Newbie with a new bike w/pics '78 XS1100E

[rlundy]

Axel & bikerphil-thanks for keeping me going. How did TC make that diagram? its the same one thats in the back of the factory service manual, but colored. Amazing.

Anyway, got the headlight housing out-once I gingerly got the plug apart I found the problem-mondo corrosion on the hot wire to the ignition switch-it also look a little burned? probably from a jump at some point I guess. After using some contact cleaner, and applying a bit of dialectric grease, I had a nice christmas tree of lights between the speedo and tach.

Hit the starter button, a resounding click from the relay, but no starter. Cleaned and greased the two large lugs, filed down to clean metal, After a couple of hits on the starter it spun over nicely.

So now I'm really getting excited-maybe it will start? clhoke was very, very stiff, oiled it to free up its movement, put the petcocks to prime-and gas runs all over the left side. PO had disconnected the fuel line. rechecked everything (the petcock vac line was off too), set to prime and was rewarded with a bit of fire. General messing about occured-I used starter fluid ONE time after removing the bottom of the airbox, just a tiny bit and it seemed to help it. After a bout an hour of messing about it will crank and run on the two right cylinders (hot pipes on that side, cold on the left two) for about three seconds then stall. What success.

I pulled a plug on each side-checked that the left outermost plug had spark the old fashioned way (ground plug to block and turn over)-it did spark. The right side plug smelled a bit gassier than the left, otherwise there was no difference.

Any ideas? at this point I'm thinking I'm going to have to pull the carbs. The PO says they were cleaned, but I'm having a hard time believing anything he said at this point. The stiffness of everything, the nearly bad ground, etc. makes me wonder. He said he rode this bike after a carb cleaning, until it went dead. I suppose he could've. But usually running only on choke and not hitting on all cylinders that have spark means dirty carbs.

Any other good troubleshooting ideas for the two left side cylinders? Was thinking coil, but it did have spark. I also tried both the TDI units I have, both ran the bike the same way.

OH, the rear brakes have the same disease at the fronts-gonna have to diassemble that caliper and MC too. And I need to order the fusebox from TopCat, mine is fragile to say the least.

Thanks again for all the help.

[Axel]

A book

Ok > As long as your spark plug wires are hooked up properly . This indicates a fuel problem not a coil problem . If 1&4 were cold I would suspect an electirical thing . PO says the carbs were cleaned but if any fuel sat for any period of time this was all for naught .
I always suggest Seafoam as a simple first - complicated later strategy . Pour a whole can in the tank and try to run it long enough to get some in the carbs 10-15minutes .If you have a full tank I would even use 2 cans . This stuff is magic on a lot of conditions but takes some time to dissolve the built up gum that you may have . Bright side is that two carbs are working so I have hope .
After running it for as long as possible going though the revs ( if you can ride it the better- otherwise use a fan on the front blowing on the engine) Let it sit for as long as possible with that solution in the gas to work the magic . I leave it in all winter long ( months up here in Canada) and my carbs are sweet come Spring .
For the extra treatment drain the tank to reserve and then apply the Seafoam ,run it 10-15 mins ,let soak for a week , start and see if anything changes.
If you have a strong solution in the tank and lots of it ,an occasional ride around will help get it through the various passages . Make sure you get up above 5000 rpms to get into the main circuit too as pilot circuit has effect up to 4000
Keep at it dude . I'm excited for you as I sit in my snowbank .

[rlundy]

OK, just to get this out of the way......IT RUNS!

Since I had the two right cylinders (3,4) firing yesterday I decided to do a quick carb cleaning on the left two carbs. My version of a quick carb cleaning means pulling the bowl drains and putting the carb cleaner straw up in the bowl while holding my finger over the hole-filling the bowl up with carb cleaner. Although its a reach, I bumped the starter over a bit to suck some cleaner into the orifices. And thats all it took to get both left side cylinders running.

I pulled the tank, did some more connection cleaning, added two gallons of gas (tank was low on fuel-should've done this yesterday!) and added about a quarter of a can of seafoam, along with stabil and yamaha ring-free. I removed the two front brake calipers, made sure the crappy tires were holding air and rode the bike about 15 miles around the neighborhood, up to 45-50mph a couple of times, to get every thing soaking in the seafoam laced gas. This took some planning as the frozen front calipers are off the bike and the rear is dragging but not completely frozen. Yes, it was stupid, but as long as I kept it slow I could stop the bike reasonable well. The ride was exhilarating. I did not expect to have the bike running this soon. Couple of things:

1. #3 (the inner right cyl) doesn;t seems to firing now at less than 4K RPMs. Probasbly needs my little carb cleaning trick, or maybe the seafoam will take care of it. That header never got as hot as the others, but at 4K you could feel the bike surge forward and get really smooth.

