Last job

[Retroben]

Steering head bearings are in. Now trying to remove fork seals. Everything came apart OK, allen bolt, etc...but has anybody ever seen the seals actually bond to the sliders so that they will not come out? What do you do, heat it? Cool it? I'm currently trying to chew it out with a pair of wire cutters.

[cywelchjr]

Make sure you took the clip out that holds them in place. There should be a clip on top of them that holds them in, and it may be hard to see. They won't or at least should NOT come out without removing those clips first. Just like the right rear wheel bearing, that sucker won't come out without removing the clip first (ok, maybe if you bang on it hard enough long enough it would, but I figured it out before I got that far ).

[bikerphil]

Unlike most other types of forks, these seals press in and they are in there pretty tight. I use one of these automotive seal puller tools to remove them...

[cywelchjr]

Am I wrong here? I thought the manual specified a clip ring on top of them that holds them in place? I know they are pressed in as well, but I was sure there was a clip on top of them too.

[bikerphil]

Yes, there is a clip on top. I'm just guessing that retroben has removed the clip. The seals are in there very tight.

[BA80]

A good heavy awl and a hammer. Be careful not to score the sides of the lower where the seal .......seals.

The bottom doesn't matter so much.

[cywelchjr]

Yes, there is a clip on top. I'm just guessing that retroben has removed the clip. The seals are in there very tight.

I assume nothing. I've done the trying to remove something and realized after busting my fingers on it that there is a clip holding things in, sometimes after damaging the clip bad enough that I needed to find a replacement. It doesn't hurt to mention it, if he did remove it, great, if not, that just might be his problem.

[Retroben]

Clip removed Even the Clymer told me that much

Finally just tore the seal out. Damaged the slider too, hope a little dremeling will set things right.
BTW, I was not the impatient one. The OWNER, over to "help out", and hoping there'd be some visible progress today, did the gouging with screwdriver and pick tools I personally would have cracked a beer and waited for Phil's post with the picture of the seal puller, which I now realize is exactly the tool I need to do this. And they have them at the cheap Chinese tool place in town, where I got the drift. And the drift.

Thanks. Hope to send a pic of an assembled bike in the next couple days.

Ben

[Retroben]

A good heavy awl and a hammer. Be careful not to score the sides of the lower where the seal .......seals.

The bottom doesn't matter so much.

Scored for sure. Cleaned with 320 grit sandpaper, now what? Cross my fingers and hope for a seal? Will that red rubber goo they sent with the seals help? And what's that goo for anyways?

[BA80]

Sorry, possibly bad advice without further explanation. I meant for it to get a spot at the edge started so you could angle it toward the center and use the hammer and awl to bend the seal away from the lip on the lower. That will loosen the seal and it will come out easily.

I don't know what the red goo you refer too is. Does it look like a lubicant or a sealant, like a silicone.

The seal will probably seal ok if the gouge isn't too deep and you smooth it out so theres no sharp edges. A little tiny bit of yamabond or something similar wouldn't hurt.

Sorry again, I feel sorta responsible.

[Retroben]

Sorry, possibly bad advice without further explanation. I meant for it to get a spot at the edge started so you could angle it toward the center and use the hammer and awl to bend the seal away from the lip on the lower. That will loosen the seal and it will come out easily.

I don't know what the red goo you refer too is. Does it look like a lubicant or a sealant, like a silicone.

The seal will probably seal ok if the gouge isn't too deep and you smooth it out so theres no sharp edges. A little tiny bit of yamabond or something similar wouldn't hurt.

Sorry again, I feel sorta responsible.

Naw, the gouging was done before I even read your post.

[Retroben]

Failure

Installed seals in both forks. The seals had been replaced before, and not very well - obvious gouging under where the seals were on both sides. So after a scare on the first (left) fork, everything seemed to go back together OK, although I drove the seal all the way down until it seated - a good 2 mm past the circlip groove where I think I should have stopped. I. On the second (right) fork I'm extra careful starting out. I see some silicone sealant on top of and around the outside of the seal. I dremeled little notches in the metal ring inside the seal - not even close to the outside edge - then hammered to deform the ring and coaxed the seal out with a little prying. I see there is a spacer under the seal that was not there on the first fork. I also see some nasty vertical gouges in the tube behind where the seal was. I thought I did the right thing on the second fork when I didn't drive the seal all the way down. Put the parts back together and filled with 225ml of fork oil. When I went to reinstall the cap, I realized that the spring didn't even reach up to the cap - I installed the cap anyway, no pressure required , installed the second fork in the triple- and now one of my fork tubes is longer than the other. I put 10 lbs of air in each with a hand pump, and the right fork started spraying oil past the new seal.

Uh, I think I need to disassemble and see what's wrong. Another set of seals probably.

And I got the oil filter ring in crooked, so when we used the kick starter for a compression check, we got a nice fast leak there, my own carelessness.

[bikerphil]

You may have forgotten to put the short spring (top out) on one of the damper rods, this would make one fork about an inch longer than normal.

[BA80]

When I went to reinstall the cap, I realized that the spring didn't even reach up to the cap - I installed the cap anyway, no pressure required .

What are you working on, a standard or a special.

That sounds like a special fork with a standard spring in it. Or one that someone has cut off.

[Retroben]

Done.

You may have forgotten to put the short spring (top out) on one of the damper rods, this would make one fork about an inch longer than normal.

Yep. Found it on the shop floor

So to sum up: I rebuilt one fork twice -- leaked bad the first time because I failed to seat the seal properly and deformed it, plus the gouges on the seating surfaces needed to be smoothed anyway. Dremel job. A piece of 1-1/4" SCH40 PVC pipe cut square worked really nice to seat the new seal. No leaks, holds air.

The other fork didn't seem to be leaking after I put in the new seal the first time, but then I had to take it back apart to install the forgotten spring...now it is seeping. But I know why - I didn't dremel the surfaces and I betcha those gouges on the seating surface are letting some seepage through. Oh well, I do have another seal left from the second set I had to buy. Just have to rebuild that fork again, I can do it in 15 minutes flat now!