Clutch and Idle

[roach25681]

So I finally get my bike running today after it sat for 5 or 6 years and I did lots of modifications. First question....the clutch will not disengage. I did a search and found that you can put it in third gear and rock the bike, or jack the rear up and bang it into gear a couple of times to free up the plates. Would these be the best options to try before I pull the cover off and disassemble the clutch or do I just need to bite the bullet and disassemble?

Second question....I have pod filters and a dual straight pipe setup made from a stock 4-1 system. I have gone through the carbs 4 times, installed new pilots (stock size) and new #127.5 mains. The bike revs hard and strong and sounds awesome but I cant get it to idle to save my life. I started with the pilot screws at 1 1/4 turns then increased in stages to 3 1/2 turns. Still wouldnt idle. Any ideas? If you tell me I need to pull the carbs off again for something I think I may shoot you (fair warning). Thanks for the help!

[TopCatGr58]

Sing along with me now.....

To the Hues Corp. tune Rock the boat! :P

"Rock the Bike, Rock the bike baby,
Rock the bike, Don't tip the bike over"

I just don't like the idea of slamming it into gear with it running from a dead stop! Also, you might try putting a few ounces of MMO in it, and warming it up, and then actuating the clutch lever some and see if it feels like it's come free, and then at idle try to put it in gear!? BTW, don't run the engine for more than 5 minutes after the MMO, and don't put any LOAD on it! Just drain the old oil out and change the filter as well afterwards. MMO really removes lots of varnish and gum and sludge from everything!

However, you won't know how good/bad the frictions are, and the SPRINGS are most likely compressed from age, and so you won't be getting the proper tension=slippage anyways! So....I vote for "Open Clutch surgery"!

Now, the carbs! 127.5 is a fair jump from stock IF you used the 110 base, but not so much if you used the 120 base, but it's still 4 sizes larger than what's on my 81 with Indy and 4-1 pipes, and I have modest plug color, and using stock pilots! However, with that extreme level of airflow, and essentially no backpressure, you will probably need to go up on the pilot jet size since you got no affect with over 3 turns out of the pilot screw! Are you floats set to close to 23mm? And did you leave OFF the pilot jet tower rubber plugs? Yours is an 80SG IIRC, the pilot jet towers are to be open to the bowl!

Also, have you verified that you otherwise do NOT have any vacuum leaks around your manifolds, synch port caps, manifold head mating surface, carb butterfly shaft seals?!

Also, can you rig up a washer on a bolt in the end of your straight pipes to allow you to create a little bit of restriction? JAT!
T.C.

[skids]

TC, with mmo in the crankcase, how much do you use?

[TopCatGr58]

Hey Skids,

It's a pretty good solvent, so that's why I suggested just a few ounces....using it like an engine flush, not to keep in it all the time.

However, here's a quote from their FAQ's:

ADDED TO ENGINE OIL

How much MMO do I add to the crankcase?
Marvel recommends replacing between 10 and 25 percent of your motor oil with MMO. For example, if the crankcase capacity is 5-quarts, add 4 quarts of your favorite motor oil and one quart of Marvel Mystery Oil. If you get your oil changed at a “quick-lube” facility, bring a quart of Marvel with you and ask them to add it to your engine in lieu of one quart of traditional motor oil.

Can MMO be used with synthetic motor oils?
Yes, MMO is compatible with synthetic, semi-synthetic blends and regular types of motor oils.

Can I use MMO to replace all of my regular engine oil?
No, you cannot use MMO to replace all the oil in the crankcase. The maximum amount of MMO to be used is 25% of crankcase capacity.

The above sure sounds like they say that it can be added and LEFT IN the engine oil, but I wouldn't feel comfortable doing that to our high revving engines, but "THEY" say it is an OIL! YMMV!
T.C.

