Another Turn Signal Issue

[Manveru]

Hello all,

Been working on my 78 XS 1100 Standard and finally got it back on the road recently after 13 years in the Garage. Won't go into Detail on everything that was wrong, but the Engine and Carbs have been re-built and it is running great. Have new Tires, Re-did the shocks and brakes.. You name it.

Now.. The only issue I have is with the Turn Signals. Note: They do work. PO had put these tiny turn signals on that I do not like, I have replaced the Front Turn signals with something closer to stock that are made for the XS 1100. I just picked up the new Rear Turn Signals today and will be putting them on this weekend.

My issue is, Voltage. If the ignition is on and I hit a turn signal, it will not blink. If I have the engine idling, it will blink maybe once and then stop, If the engine is at 3k RPM or so, everything works fine (Except) If I hit the brake and the brake light come's on, the blinkers stop.

I am picturing some sort of voltage problem in the lighting circuit. I have managed to work around this by just using my front brake when turning (The Brake Switch is Missing), but I am curious if anyone else has had the issue on Voltage when the brake light come's on and what I might need to look for.

I am thinking about replacing the Signal Relay, but it seems to be working fine. I will also be doing the Blade Fuse conversion on the Fuse Box this weekend. Just not sure specifically what else I should look for.

Any comments or suggestions would be appreciated as to what I should be checking. (Will be checking all of the connectors tomorrow also).

Figured I would throw a pic in here of the bike (ALmost complete now)



~Manny~

[natemoen]

It usually is just an issue of dirty connections causing voltage loss. Sometimes the wire may be corroded and you need to cut the wire back till you find good wire. also cleaning up all the ground connections.

[Manveru]

Yeah,

That was pretty much my plan for this weekend. I checked the connections on the wires where they connect to the lights, I had already stripped them back and made solid contacts in the front lights, will be working on the rears tomorrow to see how they are. I know there is good grounding, but I also know my olf Fuse Block is on it's last leg, so thinking it might be part of the problem. Just wondering if anyone else had encountered the same issue.

Will definately try to go through the wires tomorrow. Not looking forward to that though lol.

~Manny

[CatatonicBug]

That's a relatively common issue. Don't limit the cleaning/checking to lighting wires though. The ground strap at the rear of the engine is a common voltage leak, as is the connection of the Reg/Rect to the frame. Take that off and clean out any rust/corrosion under it. Dab some anti-sieze on the bolt holes before re-mounting as well. It will help conduct electricity and prevent future corrosion. Anti-seize the ground strap connections as well. Of course, your old fuse block could definitely be part of the issue too. Order one from TC ($11 shipped with connectors) and just add fuses.

[Manveru]

Well, Like I said in my last Post. The Fuseblock is getting replaced this weekend. It is the one from TC with the 90 degree connectors. I will check the ground straps and reg/rec connections to see how they are. Thanks for the input, gives me more to look at.

~Manny

[Winterhawk]

I modified mine to take a Harley type glass mat sealed battery. I use a battery tender in between rides. Lots of starting power and no issues with voltage drops with the key on. I replaced the stock ignition switch with the round key designs and the fuse block. Someone on here has some plug and play fuse blocks. I used blade type fuses but would like to use the old style setup.

[fredintoon]

- - - Now.. The only issue I have is with the Turn Signals. Note: They do work. PO had put these tiny turn signals on that I do not like, I have replaced the Front Turn signals with something closer to stock that are made for the XS 1100. I just picked up the new Rear Turn Signals today and will be putting them on this weekend. - - -

Hi Manny,
most likely the tiny aftermarket rear signals have low wattage bulbs in them. Less that the stock 2 x 27W bulb loading gives the exact result you describe.
Yes! Clean up every last connection on the bike but with less than a 54W load the stock flasher unit won't work properly.

[Manveru]

Well,

I got everything re-wired over the weekend. Got the Fuse Block replaced with TC's from here (Freaking Nice Mod), and replaced the rear turn signals.

But now I have another question, I can't figure it out from the Schematic, so I figured I would ask here..

With the Turn Signals, how are the "Stock" turn signals supposed to work? And how many wires are supposed to be in Front and in the rear on a 78 XS1100 Standard?

