2009 winter repairs.....

[ross]

hey there kids....since the weather crapped out planning on doing some repairs on the rebel devil....nothing like a man, his man-cave, and his XS.....of course, being in michigan, "mr heater" (propane heater) will be my constant friend until spring....looking into re-doing the clutch (has some slippage at high rpm).....also looking into adding the extra plate to solve this problem....also will be looking to repair the cam chain tensioner......pretty sure it has not worked since the last time i tried 2 adjust it....was wondering what the guru's suggest about both procedures....any tips, tricks, conjecture, voodoo curses, mayan rituals, sacrificial lambs, pagan practices, or other xs11 hinkiness would be appreciated.....what have you experienced and what to look out for when doing said procedures...do's & don'ts.......this will be a show and tell project....pictures will document the entire event......here's a photo of the "rebel devil" and another 78 xs11 standard.....thanx in advance for any and all advice....peace....ride hard, ride safe...ross

[oseaghdha]

I replaced my frictions with new, plus replaced the springs.
Quite pleased with the results.

Check this thread for a new tensioner idea.

Think I will try to scarf one up over the winter.

[Schming]

Chain, Chain, Chain...

Hello Ross, I thought you might be interested in reading this web page:http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread...ferrerid=14949 I hope this works as it has alot of insight on the cam chain tensioner removal & replacement as well as the adjustment. it's a long read but it may save Your engine. If the link doesn't work search for "Got defeated this weekend" HTH

[red bandit]

I know a lot of guys have added the extra steel with good results. And some of us didn't see any or very little difference, it still slipped. If you add the extra steel the springs are over compressed. The free length will be way under spec. Which means you don't get the full benifit of the added compression. I did a lot of things trying to get it to quit slipping. I finally broke down and bought new PNM frictions and had to replace the new springs again because of the free length issue. No more slipping. If you put in new springs and it still slips, there is something else wrong. If the springs are bad because of being 30 years old, aren't the frictions old also? MHO.

[DiverRay]

I've done both, on different bikes. New springs area MUST, as the 30 year old ones are shot. If you have less than 20K on the bike, the friction plates are probably still good. The extra steel plate can help, but it makes the initial adjustment a little harder to do. Try and get the HIGH PERFORMANCE springs, as they will make a difference in the clutch. JMHO

[dbeardslee]

I did my clutch with all new steels and frictions and heavy duty springs (10% stiffer than stock) - no extra steel - and it works great. My understanding of the extra steel is that it is to accommodate wear on the pressure plate and old steels. I got the frictions at partsnmore ($5 ea.) and the steels and springs from bikebandit.

I installed an automatic cam chain tensioner off an FZR1000. You have to elongate the bolt holes a bit to get it to fit, and an extra thick gasket to keep it from leaking. It's great - it adjusts automatically, so you only have to mess with it when you eventually replace the cam chain.

Of course, if you want the full voodoo - on the night of the first full moon after completing the repairs take a chickens foot, dip it in fresh chicken blood, sprinkle it liberally over the clutch housing and tensioner, and dance around it nekid chanting 'roses are red, violets are blue, with the clutch and the tensioner I'm all through.'

[oldyam80sg]

Interesting-the only thing i have planned for this winter is to change the oil in my SG.Currently have 20 W50 and plan on going to 10 W40.No trickle charger because i start it very frequently-(weekly).Have a new set of stock coils and a complete stock tool kit that i got off E-Bay.Looking to do a lot of things to my 1997 Cherokee and that will take some time.

[XSokieSPECIAL]

Heh-heh before you try the voodoo repair like Doug suggests, What kind of engine oil are you running?

It can affect the clutch A LOT if your using the wrong stuff.

I had a slippage problem with mine when I ran Rotella 15-40 because of the friction additives. Switched to Castrol 20-50 4 stroke MC oil and it went away once the Rotella was worked out of the plates.

Costs about $3 a quart but worth it.

JAT

[oldyam80sg]

Not having any problems with the clutch-just going to change it because its time!

[XSokieSPECIAL]

Sorry oldyam80sg,

I was aiming that response at ross.

[oldyam80sg]

no problem-all good

[XJ Rob]

Hey Ross... When you decide to do the work, let me know. A second set of hands is sometimes nice to have around. I'm in the Mt Clemens area quite a bit. My wife works at Crocker and Gratiot and most of my family live in the area.

