also be able to see in the eight o-clock position the line on the shift drum that should align with the line in the lever when the transmission is in second gear. Go ahead and put the transmission in second gear before you open the cover to see if they are lined up when you open it.

[Itsdamadhatter]

It's the green arrow so yeah the pump only spins back and forth a few inches but never a full rotation. But next I will pull the other housing off and check it out.

With the pump not spinning though is that gear only to the pump meaning I may have locked it up

[DGXSER]

Yes, that lower gear is strictly the oil pump. However, it is REALLY uncommon for that to have any problems at all.

You could try pulling the idler gear off, it is held on by the C-clip on the end of the shift fork shaft. But that gear should also turn really easy, it just spins on that shaft.

[Itsdamadhatter]

Idler gear spins free if I remove the c clip and slight it out a slight amount soon as it goes back tight it binds again only in one spot and its strange because the teeth are perfect.... The shifter housing looks fine I don't know if it was off adjustment though. The shifter peg side came off with the cover... So I put the dots together and reassembled.

[Itsdamadhatter]

After shifting thru and watching that triangle thing rotate nuetral is pointing to 1 o'clock and second is 12 o'clock

[DGXSER]

Does it shift through all the gears, and work as it should now? You will need to rotate the wheel a little to get the tranny to shift between gears with it not running. But is neutral now neutral, does not turn the shaft the clutch mounts on?

[Itsdamadhatter]

Nope I can shift thru all gears but no nuetral so I guess gonna have to pull the trans right

[BA80]

That doesn't seem to make sense. If 1st and 2nd gear work properly you have to shift THROUGH neutral to get from one to the other.

[DGXSER]

So it will shift through all five gears, but not stop in Neutral? Or is stops in "neutral" the sixth gear so to speak, only the clutch shaft still turns with the wheel?

[motoman]

Idler gear spins free if I remove the c clip and slight it out a slight amount soon as it goes back tight it binds again only in one spot and its strange because the teeth are perfect.... The shifter housing looks fine I don't know if it was off adjustment though. The shifter peg side came off with the cover... So I put the dots together and reassembled.

Possibly made enough bad or 'hot-rod' speed shifts to pop the other cir-clip behind the idler gear, and possibly bent that roll pin over that indexes the fork slider shaft. From the left side, does that small shaft move back and forth......enough that pawl shaft where the alignment dots are comes disengaged with other dot alignment piece? If so, the clutch side has had either that cir-clip come off(or missing) and possibly the roll pin that indexes the shaft damaged. (BTW, you pull enough speed shifts, guarentee this is whats gonna happen,DAHIK. Another thing, make sure that shifter spring on the shifter shaft is rotated correctly preloading the shifter. If shifter lever is floppy with no tension or preload on it you have the spring installed incorrectly or its 'sprung' life is shot. Be nice to hear a report back what you find wrong.

[BA80]

When you say you put in neutral, or at least where it should be, does the green neutral light come on?

[jjz28]

Sorry, I couldn't delete a post I made so had to edit it.

[Itsdamadhatter]

I get the nuetral light but its as the bike has 6 gears.... The shifter tension is fine. I've never had any issues getting thru gears prior to this, no hard shifts but I have shifted up thru gears a few times without pulling the clutch but it was low speed and I let off the throttle to do it.

[Itsdamadhatter]

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