New around here...with a problem

[Artic_rider]

Would like to first off say hello to everyone out in cyber rider land, and would like to ask you all why the heck aren't you all out riding? Anyways, bought a xs1100 a couple of weeks ago, for a project, fixer-up (I'll post some pics...you're all going to laugh) The P.O. was kinda a chopper wanna-be, and beasted this bike like non other. Currently she's flat black (frame, swingarm, motor...you get the point) and looks like a f'n tank. Oh well, after seeing some of the pics around here, I know there is a lot of potential for it. Anyways, I'll get to the point...cause there's always a point right? I've done two days of searching on this site, checked google, and even talked to a couple of mechs at work, and we can't figure out a problem. Having a little electircal problem here.

Can't get the bike to start...simple enough I guess, but here's what I have poked and prodded around with testing. I turn the key on, and I have power...lights work, signals, breaks. Now I go to engauge the starter (press the button) and nah-dah. Not even getting a click on the starter sylinoid. Pulled apart the controls, and checked things out with a voltmeter, and got nothing in terms of power. Off came the seat and tank, and I traced the wire back through the harness, and it checked out good. Not cracked, or worn. the wire went to the starter syli...so I check it, and theres power to the syli (direct connection off the battery, so no reason why there shouldn't be power) Figured the syli was pooched, so I tried to hot wire it. Ol' screwdriver trick, shorting out the posts. Bike fired up right away when I did that...but as soon as it removed the screwdriver, it would die. Curiosity got the better of me, and I ended up having to replace the starter syliniod (don't ask...curiosity can be costly...lol) and with the new starter syliniod in...still the same problem.

The battery is new, starter syliniod is new, plugs are new ( and were working perfect) up until it decided to crap the ol' bed on me. I don't really want to cart it off to the yam dealer, mainly cause they have this attitude that if it ain't new, or bought from them, your a good ol' second class customer, and I am pretty good with a wrench. Five ten years ago, I would have had no other choice but to take it to them, but I am hoping you guys can give me a good idea as to what is going on, or wrong. Thanks for the help guys, and I sure as hell have found a new forum...err...home...whatever you want to call it.

Artic_rider

[TopCatGr58]

Hey there Robert,

Okay, your profile says it's an 80 XS11, but not whether it's a Standard or Special, you can determine that many ways, if it has the knee recesses in the tank, and square headlight, it's most likely a standard, teardrop tank and round headlight=Special. Also, check the serial number from the neck of the frame and check the listings.

Secondly, the electronics are very susceptible to corrosion, and many gremlins can be cured by simply pulling apart ALL connectors, and cleaning the contacts and reassembling. Aside from that, let's try troubleshooting?

There is a tap off the the starter solenoid circuit that goes directly to the TCI unit, bypassing the Coils Ballast Resistor to provide stronger spark for starting, but once started, it is routed THRU the resistor to keep voltages lower to not burn up the coils. IF the resistor is bad, then it won't allow juice to the coils at all, and so jumping the Solenoid sends current to the coils, once you UNjump it, it's going thru the resistor.....OR NOT. The Ballast Resistor is under the tank, just above the head, where the rubber tank mounts are, should have 2 red/white wires going to it, you can bypass it for a short while to test whether it's the problem...if the bike keeps running after unjumping the solenoid, then you've found the problem!

Also, the Kill switch in the same handlebar control where the starter button is can get messed up, preventing starting!! The starter button is just a GROUND to frame for the starter solenoid circuit, check to see if you have power coming to the button with the key on. ALSO ....check the fuse holder, notorious for the blades breaking off..best to replace it with Spade Fuse box...see tech tips! Okay, hope this gets you in the right direction, write back with more info if not!!

[Artic_rider]

Killswitch? did I mention the bike has been modified/chopperized...lol. When I first started exploring the problem, that was the first thing I "looked" for..lol...still haven't found one. Did manage to find the emergency flashers though. Anyways, I did test the starter switch yesterday, with and without the key on, and got nothing. I did not know about the coils ballast resistor though, and I am going to check it out in the morning (bike is parked at work right now, about 20 km away) Thanks so far Topcat...shall keep ya posted. One more question for you, since I am still waiting for the repair man in the mail...in that forward controle box, with the starter switch, there is a red wire with a white line running down it. It's spliced in the controle box with another wire, same color. was wrapped in hockey tape ( I took the liberty to properly connect it with solder and shink tubing) anyways, what is that wire all about?

