chain drive mod

[fredintoon]

You make a statement like these x's are worthless without thinking about all the people who are on this site who own one without regards that it might be a bit insulting or hurtful in the process....

Hi old skool,
price, value and worth are words that are used interchangeably but they are not the same at all.
Let's suppose you just finished building a nice chaindrive XS11 conversion.
What was it's price?
Say a grand for the OK-ish runner you started with, another grand for parts, a third grand for custom machining plus 2 years of burning the midnight oil to build the thing.
What is it's value?
How can you measure the pride of building and owning such a unique machine?
But what is it worth?
That's the exact amount that someone will pay you for it.
I'll go $800 and take a chance the engine is salvageable.
That's not insulting or hurtful, that's the truth.

[cywelchjr]

Thats Cool Someone said sometime that there might be a drop on HP with a driveshaft Can't find anything to prove it, I think it might be so, don't know if it is more or less then the drop in HP useing a chain drive Got to be something writen somewhere. I am sure that chain thing is better, don't know what Yamaha was thinking

It is indeed a trade off. The drive shaft setup does consume some power, although I'm unsure of just now much it does, so the same engine and frame with a chain drive vs shaft drive will put more HP to the rear wheel. However, you WILL need to perform more maint more often on the chain drive bike, as even with modern o-ring or x-ring chains you have to clean the outside somewhat frequently to get the grit and such off to minimize wear of the chain and sprockets. You also have the advantage of FAR easier changes of final drive ratio with the chain drive, just change the sprockets, front, rear or both.

Oh, and handling characteristics are completely different, with chain drive being much better suited to high performance riding as it doesn't have the torque generated problems that ALL shaft drive bikes share. Where most shaft drive bikes will try to rise or twist some on heavy power application, chain drive just hunkers down and pushes.

[XS1100_OEM4ME]

Getting the shaft

+1 CY. I got to thinking how my "thinking" has changed as I get older. As a young man, I did everything I could to get down weight and get up HP for a tenth of a sec. Now the only clock I am watching is the one the grim reaper has So I can see how some would love the extra 10th, But currently, I love the not having to clean oil off my bike and spray oil back on my chain so it can spray oil back on my bike +, it is intresting that even with the shaft, the XS1100 was the fastest production bike ever made when it was introduced

While the loss of horsepower is indeed there, having ridden both shaft and chain driven bikes, I prefer the longer maint interval of the shaft drive, and since I'm NOT a canyon carver, I don't care too much about the loss to the drive shaft. I do however enjoy not having oil from the chain being slung all over the place.

[79XS11F]

There's more to this mod then just having a chain drive bike. These's weight savings and the weight that is saved is sprung weight at the rear end. My converted bike is much lighter then the stock unit. I did not get carried away with the mod because I wanted the bike to be an XS11 as compared to a bike that just makes use of an XS11 engine. I'm very happy with the appearance and weight of the bike.







Rob

[XS1100_OEM4ME]

Looks nice

Looks Nice 79XS11F, what kind of cash did it take? Will that set up alow for a much larger rear tire? How much better / different does it handle now? Thanks

[79XS11F]

Looks Nice 79XS11F, what kind of cash did it take? Will that set up alow for a much larger rear tire? How much better / different does it handle now? Thanks

It was more time then cash to build this bike because the chain drive mod was a small part of the project. There are too many other mods to list but for the chain drive part of this job ... I bough the chain drive conversion kit from a guy in South Africa for just under $300. The kit came with the swing arm, slip on wheel sprocket, chain guide / tensioner and 3 front sprockets. Then I had to buy a chain which was 167.00. That kit needed bearings and I think they set me back about 40.00 plus installation at 50.00 so a total of what, about 550.00
I have not been able to use this bike as yet because of insurance issues but they will be sorted out this spring.
Rob

[XS1100_OEM4ME]

Cool

Thanks, would love to hear an update when you get to ride it

It was more time then cash to build this bike because the chain drive mod was a small part of the project. There are too many other mods to list but for the chain drive part of this job ... I bough the chain drive conversion kit from a guy in South Africa for just under $300. The kit came with the swing arm, slip on wheel sprocket, chain guide / tensioner and 3 front sprockets. Then I had to buy a chain which was 167.00. That kit needed bearings and I think they set me back about 40.00 plus installation at 50.00 so a total of what, about 550.00
I have not been able to use this bike as yet because of insurance issues but they will be sorted out this spring.
Rob

[crazy steve]

...Someone said sometime that there might be a drop on HP with a driveshaft Can't find anything to prove it, I think it might be so, don't know if it is more or less then the drop in HP useing a chain drive...