I know my wiring has been modified by the PO. some aftermarket parts (the cheap Turn Signals). But I noticed that the after market lights were all 3 wire lights, dual filament. When I got the Replacements, the front turn signals came with 2 wires. After wiring them in, they stay on like parking lights and then shut off when they blink. The rear lights I got only had a single wire, but in the wiring harness there were 3 wires. So I modified the lights to use the other aftermarket bulbs that I had that were dual filament to retain the parking lights / TUrn signal Functionality.. This all seems to work well now, but still having the issue where when I hit the brakes, they stop blinking. And I believe the bulbs that are in now are 23W, not 27.

~Manny

[natemoen]

Front signals are 2 wires and ground through the stem into the triple tree, IIRC the wire colors are blue for running lights and then a green and a dark brown for their respective turn signal.

Rears are 1 wire ground is again through the stem. Don't remember colors.

[Manveru]

YEah, that seems odd. I think the Stock wiring harness is still there, just wires have been moved around some (I think to provide Running Lights on the Rear Turns). But I know there were 3 wires, Will have to take a Pic when I get home tonight maybe and get it in here. I know there was a black, red and brown in the back I believe, Front I did see the blue and brown and grounding is through the stem.

[fredintoon]

YEah, that seems odd. I think the Stock wiring harness is still there, just wires have been moved around some (I think to provide Running Lights on the Rear Turns). But I know there were 3 wires, Will have to take a Pic when I get home tonight maybe and get it in here. I know there was a black, red and brown in the back I believe, Front I did see the blue and brown and grounding is through the stem.

Hi Manny,
what your '78 Standard should have is signal/running light dual filament bulb flashers in front and signal only single filament bulb flashers at the rear.
All 4 signal lamps are grounded with a black wire with an eye fitting that goes on the mounting stalk and into a bullet connector that enters the main wiring harness.
The running lights in the front signals have a blue wire.
Front & rear left signals have a brown wire.
Front & rear right signals have a dark green wire.
All 4 signal filaments need to be 27Watts.
Check which wires came with the bike and blank off the additional wires.

[Manveru]

Thanks Fredintoon,

If I get a chance when I get over this cold I have had the last week, I might dig into it more.

The way I currently have it wired I actually prefer. Although I may look more into the fronts since they are running lights that just go off and on when they blink right now (Very Noticeable blinker though).

The rears have been modified with dual filament bulbs and the wiring was modified some from original (I think they tapped into the running light from the brake light), and those wires also go over to the rear turn signals now. I also like having the rear blinkers set to running lights, so that actually works.

Did discover that the blinkers are working fine as long as I have some rpms going, I did a test this morning coming off the freeway where I had the blinker going and hit the brake, it did not effect the turn signal. The only time it effects them is if I am below 2k RPM's. So I believe that I am ok, but will do further work on them later to maybe clean things up a little more. Tested the voltage and everything seems fine, but I will look into the bulbs since I believe the one's on there are 23 Watt and not 27 Watt.

Thanks again for all the input, it has given me a ton to work with, but for now at least, the lights are working good, bright and functioning (Albeit not Perfect) At least the bike is back to a point where it is very rideable and I have no planned work on the bike now, so can just enjoy it again for a while.

[cywelchjr]

If those rears are running lights as well as turns make sure they are red rather than yellow to prevent a ticket. Only red are allow to be on all the time on the rear. The fronts of course MUST be yellow, and if they have dual filament bulbs and are wired right should be at the lower light level normally and then blink brighter when the turn signals come on, and if that's not what's happening it might be why the blinkers aren't working right, as even with the 23 watt bulbs mine worked most of the time even at idle with the stock flasher.

[ViperRon]

ground

One thing that can be easily overlooked is the ground from the battery to frame cable. My bike had set for some time and I cleaned all connections and still had drop of voltage with lighting. The ground cable had a powdery green corrosion area about 1 inch from conector so I got coper cable and new ends and built a new one, that solved my problem.

[egsols]

FWIW I had a problem, front signals would light, no flash. Took apart everything, cleaned, new wires, the whole nine yards, still same problem.

Turns out it was the bulb. Brand new bulb but IIRC they were the "long life" type. They do not provide enough draw to make the flasher work. If you have some old bulbs laying around try them first. If not try to find the cheapest ones out there, they will probably be the oldest and provide enough draw to get the flasher working.
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Ernie