It was all good until....

[TopCatGr58]

So I talked my buddy into buying a 80 xs11 and 36 hours later, bad news. He got it home yesterday at noon, I went over to admire his purchace, went to get fluids and some seafoam, applied a boost and it was alive. A little sputtering and a few pops and backfies until it was warmed up, then it ran like a champ.

Hey Brad, as has been stated, have your friend use the CONTACT US email link at the bottom of the page, and have him just provide his preferred USERNAME and PASSWORD, along with the year/model of his bike and I'll get him registered!

Now, as was mentioned, you didn't say what condition the bike he got was in, but being in CANADA, it may have sat for at least the winter if not longer, hence your need to get Seafoam and "fluids". These bikes ARE reliable once they have received the proper maintenance, and a dash sea foam and changing the engine oil isn't anywhere near enough, especially with a bike that has sat for any length of time!

You've received troubleshooting info regarding the electrical system, does sound like a weak battery and or/also charging system, but if the grounds...not just the one at the battery to frame, but the other at the bottom/back of the engine to the frame are not conducting it won't charge properly anyways. Also, the collection of wires that are bolted to the Reg/Rect under the gastank, as well as the reg/rect body to frame contact also, plenty of places for corrosion. Also check the large white plugs BEHIND the fuseblock panel which are the ALT plugs to the harness, again corrosion, can get hot and melt!!! And replace the OEM Glass fuses if present with solid Atco style, I know where you can get a decent fuseholder! See For Sale forum, Parts, Sticky thread parts/services by members..scroll down you'll see it, no extra charge to Canada!

Next, please read or have him read the tech tips regarding the cam chain tensioner adjustment procedure and proceed to perform that slowly and carefully. The end cap can be sealed with a variety of techniques, a temporary one for now, then you can order the replacement plug for the proper repair. FOLKS here will tell you/him to get an AUTOmatic tensioner, but IF the OEM hasn't been damaged(overtightened and threads stripped) it will still work properly.

There's a thread in the MISC forum that will tell him what to look for in a neglected XS11 and that should be addressed before any amount of riding to bring the bike back into proper reliable and safe condition!

T.C.

[Brad]

Great Point

The plug is just there to attempt to stop oil drips. The spring cannot come out through there it is on the inside.

So as we were working this afternoon, I was posting during our coffee breaks, etc... We took the tensioner out to find out that the above quote is true...We used a scope and looked inside the hole where the cam tensioner is and seen the chain. We pressed the tensioner by hand and it did have resistance. The chain looked crooked to us, by the top being closer to the clutch side and the bottom being closer to the throttle side. The chain was not twisted crooked, just looked on an angle. We never got into the top yet.

[Brad]

Condition

This has been a good attempt at a full resto, except the motor and transmission. Painted frame, sand blasted and repainted wheels, tank re done inside, new berings everywhere, new forks, headlight.....Looks good, makes mine look like an old shoe. PO said it was his commute vehicle and never took it on the highway. It did sit for 4 months and was in a heated garage.

[Lbrown311]

strange that it would have issues then. the initial problem defiately sounds like an electrical issue. old electric gets bad inevitably. a good carb clean never hurts anything tho. i am in the process of figuring out this whole electrical monster as I just bought a 79F and the PO tried to make it Fuel injection so there is almost nothing on the bike that is original electrically. Good luck to you two. I have tried talkin several friends into getting one of these bikes as well. I hope I don't talk someone into getting into a bummer bike either Hope you can figure it all out.

[Brad]

Battery seems to be good

We just put a meter on the battery and its 11.63v after sitting for 2 days. Seems that something might be binding the motor making it too hard to turn over with just a motorcycle battery..

[DAVINCI]

Yeah,

It's the grounds.

[James England]

Yeah,

It's the grounds.

There's nothing about this so far which indicates this can be said with such certainty. The grounds may or may not be the issue but there are many other possibilities which need to be checked too. Faults like this have many potential causes and repeated "it's the grounds" won't help the guy, methinks. We've heard metallic chain dragging sounds, a motor which may or may not have a slipped or dropped camchain, running low/out of fuel and a concerned owner.

If you insist on saying "it's the grounds", at least point out to the guy where they are eh?.....

[CaptonZap]

We just put a meter on the battery and its 11.63v after sitting for 2 days. Seems that something might be binding the motor making it too hard to turn over with just a motorcycle battery..

Resting voltage of the battery after a day or two should be 12.5 to 12.85. Sounds like you need to check the health of your battery, or check for stray draws that are slowly draining it. CZ

[DAVINCI]

OK, James. I'll shut up now.