[ross]

typical xs-ive responses....

hey there folks...sorry was distracted by the fantastic performance our wonderful Detroit Lions brought up against the Ravens....they had it at the opening kickoff and it was spectacular after that....thanx for all the feedback on the project.....probably gonna start it on xmas break....if i get one....sounds like i will be thinking twice about doing the extra plate and just get the high performance springs and quality frictions.....

oseaghdha.....thanx very much for the link to the tensioner repair.....sounds like the way to go and not too hard.....will be using it for reference....

Schming....that was some scary reading.....i'm not looking at replacing the cam chain yet, just want to fix the adjuster so that it does what it is supposed to do....i'm hoping not to have to tear into the motor any more than i have to...

red bandit....definitely gonna do both frictions and good springs.....btw, where did ya get ur PNM frictions at....please do tell more......thanx...

Diver Ray....definitely going with the good springs.....figure i'll do the frictions anyway because i'm there...btw, do you have to drain the oil from the bike to do the clutch.....still looking for a good thread on step by step.....not sure i trust the clymer.....let me know if you can....

dbeardslee....ahhh i knew someone was gonna pull out some XS voodoo....not many people know it, but it is part of what makes these bikes still run after newer bikes are sitting in the scrap heap....i'm definitely looking into the tensioner re-do.....is it just a simple undo and re-bolt on or is it more labor intensive (as in opening up the top of the motor)...don't mind labor, but only if i have to......as far as the last part, got the foot and the blood (borrowed it from my neighbor.....no, he doesn't know yet!).....understand the sprinkling (as long as it doesn't make me a liberal!)....as far as the nekid dancing, SWMBO has not allow me to do that since the last time we had a half barrel party......it was after midnight....full moon....wearing nothing but my a**less chaps and a smile...i raced up and down our street howling like a wolf......followed by slap, slap, slap.......(i forgot i was free-balling when the sheriff's showed up!) (the image alone should make ya blow milk out your nose!)......lastly hope ya don't mind me using that little diddy when the project is done.....sorta catchy...

oldyam80sg...yea, i'm gonna change all the oils during the time off...including the front forks....i want to take care of her as she is my main ride to work when the weather permits......she's taken care of me and now it's time to return the favor.....

XSokieSPECIAL.....have run yamalube 5w30 in her since i got her....have never had problems with it and to this day, i still don't....just went out last nite and started her up......ran a little rough, but once she got warm, sounded just fine......i wish yamalube was $3 a quart....try almost $6....as far as the voodoo repairs have been chatting with a japanese witch doctor that is familiar with the XS and i have his blessings.....he will be coming to the states to bless the rebel devil when she is done....

Project1100.....thanx for the offer...might have 2 take ya up on that one.....nice 2 find a neighbor locally....i see u r in kimball, but crocker and gratiot is blocks from my house....how well do perform with strippers, beer and motorcycles all in front of you at the same time......just remember that ya come over, the strippers and beer is yours to bring.....hahahaha....also do you have any knowledge of voodoo rituals?!!.....

as usual, thanx again for all the response....this thread will be updated with many pictures of the process as it goes along.....just remember to look in the back ground for the subliminal voodoo items.......ride hard, ride safe....ross

[motoman]

Hey there Ross...........Ray's suggestion is what you should follow.........do NOT add another steel plate, as it will eventually collapse the springs, even new ones. Extra plate is just a bandaide! With fourty years of messin with these and my moto-cross bikes, and alot of clutches on both, have learned alot mosty by accident. Leave disc and plates alone unless plates are warped or blued, disc will likely still be within specs and then some........put in new HEAVY duty springs, adjust down at pivot on motor, then cable in that order......and ride! No need to get all wrapped up in the hula-balu for high performance disc and such. If you knew how all us motocrossers used our clutch, you would scream. Have seen several side cases smokin' after racin a heat. So our clutches are babied compared to our moto-cross bikes. Again. Ray's suggestion is dead-on!

[dbeardslee]

Ross - lol . The automatic tensioner doesn't require taking the top off the motor. On an FZR tensioner you just turn the timing plate until the pointer is looking at "C", elongate the bolt holes 'till the bolts go in straight (can be done with a small round file, or a dremel tool), cut a gasket out of some thick gasket material (the stuff I used is blue and is probably 3/32" thick), take the bolt out of the end to relieve the spring tension, press the detent and push the plunger back into the housing, bolt it to the motor, and reinstall the spring and bolt. If you want to be extra safe, put a little rtv in the bolt holes and on the gasket surfaces before bolting to motor. The thing I really like about this setup is that the plunger ratchets in, so it won't get pushed back on hard decels like the stock units will, and it adjusts itself so you shouldn't have to screw with it again until it's time for a new cam chain.