[roach25681]

I actually put a little MMO in with the fresh oil when I changed everything before startup. Although I didnt know I would need to change it again so soon, so thanks. (EDIT) Just say the above post and as I recall, I only added maybe 1 1/2 ounces to the oil so... BTW TopCat...Im a long winded typer...which makes me feel as though I say to much in my posts sometimes so Ive kept it short on purpose. Guess I should just be myself and talk everyones head off. I hear the term "TMI" way to much but then again, thats usually when speaking of topics unrelated to motorcycling. Anyways, the two vacumn ports on the rubber intake boots that connected to the stock pertcocks are uncapped. I could have sworn I read somewhere on here that this was the proper thing to do in this case...but I may be wrong. On the jet sizing, I used the 120 base for my resizing purposes. I figured this would be a decent size to start with, especially since I cant order extra sets of jets to often. Funds dont allow that at this point. And I never had any rubber pilot jet caps to begin with so yes, they are off.

And yes, Id rather not rock the bike but I figured I may give it a try first. But I wouldnt be to dissapointed if I ended up having to break into the clutch itself. Although this will be my first ever attempt at a motorcycle clutch. Any tips besides whats in the Tech Tips section?

And yes, I was planning on doing the washer mod in the pipes until I either made some baffles or ordered some. Although she sound so gooood with open pipes. The louder and deeper the better to me.

[TopCatGr58]

Anyways, the two vacumn ports on the rubber intake boots that connected to the stock pertcocks are uncapped. I could have sworn I read somewhere on here that this was the proper thing to do in this case...but I may be wrong.

Sorry, but you were wrong! Not sure what it might have been refering to, but the synch ports ALL need to be capped off, or attached to some other vacuum function, like the petcocks for a standard, or the octy for a special! So..that's probably the problem right there! Turn your pilots back down to 1.5 turns and try them again, it'll probably idle for you with those vacuum LEAKS sealed!

With only a couple of ounces in the crank I don't think you will need to change it anytime soon after all, after reading their FAQ. With 32 oz per quart, times 3= 96, you've barely got about 2% of MMO in there, vs. their suggested 10-25%!

Good luck with the carbs, let us know!
T.C.

[roach25681]

Thanks TopCat. You sir, are a lifesaver. Or at least thats what Ive come to decide on my own. I must have gotten confused between capped and uncapped. I'll cap 'em off tomorrow since I have a Sportster tank. Anyways, I only added the MMO with the oil just because I had some left over from pouring in the spark plug holes before I cranked the engine over by hand a while back. Im glad I dont need an oil change already. That $6qt oil price for Mobil1 15-50 synthetic doesnt make me smile. Well, I will work on the idle tomorrow before I try to free the stuck clutch and let you know how it goes. Thanks for the help!

[prometheus578]

Top Cat... a great life saver, but a lousey singer.
"Rock the bike.. don't tip the bike over...!"
AHAHHAahhaahhaa

[skids]

It didn't make me smile either when my clutch started slipping while it was still in spec!

Originally posted by roach25681
That $6qt oil price for Mobil1 15-50 synthetic doesnt make me smile.

[prometheus578]

"If I may..."

I believe that Skids might be referring to the fact that members report clutch slippage with synthetic oils.
I've also encountered noisy bikes that suddenly quiet down after an oil change... changing back to regular oil.
I'm not a fan of putting synthetics in bikes that don't call for it.

[skippy344]

I concur Pro

I did an oil change and put in synthetic, and my clutch started slipping, the bike was noisy, it smoked and leaked.

I replaced the clutch and went back to Dino and now she is quieter, the clutch is nice and tight, no leaky, but I still smoke a little.

When I buy the new rig, I'll take Packmule down to the frame and do a restore, including an engine rebuild. I can't be without a bike!

Since our bikes have a wet clutch, and synthetic is smaller on the molecular level, and way more slippery, it really shouldn't be used in our old bikes. Dino works just fine, and is cheaper.

my $.02

greg

[skippy344]

OOPs,

Can someone put this response under the "clutch and idle" thread.

The computer guy doesn't know how to use his computer!

I'm such a dork!

greg

[trbig]

I'm such a dork!

I concur Greg!!



Tod

[skippy344]

Nicely played, Tod

[prometheus578]

"Hey T.C., can you move alla these to the other thread?"

Triumphs take fully synthetic,
Victory's take synthetic blend,
Kawasaki's take regular oil.
In regards to old Yamaha's...
Run what the engineers designed for it.
Again, just my opinion.