Carburetors are such a PITA!!!!

[xs650mike]

Originally posted by TopCatGr58
Trying NOT to be too controversial!!

Gee, and all this time I thought TC stood for "Too Controversial"! Are you saying that I should soak those XS650 carbs which sat for 10 years? Aww darn!

Think I'll try the Promethius method first and if it doesn't work I'll soak 'em. He did say some some of the carbs he's worked on have been sitting 10 years or more. Additionally, my friend Britbike Jim also says just use spray cleaner. Some of his bikes sat 40 or 50 years, he claims once the fuel evaporates whatever damage is already done and it then doesn't matter how long they sit as long as they haven't corroded. I sold my boat to an old friend, old 75 horse Johnson. Hadn't run the engine since 1996 and I never drained the carbs. He put in a fresh battery, spray cleaned the carbs and got it running within an hour...took it for a spin on the lake, said it ran fine. Also I'm really lazy and if there's an easier way I'll try that first.

[jacksf]

Hey Mike...i'm up for lazy

[Shuriken]

I have worked on 3 sets of XS11 carbs and on all the carbs for the bikes listed in my signature, and on all the bikes I no longer have.

Since I only buy old junker bikes, I have had my fair share of "basket cases." Sometimes I just sit and stare at parts and wonder how someone could have possibly let them deteriorate so badly, chemically fuse together, and corrode as they do.

In general, however, when I get a junker that won't start, I go through the basics you see in every manual: correct fuel/air mixture, decent compression, and spark at the right time. Once I establish spark and compression, I tear into the carb.

If the bike does not run at all or just runs poorly when I get it, I will always go into the carb. If it runs well I might not. Nearly all bikes I've had run poorly or not at all, so in we go to the carb.

It's always great when you get thinking to yourself that you've seen the worst set of carbs ever - and then you are surprised all over again. I've had to clean some seriously horrid carbs - the kind that contain material that NASA couldn't identify....

The point I'm getting to is that I've done some with just cleaner in the can and some that I've soaked in chemdip.

I prefer chemdip but it requires a careful and thorough disassembly. But since we all have to start somewhere.... I learned the little o-rings here and there swell up to the size of a cheerio if you leave them in during the soak!

Spray cleaner works well but I still always soak some parts. At a minimum, I like to soak the carb tops, the float bowls, and all of the jets.

If you are comfortable fully disassembling the carbs enough to get ALL the rubber components removed, soaking the carb bodies is a great thing, especially if followed up with wire and compressed air. They come out really clean, on the inside and out. You can follow up on the cleanliness with polish and get a great looking set of carbs.

Honestly, the most predictable and trouble free carbs I had were the ones I soaked. But if you are just starting with carbs, you can mess them up much easier than you can fix them. Complete disassembly is not out of reach but is time consuming, requires great patience, and should be done methodically and carefully.

If the carbs are so gunked up in the bowls and generally look horrid, a soak and compressed air may be necessary. However, a lot of good cleaning can be done with spray cleaner, wire, and compressed air just fine.

The time you spend on the carbs pays off, though. The closer you get them to how they were new, the closer your bike will run like a new bike. I really think the carbs are the heart of the XS11.

There are a lot of cool resources on carb cleaning. One in particular is motorcyclecarbs.com.

If you get tired of carbs, there is always fuel injection....

[xs650mike]

Well I do know enough not to soak the rubber (or neoprene) parts in carb cleaner and that the butterfly seals have to be removed lest the butterflies lock up. I've been told that Yamaha carb cleaner is safe for those soft parts, anyone know for sure if that's really true?

Useless fact: Up until sometime before the Civil War (which wasn't at all civil) a butterfly was known as a flutterby. No one knows exactly when or why the usage changed.

Definition: Butterfly Seals = The "don't ask, don't tell" branch of the Navy seals. LOL:

[prometheus578]

That's an odd name!

Hey xs650Mike,

I sold my boat to an old friend, old 75 horse Johnson.

Why do you call your buddy 75 Horse Johnson? Was he a rancher, or sumptin'? Must be a good story there. I knew a guy we called "Ol' Three-Fingered Dave, not too much of a story there, but it was descriptive. 'course, then there was Peg, the girl with the wooden leg.
"I was engaged once to a girl with a wooden leg... but I got mad and broke it off."
Oh... I see...

T.C. ... No, I agree there may be times when it's warranted. (Hmmm.. or should that be "Yes", I agree there may be times...)
I was just, maybe falsly, getting the impression that newer owners, after reading the posts here, may think that they have to run out and get a can of carb dip before doing a simple cleaning.
All removable parts and most channels can easily be cleaned by hand. Howsomever... if you run across an internal passageway, like one with a bend in it that can't be cleared by spray nor wire, then a soak may be inorder. Even then, usually one can just tilt the carbs at an angle, fill the hole with spray and let it soften for a while. Shame to disassemble a whole bank o' carbs just to get to #2 or#3 to dip it, when a spray would do the job.
Who knows... since work is slow right now, tomorrow I might look at the carbs on the Special I just layed my hands on. (was drowned in a flood and then sat outside for 5 years)
They may be candidates for a dip, but I'll try a spray first.
(The spray will work... I don't care HOW LONG IT TAKES ME! The spray will work! I'm right... I'M ALWAYS RIGHT!)

(Why, yes. I feel better, now. Thanks for askin')

[xs650mike]

I could tell a few stories about old 75 horse Johnson but I won't since he's still alive, but soon. Actually 75 horse was short for 75 horsepower Johnson (aka "Super Silent") and thereby hangs a tale, for another day of course.

[prometheus578]

75 horses?

and thereby hangs a tale, for another day of course

That'd be 75 tails, yes?

[xs650mike]

Tales, not tails.

[GNEPIG]

.. if he's got a 75 horse johnson i bet his women are happy.. and far from super silent
.. ok since we are shamlessly throwing experiance around here i will too,
when i worked for the local yama/kawa/suz dealership here [yea all three in the same building] i seemed to get all the old crusty bikes heaped onto my lift as well, you know, all the stuff that no one else wanted to touch.. i did'nt mind, i like the old stuff better any way and it still beat working in my dads junk yard.. got two or three carb cleans a week, it paid 3 hours flat rate for a set of 4. working flat rate you had to work fast to make any money and if you had a come back you did'nt get paid to fix it again, so you learned fast to do it right the first time. in the past 10 years i've worked at two other cycle shops since then, besides the one i work at now and every day still holds a new learning experiance
.. at first i tried that gyrating bucket of toxic waist ..i new better than to put the carb bodies in it, but it was ok for all the brass and aluinum parts, but it seemed like a big waist of time and you still had to clean the parts after any way .. did you every loose or drop any parts in the bottom of that can and have to stick your hand in there ,you get that stuff on your skin for about 3 to 4 mimutes and at first you get this cooling feeling then your skin starts to swell up and and the burning sensation starts, about that time you know somthing is wrong your heading briskly to rinse/wash it off,
as your washing you start to notice how pale the affected skin is and how big your fingers look and as it's cooling down you see your skin wrinkle right before your eyes and as you feel the numding/tingling sinsation you start to wander just what kind of a natzi commie pinko fag could think up such nasty sh!t! ..then i realise it's no ones falt but mine and deside to never use it again
.. i have had real good luck cleaning even the nastiest of carbs the spray, compressed air and spring way.. most of the nasty stuff usualy stays low in the carbs were the float bowls hold the gas ... gas evaporates from the transfer ports up top before it gets a chance to turns to yuk in most cases
.. an early learning experiance shared