2. I need to figure out to properly adjust the idle. When I got it ruuning, it was idling at about 3K. Did not know each bank of two carbs has its own idle screw, am sure they aren't synced. But its idling nicely at about 1100 RPM at this point.

3. The tach bounces a bit, say 2-300 RPM. What causes this?

4. The rear seemed a little squirrely-PO mentioned this too. maybe swingarm bushings? The shocks are original and look pretty sad, maybe a little of both?

5. The right sode petcock leaks a lot on "prime" and a little on "on". I do not liek these vaccum operated things-are they replaceable by the ones on mikesXS.com that are "standard" motorcycle petcocks? Have any idea where I can get a rebuild kit?

At this point I'm going to do some basic maint-the PO said he drained oil and refilled (but no filter change) about six months ago, before the bike crapped out on him. Some questions:

1. Can I use the Castrol 20W-50 from wal-mart? I read the oil thread thru and it seemed that lots of guys were using this oil (unless its a special motorcycle version and they didn't mention that), I really don't want to move to an expensive Synthetic like amsoil at this point.

2. Am making up a parts list for parts n more-seems like they have most of the things I need. Oil filter, turn signal lens, caliper rebuild kits front and rear (If I'm going to take them apart, I'm going to replace everything I can), MC rebuild kit for the rear)etc.

3. I'll run through a full basic maint next weekend including adjusting the cam chain, so I know where I'm starting from here on out. Also need to do a quickie carb cleaning on the right two carbs.

4. Gotta get a fusebox from TC

5. Figure out what to do about tires. Was planning to remove them myself and take to dealer (so I could check everything). Wit the need to do swingarm maint, this is probably the way to go.

Thanks again for all the help. Can't wait to get back on this thing and go for a real ride-with real brakes!

[Axel]

Seafoam

Not sure about the other stuff you have added but I would put in a whole can of Seafoam for max effect . No harm will come .Seafoam is a stabilizer and the only one I use .I use it in a lot stronger concentrations that I suggest here for cleaning .
The two screws from the top in between the carbs are balancing screws not idle screws . On mine the idle is controlled by a knob under the carbs in between 2&3 .
The screw in between 2&3 from the top balances the left 2 with the right 2 (banks) .Unless you allready have best not to mess with these too much yet - if it runs ok ,you got lucky .
At some point hopefully you can get ahold of a sync tool and tune er up .
The screws that are actually on top of the carbs themselves are pilot mixture screws .Best not to mess with them either .
Otherwise - swing arm bearings are rare to go on these but thats just what I heard .
See what freeing up the brakes brings . Careful not to overheat and warp discs if the pads are dragging hard . Wheels should spin freely with only a bit of noise from the pads when jacked up

[bikerphil]

Regular Castrol 20W-50 from Wal-of-China Mart is fine. Don't ever use synthetic motor oil, the clutch may slip. Those petcocks are rebuildable, but Partsnmore and Mikesxs sells replacement non-vac type that require only slight tank modification to fit.

[rlundy]

Axel & Phil-thanks for the tips. I wondered why there would be two idle adjustments. You know, I have this nice yamaha manual that tells me how this thing should work, all I've got to do is look at it. Idiot! Well, I can console myself that it was likely out of sync anyway, and I'd been planning to acquire one of the tools. Still makes me mad though. The bike won't get ridden anymore until the brakes get redone and everything is in sync.

After looking at the petcock refit kits, I decided on the rebuild kits from partsnmore. I figure they've lasted 30 years, they must be OK. Got all my other stuff ordered as well, hopefully will arrive by Friday so I can work on it over the weekend. I also replaced some vac lines today and will be picking up some MC fuel hose at the local Yamaha dealer this week. Am slightly worried about the fuel hoses on this thing and the ethanol fuel we have now.

Axel the Ring Free is a yamaha additive that cleans the engine's top end of carbon deposits-I've run it through old outboards and after removing their heads, the tops of the pistons are shiny-its basically pure techron. Have run this through all sorts of 2 and 4 cycle engines over the years and it really works. Typically it makes engines run smoother as well.

