Crankcase problem...

[the108penguins]

well I got my bike running, a little rough but running (still need to synch the carbs) and I check and change the oil and I discover that the crankcase had quite a bit of water in it The oil is milky and looks like snot. I've changed it twice after running it up to temperature, and it's still all milky. Plus the inside of the crankcase is coated in a white film.

How do I get all the water out of the crankcase and tranny

Any help any you can give guys will be much appreciated. Thanks in advance.

[CatatonicBug]

Drop the oil pan and let it drain for a day. Be sure to do the same with the oil filter too.

[motoman]

What Bug said and if you can with a compressor and spray with pick-up hose in some clean solvent, spray all up inside where you can reach with the pan, shift cover and clutch housing preferably off. Would be worth the extra effort!

[3Phase]

How do I get all the water out of the crankcase and tranny

+1 for Bug and motoman. You could pull the valve cover and the breather cover too.

Then you need to figure out how the water got into the engine. Was it left uncovered sitting out in the rain, used to ford rivers, refilled by children with new beach toys having fun or what?

While you're letting the engine drain and dry out, check the oil in the mid-drive and final drive, make sure they're not full of water, too.


Regards,

Scott

[DGXSER]

If you consistantly start the bike and only let it run a few minutes, then shut it off without properly warming the engine up, you will get alot of condensation inside the crankcase. I have not seen or read if you have been doing garage only running to get the bike fixed and operating or taken it out on some runs.

At one point, my breather tube was plugged full of white milky goop. I blew it out with compressed air and thought I popped the worlds biggest zit!! It was crazy. But I had been wokring on the carbs and trying to get them sorted out. Doing alot of garage 3 minute runs in cooler weather, which around here it has been almost winter temps for a few days or more.

If the bike is running correctly, try taking on a short hop maybe a 2-5 miles and see if it all clears up.

JAT

[WMarshy]

Well this might be a good time to try replace one quart of oil with a quart of seafoam in the crank case and letting it idle (do not ride it with it in!!). Not only will it clean any deposits out but the seafoam is mostly alcohol and will absorb the water. Hell, I bet you could try it with with some dry gas instead of seafoam and it would to the same thing and might be cheaper. No one really knows what kind of affect it could have on our clutch friction plates so I wouldnt advise leaving it in for an extended time. Over night might be about it then drain it... Any thoughts guy?

[fartypants]

water in the oil

I had the same problem with my gearbox. Full of water. Don't know how it got in there, except it sat outside for years with a big gapping hole in the u-joint boot. Anyway, I had to refill the tranny 5 times, running is for a mile or so between changes, before it drained out looking like oil.
I realize with your problem, the filter will have to be changed each time. Maybe you could rinse it out with KERO or diesel fuel. I wouldn't run it very long with oil like that. Water doesn't have very good lubrication properties.

[thewiz]

Possibly a cracked head or blown head gasked?? ... NO ... just kidding .. everyone else has covered this well.

Probably would be a good idea to check the final drive too.... we don't want that locking up.

[trbig]

If you drain your oil into a clean pan and let it sit for a day or so, the water and oil will seperate, leaving the oil on top. You can pour this back in the bike, being careful not to reintroduce the water back in. It may take a few times, but this should take care of the problem without having to buy anything expensive or new oil every time.


Tod

[oseaghdha]

If you drain your oil into a clean pan and let it sit for a day or so, the water and oil will seperate, leaving the oil on top. You can pour this back in the bike, being careful not to reintroduce the water back in. It may take a few times, but this should take care of the problem without having to buy anything expensive or new oil every time.


Tod

Now who's a cheap-azz?
If you leave it long enough, all the dirt will fall to the bottom too!

[the108penguins]

I've been keeping the bike closed up and dry, but the guy I bought it off of had left it with the head off and only covered by a tarp which had blown off when I came to pick it up. So I'm assuming that is how the water got in there.

I took it for a couple short runs yesterday (maybe a mile each) in an effort to get the oil throughout the engine and tranny and clean out any old oil and water. It is (after the fourth time draining the oil) looking a bit better but still has a decent amount of water in there. Enough to make it look like someone coated the gears in mayonnaise

I dropped the oil pan like bug suggested and discovered a new problem... there sitting in the pan was two small nuts a pin (possibly a roller bearing) a washer and a sir-clip

Where these little pieces came from is very troubling

The two nuts and the washer look like they were dropped down through the chain galley by the PO (I know I didn't drop anything in there) but the sir-clip and the roller bearing have me worried. none of them are damaged in any way so it doesn't look like they went through any gears or anything, But I don't know. The bike has had the 2nd gear fix done on it so they may have been dropped down there then.

