Need Help!!!!!!!!

[frmrby69]

I recently purchased a 1980 XS1100LG and the owner had only had the bike running twice over three years ago. After getting the ride home I decided the best way to start was to do all the basics (plugs, oil,clean gas tank, check compression) before doing anything to try and get it running. Of course that all went good so I moved on to pulling the carbs and going straight thru all of them as the instructions in this forum entailed (A LONG TEDIOUS JOB!!!!). But all went well and 8 hours later I had carbs the looked like brand new (I completely un-assembled them and tanked them for 45 min in carb cleaner acid and re-assembled). Put them on the bike and it took right off and runs perfect. But now after running for 3 min #2 and #4 exhaust pipe got red hot. So I let it cool off until this morning and started the bike again (it took right off and idles perfect again). I ran the bike for 30 to 45 seconds and shut it down. I could not touch the #2 or #4 pipe again and I could hold my hand on #1 and #3. They were warn but not hot. I hope someone can help me figure this out as I am getting very frustated. Thanks for your help.

[randy]

1 and 3 probably aren't getting any fuel

[fredintoon]

How hot?

Hi Frmrby,
you mean red hot as in glow in the dark red hot or just effin' hot compared to #1 & #3?. If #s 1 & 4 or #s 2 & 3 share a problem, most likely it's ignition. If only one cylinder or a pair fed by different coils acting up, most likely it's carbs.
But not always, my most recent "carb" problem coincidentally fixed itself when I fitted 4 new sparkplugs.
That said, most likely you duffed up the carb cleaning job. You'll find "triple clean" mentioned a lot on this list; what it really means is that most folks finally get their carbs clean after the 3rd go-around. Others will bag on about "dipping" your carbs unless you remove ALL the rubber bits INCLUDING the butterfly shaft seals because the dip jollop will dissolve them. I say the butterfly seals can stay if you only dip for an hour or two.
I learned a good test for pipe temperature as a boy watching mother iron dad's shirts.
Lick your finger, dab it quickly on and off the pipe. You should hear & feel a spurt of steam as the spit boils off your finger.
That's hot enough.
Fred Hill, S'toon.

[frmrby69]

All the cylinders seem to be getting fuel and all of them have spark. All the plugs look the same. They are slightly black but all look like they are at least firing some. And the bike runs perfect. But should the #2 and #4 pipes get that hot. I am afraid to run it this way.

And yes I mean glowing hot after running for aprox 3 minutes.

How else would I now whether a cyclinder is not firing?
Should I just pull the carbs again and go thru them again?

[TopCatGr58]

Hey Frmrby,

On the top front of the carbs are the pilot jet screws, that sit down in recessed tubes. Did yours still have the brass caps in place?? IF so, then you possibly didn't get them as clean as should, as well as not being able to tune the idle circuit. Your 2 superhot cylinders are probably actually running a bit too lean.

If those caps are still there, you can drill thru them just about 3/16" thick, use a small bit, and put tape up around the 3/16" point to show you where to stop, or ease up so that when you break thru you won't damage the pilot screw heads. Then screw a sheet metal screw into the cap, and use some pliers to wiggle and remove the cap and throw away!!!

When removing the pilot screws, there are small metal and rubber washers that don't always come out with the screw.

But...if they were not capped, then what did you set the pilot screws to.....~1 1/2 turns out from gentle seat??
T.C.

[fredintoon]

Something ain't right

Hi Frmrby,
that's all I can say. All the pipes should be at the same temperature +/- a degree or so. If two glow red and two don't, something needs fixing. Try swapping 1 & 4 plug leads and 2 & 3 plug leads. No change? Swap back then swap the spark plugs. Still no change? it ain't the plugwires or the plugs. Gotta be carbs.
I have an '80 Special, it has 1 & 2 carbs linked by a T to feed fuel and 3 & 4 ditto.
Is your fuel feed different? Is it possible that 1 & 3 can be fuel starved while 2 & 4 are fed? Fuel starvation on the cylinders with cool pipes is the most likely answer and all you can do is clean the carbs. Again.
Or, just possibly, are the plugwires mixed up? One coil fires cylinders 1 & 4 while the other feeds cylinders 2 & 3. Try swapping the plug wires on 1 & 3.
Fred Hill, S'toon.

[frmrby69]

Thanks all for ideas. It looks like I'm back to the carb bench but will make sure all plug wires are correct first. Back to the garage for a few more hours will post results later tonight.

Thanks again for all the advice!!!!!!!!!!!!

[frmrby69]

Well all I just removed the carbs again and went thru all again all looked good but ran another can of carb cleaner thru them with a 100 psi air. Removed caps and did adjustments as above. Now all the pipes get cherry hot. I can't believe that the exhaust glowing is a norm for the engine but please let me know if I'm wrong. Not sure what to do at this point. ANY ADVICE?