Yamaha claimed 95 hp (at the crankshaft) for the XS11, and most good-running stockers that have been checked come in at about 80-85 hp at the rear wheel, so that works out to a 12-17% range of 'loss'. I'm sure not all of that is the shaft, some is lost in the transmission. But straight-cut gears have much less loss than bevel and/or hypoid (and the XS has two sets of bevel gears), so I'm reasonably sure that most of the loss is the shaft setup.

Chains only lose about 2-3%, so there is some 'free' power to be had...

[XS1100_OEM4ME]

Math

I am not so good at math, but wouldn't 10% of 95 hp be 9.5 hp So if some good running stockers have 85hp at the wheel, wouldn't that be a total loss of about 9.8% of hp? I have to belive that the tranny is good 2 or 3% of that, and a chain, while more efficent, has to be good for 1 or 2%, so less then half of the loss is because of the drive shaft setup compaired to a chain setup, or around 4 hp at the wheel. And even with all of that, Yamaha came out with the fastest qrt mile bike ever made in 1978 I say kudos to Yamaha and me not haveing to mantain a chain and clean oil off my bike

Yamaha claimed 95 hp (at the crankshaft) for the XS11, and most good-running stockers that have been checked come in at about 80-85 hp at the rear wheel, so that works out to a 12-17% range of 'loss'. I'm sure not all of that is the shaft, some is lost in the transmission. But straight-cut gears have much less loss than bevel and/or hypoid (and the XS has two sets of bevel gears), so I'm reasonably sure that most of the loss is the shaft setup.

Chains only lose about 2-3%, so there is some 'free' power to be had...

[79XS11F]

Thanks, would love to hear an update when you get to ride it

I will be sure to update the thread about this bike when I have run and fine tuned it.
This is the thread on this bike build

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21077

Rob

[79XS11F]

I am not so good at math, but wouldn't 10% of 95 hp be 9.5 hp So if some good running stockers have 85hp at the wheel, wouldn't that be a total loss of about 9.8% of hp? I have to belive that the tranny is good 2 or 3% of that, and a chain, while more efficent, has to be good for 1 or 2%, so less then half of the loss is because of the drive shaft setup compaired to a chain setup, or around 4 hp at the wheel. And even with all of that, Yamaha came out with the fastest qrt mile bike ever made in 1978 I say kudos to Yamaha and me not haveing to mantain a chain and clean oil off my bike

While that's all true the real advantage is in the creating of a lighter bike with whatever HP happens to get to the ground. This modified bike feels like a 650 but still has that modified XS11 engine in her and still looks like an XS11.
Rob

[XS1100_OEM4ME]

Hey

Hey, I like your bike! Just pointing that the XS1100, while not all that much more HP, was the tits over all the chain bikes in the qtr mile in its day, Kudos are due IMHO.

While that's all true the real advantage is in the creating of a lighter bike with whatever HP happens to get to the ground. This modified bike feels like a 650 but still has that modified XS11 engine in her and still looks like an XS11.
Rob

[79XS11F]

Hey, I like your bike! Just pointing that the XS1100, while not all that much more HP, was the tits over all the chain bikes in the qtr mile in its day, Kudos are due IMHO.

There's no doubt about it. In 78 and even today the XS1100 was and still is a motorcycle that commands and deserves respect. It is an iconic motorcycle even if you don't see it mentioned in any of the iconic bike lists from days gone by. The XS1100s only downfall was its popularity. It was produced in such large numbers across its model line that they are not what one would really call rare. If this bike had been limited to a smaller production run it would be far more collectible and far more valuable. Give it another 20 years and I'll bet there will still be several around and running.
Rob

[natemoen]

Hey, I like your bike! Just pointing that the XS1100, while not all that much more HP, was the tits over all the chain bikes in the qtr mile in its day, Kudos are due IMHO.

Gotta remember though that the XS11 only held its title for a matter of maybe a few months before someone topped it.

[crazy steve]

About six months; until the Honda CBX came out. I will note that technically, the XS was the quickest '78 model-year bike. The CBX also came out in '78 (later in the year), but was listed as an early-introduction '79 model...