When I ran it yesterday (the first time I heard it run) it sound great, awe inspiring really, and didn't have any weird noises so they probably have been down there a while before I got it.

ideas anyone?

thanks again for all the input guys.

[trbig]

That's true, but hopefully that's happening in the bottom of your FILTER... WHen he gets the water issue taken care of.. he can change the oil and filter.. but no need in spending 4 quarts and a filter multiple times for some water.

I may be cheap.. but I like to think "Practical". You say you got a crankcase full of gas in the oil after a leaky float valve? Just unscrew the filler cap and let the gas evaporate...

Man.. some people. FINALLY get off the Obama teat and get gainfully employed, and they start throwing their money around calling everyone cheap. That Walmart greeter job isn't THAT secure, ya know.


Tod

[psycoreefer]

Any chance the roller bearing is actually the pin for a master-link type cam chain? If the PO did a cam chain replacement it wouldn't be unlikely that he dropped the pin down there.

[trbig]

You don't have to drain your oil for this.. but with the water you may want to anyway, but you need to lean the bike on it's sidestand and take off your clutch cover and then your clutch basket. The gear on the back of the clutch basket drives a small gear that runs your oil pump. This gear is on a shaft that has a tiny dowel pin in it that fits into the case to keep the rod from spinning. It's probably broken off. That small gear is held on with a small washer and circlip. The gear can't come out from behind the clutch basket, but it can booger things up in there.

That oil pump is the life of your motor... so it's worth checking out to see if I'm right. You can pull that clutch cover and may be able to see that small gear behind it without pulling the clutch basket yet. If you can get your fingers in there, see if you can slide it back and forth at ALL on that shaft. If so, the circlip is gone and the basket needs pulled to replace it.

As for the two nuts... I'd pull the valve cover and check. If they were simply dropped down there.. and replaced, that's one thing, but if a couple of your cam caps are now being held down with just one nut a piece... it will fail eventually. With both the nuts AND washers down there, I would think this is what's happened.

If you're worried about a gasket, you can make one from a roll of gasket material at any auto parts stores.. simply trace the cover and cut like kindergarten, or do away with the gasket all together like many (Including myself) have done. There are several choices for this.. and if it's yours, I can recommend a couple I know work well.

Tod

[motoman]

Can tell you where three of the parts came from in you pan without even seeing them. The pin came out of the shift pawl(bet the star washer has an ear broken off too). The little washer and circlip came off the shift fork shaft on the clutch side of engine. Those I DO know for sure where they came from! Likely has the notorious first and second gear issue for starters. Secondly, when you pull the clutch cover off you likely may find what resembled a larger bolt and thick washer at one time. If so, they came out of the lower gear shaft assembly allowing the shaft assembly to "walk" back and forth sideways, which in turn caused tranny to jump in and out of gear which in turn knocked off the circlip on the clutch side of case off the shift fork shaft which in turn caused at least one of the shift pawl pins to come out when one of the ears on the star washer got bent from shifter fork shaft moving laterally(no circlip) causing shift pawl catch that normally catches on next pin in succession rotating shift pawl shaft bind sideways and bends a star washer ear causing that particular pin to fall out which will leave tranny in whatever gear it is at that time and you will NOT be able to rotate shift pawl shaft using the shifter. All is an easy fix for us who have been there, done that. Your likely gonna have to remove shifter side cover, clutch side cover, pan(which you already have off), don't stop there, your just getting started(welcome to XS11 world) and better do some seriousreading here in the tech tips for fixing first/second gear issue(or your gonna be havin' to take it all apart again to fix) do the fixes now, trust us here on this one or you will be cussing that mug in the mirror! Oh, trbig, already know what's happened and why without even being there. Good try though, sure would have saved a bunch of work. Least this way he'll have a better understanding how it all works and can know how to fix things on the XS better in the future. 108pen, they are actually easy to work on, ask some here who have previously rarely turned a wrench. Any questions, ask here, we got the RIGHT answers and can lead you through the fix in laymen terms as necessary!