I don't think my brake pads are supposed to look like this (pics) lol

[JeremyL]

I traded a Honda CBR for my XS11 a couple of Summers ago and have spent the last 2 years (in what little spare time I have) undoing all the idiotic stuff the previous owner did wrong to the bike. Anyways, I won't list all those things but let's just say that my XS11, which was supposed to be "ready to ride" and "basically restored" has taken about $700 in parts and hours and hours of my labor and it's still nothing special.

Anyways, as long as I've owned it I thought "boy this thing sure is heavy, it's hard to even back up or even to push forward." Coming from a 600cc sport bike I was sure that was why. And because of all the work I've been doing to get the bike road worthy I probably didn't ride more than 15-20 min at a time until this year. But I was riding last week and after an hour long ride or so I was parking and noticed it felt like the bike was just rolling so much better as I came to a step... like being in neutral and rolling to a stop versus being in 1st revved up where the gearing will hold you back. When I stopped I was able to push the bike around with easy and it finally hit me -- the brakes were dragging. Finally figured out it was the front and pulled the calipers off. The pics below show what I saw:



This is one side of the front. The other is the same way. I'm pretty sure the pads aren't supposed to be angled like that but I don't know what the problem would be. Is it a wheel spacing issue or the wrong pads or what? And obviously I didn't put the pads on, the previous owner did, and I'm sure he screwed it up by putting something on backwards or by leaving a part off. But I would've thought if it was going to wear at that much of an angle it wouldn't have even went together properly in the first place.

Here is the bolt I pulled from the caliper, with the spacers and stuff in the order that they were on the bolt:

[bikerphil]

The pads are supposed to be like that, replace that bolt if it is bent. Dragging brakes are caused by dirty brake fluid gumming up the master cylinder fluid return hole and/or crystalized brake fluid behind the caliper piston seals.

[Rasputin]

They are supposed to be that way. You can clean the caliper piston seals and lube the brake parts that are supposed to swivel which will help with drag but the angles on those pads will be there on brand new ones. Only on specials too.

[JeremyL]

The pads are supposed to be like that, replace that bolt if it is bent. Dragging brakes are caused by dirty brake fluid gumming up the master cylinder fluid return hole and/or crystalized brake fluid behind the caliper piston seals.

Wow now I feel dumb. When I saw the pads I was like AH-HA because I've never seen any brake pads on a car or a bike (although I've only owned like 5 bikes before) like that. At first I thought you were being sarcastic. I kept staring at the wheel and caliper trying to figure out how else to put them together.


Also, since you mentioned the dirty brake fluid (and since my pads are apparently okay) I actually got the front brake fluid cover off just this past weekend AFTER TWO YEARS of trying. The screws are in poor shape and I was afraid I would strip the heads of the screws as I did with 2 other older bike I had before. I got a proper fitting screw driver, pushed down HARD, and took my time and they all 4 loosened up. The fluid was pretty rough looking but I've seen worse. I was planning on replacing it anyways. The level feels very firm so I'm hoping I won't have to rebuild the MC although I've rebuilt a few on older bikes from the 70/80s that I had and it was easy. Maybe I'll get away with just changing the fluid. Glad I check with you guys on the pads I was ready to order another set.

And you weren't just messing with me right?

[JeremyL]

They are supposed to be that way. You can clean the caliper piston seals and lube the brake parts that are supposed to swivel which will help with drag but the angles on those pads will be there on brand new ones. Only on specials too.

I didn't realize the pads were cut at that angle until I took them off and was actually taking them off to lube all the parts, hoping it'd help with the dragging. I have a 97 F-150 that had a stuck front brake and simply cleaning and lubing the brake parts and pads fixed it.

Also, I took a flat head screw driver, when the brakes were sticking earlier, and carefully pried at the front pads, away from the disc. I could easily push the bike back and forth... but after I squeezed the brake lever it went back dragging bad until I used the screw driver on it again.

So maybe between cleaning the calipers and greasing everything plus replacing this nasty fluid my dragging might be fixed. Probably get a few mpg out of it too haha.

What specifically needs to be lubed? The pins and the backs of the pads? Anything else?

[bikerphil]

No we aren't messing with you, many have thought the same thing you did about the tapered brake pads. Take the bolt spacer out of the calipers and grease them and you should be good to go. Flush the old fluid out and bleed and you may get lucky without a total system cleaning.

[JeremyL]

No we aren't messing with you, many have thought the same thing you did about the tapered brake pads. Take the bolt spacer out of the calipers and grease them and you should be good to go. Flush the old fluid out and bleed and you may get lucky without a total system cleaning.

Awesome, thanks for the help guys. I definitely wouldn't have been able to redo this bike without this website -- probably would've ended up junking it or selling it cheap. I'll try lubing them and changing fluid and will report back.

One last question, DOT3 only or can I use DOT3 or 4? I thought DOT5 was all synthetic so I guess I don't need that.

[Tat2demon]

Strange, mine are flat. No taper.