[Axel]

Ring Free

Maybe I should try this Ring Free on my oil-burning,vibrating Toyota with the stuck rings

[rlundy]

Stuck rings were what ring-free was created for. In the late eighties and early nineties, guys who trolled big V6 outboards for long periods were getting stuck rings at 400 hours, necessitating complete rebuilds. Ring-free burns that off. You can get it at any yamaha dealer that sells outboards or jetskis.

I also noticed at the local advance auto parts that there seemed to be much cheaper brands-all you need is basically 99% pure techron on the label and its the same stuff I think. Should at least free up your rings.

[foreda]

78 Standard

Make sure you get you a Clymer Repair Manual. Lots of good information.
[/IMG]

[rlundy]

OK, have been busy frying turkeys and whatnot the past few days, but have been able to get a few things done.

1. Cleaned the right two carbs
2. Added some seafoam to the crankcase oil
3. Got a new bolt for the taillight lens housing-one was sheared off but the but came right out, so an easy fix.
4. Bled the rear brakes with fresh DOT3 fluid. The rear seems to be operating properly now, not sticking at all.
5. Got a bunch of parts ordered (Front caliper rebuild kits, etc., turn signal lens, fuse box from topcat, air filter, oil filter, L & R side covers off ebay). Also ordered a motion pro carb tune tool. $79 but a bike shop would charge at least that to sync the carbs, so that sounded reasonable.
6. Figured out my right petcock wasn't leaking, the old fuel line had split right where it goes over the barb. I still have two petcock rebuild kits coming
7. Replaced the petcock vacuum lines-one had clog, but both were very stiff and needed to go
8. Got some fancy pants "racing" fuel line from the local yamaha dealer. $5.99 for 3 feet. Not sure of other sources of thin wall fuel line, but the local Auto Parts houses only have the modern thick wall stuff. Also picked up a couple of small generic fuel filters, installed one on the left side.
9. Installed new turn signal bulbs (two were dead)

So, what I'm working on right now-after I got the new turn signal bulbs installed, when I turn on the ignition all 4 lights burn solid. I think I may have caused this myself by spraying the inside of the turn signal switch with contact cleaner. The only place I can see where all four lights could short like that is at the switch. When I opened up the switch, it was full of gunk. I think the contact cleaner moved enough mess around on the bottom of the switch (where 4 wires make up underneath) and have caused a short. I did blow the switch out with my air compressor, but its still shorted. The inside of the switch looks like a miniature version of what I imagine the guts of a nuclear reactor must be like. I have no idea whats going on in this thing but will likely disassemble today.

I've also finally found the idle screw. I'm not going to mess with idle or the sync screws any more until my carb tune arrives this week. Suffice to say that I've probably got the bike so badly out of sync that any more piss poor work isn't going to help until I have a correct tool.

I did get in another 15 mile slow speed ride around the neighborhood to get the seafoam working in the crankcase. I have noticed what I think is a low speed wobble, but this could just be from the completely unsafe tires. I can't find any side to side wobble in the rear when its on the center stand. Have been reading some other threads about the wobble and will check the steering head bearings at some point.

Any ideas about the turn signal switch would be appreciated.

[Axel]

Seafoam in the oil

In my experience the Seafoam in the crankcase treatment is not meant for riding . I usually run the engine through the revs on the center stand with a fan for 20 mins . Then drain and add new oil . I know it proabaly doesnt mention this on the can but wiser men than I have suggested this .

[rlundy]

Thanks for the tip Axel. I was planning to change the oil by next weekend as soon as my filter arrives. I also didn't think it should be in there for that long.

[Axel]

Bearing concerns

I dont think the length of time matters . The concerns are that the bearings will not be properly lubed under load and cause undue wear .Somebody who rebuilds engines can probably explain this better . Some have used Varsol in the crankcase with the oil for the same reasons but it was always a short term ,no load situation again .

[bikerphil]

turn signal switch

Recent thread regarding turn sig. switch trouble....

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20318

[tarzan]

Your wobble could very well be bad tires.If you have never went from old tires to new,in my experience it makes a huge diffrence.
Also if I were you I would save a lot of misery now and remove those carbs and disassemble them completely and clean them all.There are plenty of threads here to help you through this.So many people get one of these old bikes that have sat or have been poorly maintained and then try to fix a carb or patch this or that together and end up spending great amounts of time chasing their tails.Some times to the point of getting tired of it and getting rid of it.
If you do it right the first time it will not only save lots of time but you will have a pretty good idea that you wont get stranded somewhere.
Sorry dont mean to preach ,just want to help.
Oh and I have a carb-tune and they are awesome.
Good luck
Rick