Valve Springs

[dbeardslee]

Anyone know what the service limits are on the inner and outer valve springs? Couldn't find it on the fiche and all my Haynes manual says is 35.6mm for inner and 39.9mm for outer. Unfortunately it only lists these as "fee lengths" and doesn't say if that's what they are new, or where they need to be replaced.

[Flatlander]

"If the free lenght of any spring has decreased more than 2mm (0.008 in) from its specification, replace spring".
Right out of my book. Hope that helps.

[trbig]

I have never heard of anyone floating a valve in these bikes no matter how many miles they had on them. I took my head in last time to get worked on and I actually had one of the outer springs broke... it was still running fine.


Do what you want, but I would throw them back in (There is a correct end that goes up... tighter wound end to the top) and go.


Tod

[Flatlander]

Originally posted by Flatlander
"If the free lenght of any spring has decreased more than 2mm (0.008 in) from its specification, replace spring".
Right out of my book. Hope that helps.

Added too many 0's, it was supposed to be .080 in.
And it also said to check with a valve spring compression guage. This will also show a symptom of a fatigued spring.

[Flatlander]

Originally posted by trbig
I have never heard of anyone floating a valve in these bikes no matter how many miles they had on them. I took my head in last time to get worked on and I actually had one of the outer springs broke... it was still running fine.


Do what you want, but I would throw them back in (There is a correct end that goes up... tighter wound end to the top) and go.


Tod

My book says: "NOTE: All valve springs must be installed with greater pitch upward as shown." I think it is saying just the opposite of what you are saying, unless I'm missunderstanding what you are stating.

[79XS11F]

Greater pinch means more tightly wound ... There is a similar note for fork springs which I am working on and it says greater pinch goes down. The photo shows the more tightly end going in first
Rob

[dbeardslee]

I was under the impression from a previous post that the tighter end goes down.

Flat - the 2mm number is helpful, unfortunately I still don't know if the numbers in the book (35.6mm and 39.9mm)are for new or worn. I'll probably end up taking trbig's advice and put them back in. Bike's only got 34k miles on it, but it sat for several years before I got my hot little hands on it and I'm sure some of the springs were compressed during that time.

[trbig]

You guys are correct, I wasn't. The tighter wound section would go down closest to the valve face.




The inside spring may be harder to distinguish. One thing you can remember, is that the outside spring is spun in a clockwise direction while the inside spring will be spinning in a counter-clockwise direction. This should help you keep the correct side up.

Sorry for the mixup.

Tod

[dbeardslee]

Thanks trbig. I'm mixed-up most of the time anyway, so I barely noticed

[trbig]

I'm mixed-up most of the time anyway

Apparently, I'm a member of the same club!

[79XS11F]

Speaking of "floating" valves ... the mag I have on hopping up the XS1100 states rather bluntly that the 1100 does in deed float her valves even at moderate RPM. Replacing stock valve springs with heavier springs is considered mandatory for this engine to run its best.
Rob

[Flatlander]

Originally posted by 79XS11F
Speaking of "floating" valves ... the mag I have on hopping up the XS1100 states rather bluntly that the 1100 does in deed float her valves even at moderate RPM. Replacing stock valve springs with heavier springs is considered mandatory for this engine to run its best.
Rob

I will have to agree with this also.
Since I have bent a valve in my 81'h. No marks on the piston at all. I have come to the conclusion that at the time this bent valve happened to me I was in very high rpm's, and floated a or some valves. Well, very high rpm's for a 27 year old valve train. My opinion: If you are running everything original on these, be carefull of high rpm's! Because before you know it "here comes Mr. Piston".
I have read that even in installation of the cams, some have installed them incorrectly and while rotating the crank by hand never herd or felt a thing. And had bent sevel valves. So be very carefull and enjoy !

[Flatlander]

Originally posted by dbeardslee
I was under the impression from a previous post that the tighter end goes down.

Flat - the 2mm number is helpful, unfortunately I still don't know if the numbers in the book (35.6mm and 39.9mm)are for new or worn. I'll probably end up taking trbig's advice and put them back in. Bike's only got 34k miles on it, but it sat for several years before I got my hot little hands on it and I'm sure some of the springs were compressed during that time.

The inner spring is 35.6 mm, Intake/Exhaust. 33.6 mm or less= Replace.
The outer spring 39.9 mm, Intake/Exhaust. 37.9 mm or less= Replace.

[dbeardslee]

Thanks all. Flat - those were the numbers I was lookin' for
I appreciate the help.

[Flatlander]

Originally posted by trbig
You guys are correct, I wasn't. The tighter wound section would go down closest to the valve face.




The inside spring may be harder to distinguish. One thing you can remember, is that the outside spring is spun in a clockwise direction while the inside spring will be spinning in a counter-clockwise direction. This should help you keep the correct side up.

Sorry for the mixup.

Tod

Direction of coil, could get confused, is from top to bottom. Even if you are holding it upside down.
This although will not help you to figure out what is top or bottom of the spring, it will tell you just that it is the inner or outter.

Wow that even confused me. Set the spring on the bench, look at it from a over head veiw, if the spring starts in the CW, it's the outer. CCW it's the Inner.
Now what I was trying to explain is, now turn the spring over, and they are still the same direction. This CW/CCW direction will not tell you what side is up. It will only tell you if it is a Inner or Outer spring.