[James England]

OK, James. I'll shut up now.

Aw shucks, don't be like that. I wasn't trying to make you shut up or be unpleasant. All I meant was..... just saying "it's the grounds" isn't exactly helpful, you know? I mean, it's only slightly better than responding "it's the engine". I think everyone needs to remember that many XSives aren't as experienced as others... some don't know what 'ground' is (in many countries it's called an 'earth') or, if they do, where they actually are on the bike. When someone has a fault, they need specific help or diagnosis rather than a general, sweeping kind of statement. That's all I meant. Pax

[Danny Crawdad]

We just put a meter on the battery and its 11.63v after sitting for 2 days. Seems that something might be binding the motor making it too hard to turn over with just a motorcycle battery..

Brad, that's not a good reading, the resting voltage should definitely be north of 12v, more like 12.5 and up. Put a voltmeter on the battery and hit the starter on the bike, I bet you see a drop below or close to 10v once you add a load. Likely has a bad cell.

I chased problems around and around with what I thought were electrical shorts draining the battery, I re-ran grounds, cleaned connectors, and despite all my efforts to make it not be so, I still had a bad battery . Even jumping the thing off with the bad battery in it wouldn't work most of the time, because the battery acted as a sink. It would get me from point A to point B and would crank the bike (albeit slowly). I ran it like this for months trying to find the "other" problems.

Stupid thing was a brand new $$$ Allstate AGM battery. I even had two auto stores run full tests on it, and it tested good both times. I replaced it with a $50 Autozone battery and it's worked great since.

You can really easily test the grounds by clamping jumper cables to the negative terminal on one end, and then to the engine block on the other.

Oh, and a bad battery can make the starter make some weird sounds, as it's not getting enough current to work properly. Sounds like a chain rattling.

[TopCatGr58]

This has been a good attempt at a full resto, except the motor and transmission. Painted frame, sand blasted and repainted wheels, tank re done inside, new berings everywhere, new forks, headlight.....Looks good, makes mine look like an old shoe. PO said it was his commute vehicle and never took it on the highway. It did sit for 4 months and was in a heated garage.

Well, I would think you would be able to look up what the mileage was when he registered it, but I don't know what info is recorded in Canada? But using it for just local commuting and not highway could actually be not so good, because just putting around town, it might not have had a chance to get properly warmed up to full operating temps to help keep the carbon from building up, rings getting stuck and such!

Other's have commented on the still suspect battery! I'm concerned with that fact that you actually took out the CCT without first getting into the top valve cover. I hope the bike is on the centerstand? I don't think the chain runs exactly down the middle of the engine, so it being slightly off to one side up high and to the other down low isn't necessarily anything diagnostic. IF the chain has a lot of slack in it, then taking the CCT off could put him at a little more risk of the chain NOW dropping around the crank sprocket and getting a tooth off! ALso, did you follow the CCT adjustment procedure BEFORE removing the CCT, putting the engine into the proper "C" mark position on the timing plate? You will want to put the CCT back in before you attempt to rotate the crank/cams at all! ! ! !

While you have the CCT out, use a sharpie, mark the position of the lock bolt against the flat of the plunger shaft, then loosen the lock bolt/nut, and allow the plunger to extend out to see how much farther it comes out, this will show you how much more slack you can adjust for before the chain is considered too stretched and should be replaced.

Again, I hope you've downloaded the manuals from Catatonic Bug's links?
T.C.

[Brad]

Latest update....

Today we took the valve cover off and seen that the chain is still intact and there is good tension. However, looking at the camshafts, the front sprocket markings appear to be horizontal and the back sprocket markings are about 45 degrees. I will try to get a picture.

[trdriver71]

Today we took the valve cover off and seen that the chain is still intact and there is good tension. However, looking at the camshafts, the front sprocket markings appear to be horizontal and the back sprocket markings are about 45 degrees. I will try to get a picture.

What do you mean by sprocket marking as there are dots on the camshaft the line up with the cam bearing caps?

[motoman]

From your #17 posting, hopefully the bike was on the centerstand. If it wasn't, chances are fair to good that next time engine is turned over, bent valves WILL exist. Your later post pertaining to the cam locations lead even more to suspect, even if your not exactly sure what your lookin' at. Doing the cam chain adjuster removal, even as easy as it is, WILL cost you a top-end if those new to the bike fail to pay attention to DETAIL given here in the removal/instalation or adjustment procedure.