BTW... 80' xs1100sg vin starts with 3u9 (canadian edition of the special I do believe)

[prometheus578]

The key is the "KEY" to the prob.

I may be off on this one, but have found it twice this season on Kawasakis (20-25 years old)
Juice is going to the key switch, and when turned on, juice goes out to the lights, etc, but not the ignition/starting circuit. I've just looked at two different wiring diagrams, and the colors are different in both, so we'll have to play a little.
My Clymer's shows three wires to the key. Red going in (HOT), blue going out(Lights, etc), and an orange/yeller one which seems to run the whole show.
Anyway.. here's what I've run into. The contacts inside the key switch are honked. Test this at the wire connection.. should be behind the headlight. Since when you turn the key... you get lights, etc.... your test should show that the red wire is always hot, and when you turn the key, it charges the blue wire for the lights. Now, check the other wire, the possably orange yeller one. When you turn the key... does it get hot? If not... tear apart the key switch and clean the contacts with sandpaper.
May or maybe not be the prob, but is an easy first check.

[TopCatGr58]

Hey Robert,

That Red/white wire in the handlbar WAS the wires going to the kill switch, and being spliced together effectively bypasses or removes the quick kill function!

If you'll drop me an actual EMAIL then I can reply and send you a colorized copy of the wiring diagram for the 80SG, so that you can have it for a reference until your manual comes!!

The handlebar starter button should have a blue/white wire, and it shoud be energized with the key on. If not, then check that same wire at the solenoid, if it's energized there, then there's a break somewhere inbetween. You could also take a tap from the blue/white wire at the starter, and test it to ground, and if the starter does turn/engage, then you will have further proof of something amiss in that wire to the handlebar!?

As for the TCI, there should be a red/yellow wire coming directly off the main battery cable before the starter/solenoid that goes to the TCI, it's the main power for the TCI. There are 2 red/white wires to the TCI, one goes directly to the coils supplying the power, the other comes to the TCI, by way of a split connection either from the Starter circuit, or the ballast resistor depending on which is hot at the moment and that wire is the same red/white wire that comes from the handlebar's now non-existent Kill Switch. Thru the starter it's providing full 12 volts, but once started it comes thru the resistor providing about 9 volts!

Now....if the bike was really chopped, and they put some newer hi power coils like Accel or Dyno, then they may and should have removed/bypassed the ballast resistor since these newer coils have 3 ohms resistance, and the earlier model XS coils have 1.5, the resistor adds another 1.5 for a total of 3 ohms load on that circuit coming thru the TCI.
Continued good luck! T.C.

[Artic_rider]

It's Alive!!

After much thought, a lot of smokes, and a couple of beer, I finally got the ol girl to go. I ended up stripping all the wire coverings, and went through every connection ect. When they were all cleaned up, or replaced in a few cases, I still had nothing. Then I noticed a little back bax behind the fuse box...the cover to it was missing, same with the fuse that should have been there. grabbed a fuse, popped er in, and presto. Changed out the old inline for a new, weather proof one, and it is actually running a hell of a lot better then before. Just wanted to say thank to you guys that gave me some suggestions, even though it was something completly off the wall and so f'n simple, it really is great to see a bunch of riders come together and help out the new guys. Now it's time to clean the carbs, and then hook up with some other Canuks hopefully and go for a tour somewhere. thanks again all, and thanks for the new home page on my computer...lol

[TopCatGr58]

Hey Robert,

That's awesome. But, ahhhh, the old faulty separate Main Fuse trick, eh! Since you had SOME power, that's why we didn't necessarily suspect or suggest it, but glad you found it and fixed it.

Now, don't forget to check out the tech tips from the MAIN FORUM page, not just from the links in the left sidebar, you'll find lots of good tips and info regarding the carbs, and hopefully we won't see any posts from you about how to repair a broken float post! May your vacuum diaphragms not be holy, and your floats be boyant!
T.C.