Can my XS11 be static timed?

[Incubus]

I have strong spark and the carbs should be clean enough to run, even if I have not yet done the second and third mandatory cleanings. The passages were clear enough for spray cleaner to get through. But still no start.

I'm thinking the timing could be way off. I just threw the timing plate on there from the parts bike. So how can I get the timing close enough to start so I can put my timing light on it? I was kind of hoping to do this without pulling the valve cover because I don't have a replacement gasket on hand. I will pull it if I have to, though.

Suggestions are welcome.

Patrick

[CatatonicBug]

Is the timing plate in in the right orientation? I may be way off on this, but IIRC, that plate can go on 180º out of alignment.

[Incubus]

I think it only goes on one way, CB, but I certainly will double check that. Any other suggestions? Can the timing adjustment be far enough off for the bike not to start, assuming the plate is oriented correctly?

[Crazcnuk]

The only way to properly check the timing with it not running is to take the valve cover off, take #1 sparkplug out, align the cam marks, with #1 piston at top dead center (TDC), and see where the timing mark is.

If your plate is wrong, the timing marks will be upper right, while the indicator is at bottom left, I think.

You can just turn the motor over until #1 piston is at TDC to check the plate, w/o removing thev valve cover, but you won't know which stroke you are on...

Someone out there may be able to say whether or not you can just take the plate off, rotate the engine until the #1-4 pickup coil is aligned, to aloow you to put the plate on correctly.

The thing is that the timing can't be out a lot without it being quite noticable. ie: you will be getting spitting out the carbs, or out the pipes, backfires, or the motor will seem very stiff to turn over, or really really easy.

I have an issue with my 80SG where it won't start if it has been sitting for more than a week. (at least not with just the battery)

I have to pull 1 sparkplug ( I use #1, easiest to get at) put 1/2 tsp or so of gas (seafoam, whatever will burn), replace the plug and then turn it over, and it will start up immediately. After that it will start, on it's own until I leave it sit too long.

I assume I have a small problem with my choke(s).

[randy]

You can find out what stroke you're on - you need to be on the compression stroke, so plug the spark plug hole with your thumb as you turn the crank. As you approach TDC on the compression stroke, you'll feel it.

[Ivan]

You can find out what stroke you're on - you need to be on the compression stroke, so plug the spark plug hole with your thumb as you turn the crank. As you approach TDC on the compression stroke, you'll feel it.

This method works best on a COLD engine.

DAMHIK

[Incubus]

I have no reason to believe that the cam timing is incorrect. I did not tear down the engine and from the looks of it the engine has not been torn down. I just wondered if the spark timing could be far enough off for the engine not to start. I also do not know, however, why the bike was permanently parked an unknown number of years ago so it is possible PO did something to mess it up. I figured to time the engine with my light once it started, but I wasn't sure if it could be too far off to fire at the right time in the first place. I can static time with points and get the timing pretty close to dead on. I didn't know if you could do that, or needed to, with a TCI. I didn't have this issue when I rebuilt Succubus a couple years back because I took it down to bolts and buckets so I knew where everything was when I started it the first time.

There are other things I need to look at, I realized as I sat here pondering today. For one, when I bench synched the carbs I set them with a very thin tip cleaner to get them as close as possible and I don't remember opening them back up, so it also is possible that the butterflies are not open enough for the engine to breath. I'll try adjusting the throttle a bit and if that doesn't work I will try priming it. I have found no reason so far that this engine should not run well. I have strong spark and solid and equivalent compression.

Patrick

[randy]

The spark timing COULD be 180 degrees out IF the PO dismantled the advance weights/springs on the reluctor and installed the reluctor 180 out. I know 'cause I did it.

What it did for me was give me plenty of popping and backfiring through the carbs till I figured out what I did. Then again, you didn't post the year/model so I don't know if you actually HAVE a mechanical advance mechanism. For instance, the 81 and up models don't have it.

[oseaghdha]

Put a timing light on and crank it over.

[Incubus]

Sorry, my bad. It's a '79 XS1100F, although the advancer is off a '79 XS1100SF. I don't think that makes a difference. I did not take the advancer apart, but the Special, the parts bike, did not run (I know because the PO left the carbs off until the engine froze) so there is no telling why it didn't run.

If I get popping through the carbs I will consider that progress. At this point I just get engine turning over and no apparent combustion at all.

Patrick

[XJOK2PLAY]

Have you checked compression yet?

I'd start w/ the basics.

If it is off that far, you may have suffered some bent valves... hopefully not, but check at square 1 to tell.

Be sure to open throttle WOT when checking.