[Courtney]

Your biggest grief will be the brake fluid and the little tiny return hole in the MC. The sediment in the old brake fluid blocks the return hole so you can put the brakes on, but fluid can't return to let the brakes off. Take the MC off and completely clean it out, maybe buying a rebuild kit if the original is looking ugly. Clean out all your lines and take your calipers apart carefully and clean the pistons all up, use brake grease to put the caliper seals back in carefully. I've done this a number of times and if done carefully you're good to go. It's the MC return hole that's giving you trouble. And no need to feel dumb, it's a new bike to you, you gotta learn sometime. Use Dot 3.

[DGXSER]

Don't feel bad Jeremy. One of my very first post on this forum was to ask the same question regarding brake pads on my first SH. I saw those pads and thought WTF!! How in the hates does this happen?? Only to find, like you, and I believe from the same source, BikerPhil, that I was viewing almost new factory pads.

One of those things where you can not help but wonder who was smoking what when they conceived those things.

Nate, those tapered pads are only for the Special owners....owners of the special model that is. The read brakes on the special, and all three on the Standard models are normal straight cut pads.

[JeremyL]

Your biggest grief will be the brake fluid and the little tiny return hole in the MC. The sediment in the old brake fluid blocks the return hole so you can put the brakes on, but fluid can't return to let the brakes off. Take the MC off and completely clean it out, maybe buying a rebuild kit if the original is looking ugly. Clean out all your lines and take your calipers apart carefully and clean the pistons all up, use brake grease to put the caliper seals back in carefully. I've done this a number of times and if done carefully you're good to go. It's the MC return hole that's giving you trouble. And no need to feel dumb, it's a new bike to you, you gotta learn sometime. Use Dot 3.

Thanks for explaining it, that makes total sense about the return hole being plugged.

Don't feel bad Jeremy. One of my very first post on this forum was to ask the same question regarding brake pads on my first SH. I saw those pads and thought WTF!! How in the hates does this happen?? Only to find, like you, and I believe from the same source, BikerPhil, that I was viewing almost new factory pads.

One of those things where you can not help but wonder who was smoking what when they conceived those things.

Nate, those tapered pads are only for the Special owners....owners of the special model that is. The read brakes on the special, and all three on the Standard models are normal straight cut pads.

I wonder what the idea was behind the tapered pads? Surely it was out of necessity because the Special forks or something left them with no option. I also wondered about how the pads wouldn't have to be replaced more often since the low side of the pad would obviously have less material and would be closer to wearing out than a regular pad -- unless they made even the thinnest part as thick as a regular straight pad. Oh welli tend to ask too many questions.

[Tat2demon]

Don't feel bad Jeremy. One of my very first post on this forum was to ask the same question regarding brake pads on my first SH. I saw those pads and thought WTF!! How in the hates does this happen?? Only to find, like you, and I believe from the same source, BikerPhil, that I was viewing almost new factory pads.

One of those things where you can not help but wonder who was smoking what when they conceived those things.

Nate, those tapered pads are only for the Special owners....owners of the special model that is. The read brakes on the special, and all three on the Standard models are normal straight cut pads.

Ah gotcha. I would like to find the engineer that thought changing every part between the models was a good idea and give him a good smack upside the head.

[Tat2demon]

I also wondered about how the pads wouldn't have to be replaced more often since the low side of the pad would obviously have less material and would be closer to wearing out than a regular pad -- unless they made even the thinnest part as thick as a regular straight pad. Oh welli tend to ask too many questions.

It looks to be the same thickness on the small end as my standard pads do.

[DGXSER]

The reason for the taper is to account for the misalignment of the caliper with the disc. Really though, the front calipers on the Specials have a single mounting bolt through the caliper in the vertical. So the caliper rotates on this single bolt and it seems with the distance form the center of the wheel and the ability to add metal and weight to the fork, the mounting point is a shorter distance than required for the caliper to hit the rotor squarely like it does on the Standard models (and every other vehicle I have ever seen ). So to allow the pads to hit the rotor correctly, they are tapered like that.

Does make you wonder about the forces being applied at an angle to the pads wearing surface though and how that effects the braking.

[fredintoon]

Wow now I feel dumb. When I saw the pads I was like AH-HA because I've never seen any brake pads on a car or a bike (although I've only owned like 5 bikes before) like that. At first I thought you were being sarcastic. I kept staring at the wheel and caliper trying to figure out how else to put them together.


Also, since you mentioned the dirty brake fluid (and since my pads are apparently okay) I actually got the front brake fluid cover off just this past weekend AFTER TWO YEARS of trying. The screws are in poor shape and I was afraid I would strip the heads of the screws as I did with 2 other older bike I had before. I got a proper fitting screw driver, pushed down HARD, and took my time and they all 4 loosened up. The fluid was pretty rough looking but I've seen worse. I was planning on replacing it anyways. The level feels very firm so I'm hoping I won't have to rebuild the MC although I've rebuilt a few on older bikes from the 70/80s that I had and it was easy. Maybe I'll get away with just changing the fluid. Glad I check with you guys on the pads I was ready to order another set.

And you weren't just messing with me right?

Hi Jeremy,
at least you ain't as dumb as me. I had the same WTF? moment when I first got my XS11SG but unlike yourself, I didn't ask, I tossed the pads and ordered a new set.
Discolored old brake fluid will still work so long as it hasn't gone lumpy but the new clear stuff works better.