THANKS

[ScottsXS]

not to throw a wrench in the works but when a cyl leans out it usually produces more heat and detonation i.e. burnt valves, pistons, combustion chambers

[skids]

No. the exhaust should not be glowing. You are going to burn or suck a valve. Are you using a box fan while running in engine without the bike in motion?

Originally posted by frmrby69
Well all I just removed the carbs again and went thru all again all looked good but ran another can of carb cleaner thru them with a 100 psi air. Removed caps and did adjustments as above. Now all the pipes get cherry hot. I can't believe that the exhaust glowing is a norm for the engine but please let me know if I'm wrong. Not sure what to do at this point. ANY ADVICE?

THANKS

[frmrby69]

No box fan as it only takes aprox 1 min for the exhaust to get blazing hot. I am just at a lost of what is causing it. I am aware that lean fuel makes heat but i can not figure out what is causing it. That is where the problem lies.

Thanks for all the help.

[TopCatGr58]

Okay,

Have you looked down the end of the exhaust pipe mufflers with a flashlight to ensure some little creatures haven't made some nice nests in there blocking the exhaust??

What did you set the float heights at....the 80LG should be at 23mm, not 25.7mm.

What jets are in it, did you put the OEM's back in, or use some from a kit??

Is the vacuum advance unit hose connected to the #2 carb body port? Have you taken the timing cover off of the engine and checked to make sure the timing advance plate moves easily, and that the vacuum advance mechanism works with vacuum applied to the hose, and that once the advance unit rotates, hold the vacuum in the hose to see if it release...leaking??

I remember from car tuning days, if timing was too retarded, would make an engine run hot !!?? JAT!

Once it's cooled down enough to start again, spray some carb cleaner/wd-40 around the carbs butterfly shafts, and boots, vacuum ports to make sure you don't have any vacuum leaks...changes in rpm indicates you do! Although you only soaked the bodies for 45 minutes as FRED has stated should be safe, could have possibly damaged the butterfly shaft seals and be getting vacuum leaks=leaning!?
T.C.

[frmrby69]

Thanks topcat will try all advice another question I have is firing order and the spark wires from the left coil go to 1 and 4. The wires are crossed (still the left coil but the left wire goes to 4 and the right wire goes to 1) and the same with the right coil the left wire goes to 3 and the left wire goes to 2. I am not sure if this is right. Please let me know if this is right.

And also do you know if a rebuild kit is still available for these carbs and where and how much.

Thanks again for all your help.

[frmrby69]

Hopefully I can answer all the questions you asked in your last post. I did remove the butterflies when I tanked them but the seals are getting hard and I really need to put a kit in all the carbs. But my goal was to make sure there was not any drastic problems with the bike before putting much money into it.

I did not reset the floats and I put the stock jets back in it. The vacumI will tomorrow night check the vacuum advance as you said earlier and the vacuum hose is connected to the #2 carb.

This is the first big bike I have owned that was a dead on arrival at purchase, so I am learning how all this works. All the bikes I have owned in the past were new bikes that I did not have to work on much. But by my user name I am a farmer and work on tractor, trucks, and cars all the time. But bikes are different. I really aprreciate your help as I am learning and will pass my experience on to others on this site as I learn.

Thanks again

[TopCatGr58]

Hey again,

The coil wires crossed is nothing...these bikes use a wasted spark system, so both wires fire each time the coil fires, one for the power stroke of 1 cylinder, the other happens on the exhaust stroke of the other cylinder. You have them connected correctly, 1-4 are paired, and 2-3 are paired!

Full blown carb kits with slide needles and main nozzles and such are usually not needed. Mostly you need the float bowl gasket, the new rubber tipped float needle valve and seat and O-ring for it. As long as the jets are what you want (Vs. rejetting for mods like Indy filters and aftermarket exhaust), then just soaking and putting them back in is good enough!

The basic kits can be gotten from Partsnmore.com, but also from MikesXS(650 web site but will work with xs11). The MikesXS kit is #48-1408 which will fit your carbs, remember you don't need the pilot jet tower rubber plug..just throw it away or save it for something else! They are $12.00 ea, and you get free shipping with orders over $35.00.

You can also find deals on Ebay, George Fix sells kits, also remember seeing links posted about a new company in Canada selling complete with slide needles and such.

Also, the throttle butterfly shaft seals can be gotten from MikesXS, they are #48-5021 at $5.00 ea, and knowledgable folks have posted that they work on our carbs, I have not gotten them or tried them!

No telling what the PO had done to the bike, best to check the float levels while you are in there!

I had only worked on cars before getting my XS11, you're in good company here!
T.C.