Difference between the XS11 and XJ11

[pflinker]

Hello everyone,

Just bought an '82 XJ1100 and have been reading the forum with great interest. One question I have not been able to find is what are the main differences between the XS and XJ?

Just how different is the engine? Would a Clymer's manual for the XS help me on the XJ.

How about parts? Anybody ever put something together on what parts are interchangealbe between the different years and models?

Appreciate any information or advice the group has, you really have a great site here.

Paul Flinker
Florence, KY

[John]

The XJ is basically a updated XS. I've had two XJ's that I parted out, and two XS's. One was a parts bike (78E), and the other (80SG) is my daily driver. The drive line of the two bikes is pretty much the same. The swing arm and final drives are the same. The engines will swap around but the XJ has the YICS system, and the XS doesn't. That is just some passages that connect all of the intake ports together to help balance out the engine at idle and low speed. The carbs are the same , but there is a difference in how the choke is applied. The XS has a lever on the left side of the carbs, and the XJ uses a cable mounted to the left side handlebar switch gear. The front forks are different, and the rear of the XJ uses air shocks. The fuel tank and side covers are different. Some of the electrics are different, such as the ignition system, and that mess of an instrument cluster. The brakes will not interchange, but the wheels will work on a Special. I have a set of XJ wheels, and air shocks on my bike.
I was running an XJ engine, with the carbs from the 80SG for about 6-7 years, but I did a 1179cc big bore to my original engine, and I now have that one in the bike. There are many other differences, but some one else can jump in here to tell you what they are.

[Jerry]

This question has come up before; you might try the search function to get past posts.

Some differences have been noted. Others include:

XJ has:
LCD instrument cluster.
Air-adjustable front and rear suspension
5 gallon fuel tank
Square handlebars
Full TCI ignition...'black box' is unique, no mechanical vacuum advance
Different charging system. XJ uses a higher-output brush-type design. Engine case is wider on the right and shorter on the left than the XS. Some accessories, such as crash bars may not fit the XJ.
More complicated electronics, with side stand, neutral, and clutch sensors
Oil level gauge (sensor in oil sump) vs oil pressure gauge.
Carbs have a 54m inlet bell rather than the XS 52mm, and are jetted leaner.
Cosmetic differences, of course, but they include differnet rear sets (passenger footpegs) which are also used for muffler mounting. Going with XS or custom pipes means tinkering with the muffler mounts. Same is true if you go to hard luggage mounts like the Vetter; they use these same sets as anchor points and you will need to tinker if you put on non-XJ racks.
Different seat and mounting. You can't swap seats.
Front brake calipers use a different mount than the XS, so you can't swap calipers. However, you can swap rotors.
XJ uses a 'linked' braking system, where the rear and front-left caliper are activated from the rear brake. Some like it, some don't. Means there is a proportioning valve in there that the XS dos not have, and front master cylinder is smaller than the XS.
Fluid level sensors in both master brake cylinders and battery. Battery sensor can be bypassed ealily to use a non-sensor battery, see the write-up in Tech Tips, Electrical, Batteries.
Handlebars are adjustable up and down and in and out. I run one setting higher and wider than stock.
The previously mentioned YICS system means you have to have a special 'block-off' tool to synchonize the carbs. Again, see Tech Tips for getting or building one.

There are differences between XS models as well, but this is not the place to go into them! The XJ is most closely like the '81 Special. This is not a definitive list of differences, as you would need a separate list for each model year. Howver, it covers the basics.

So, will an XS manual be helpful? In a general sort of way, but for the specifics, such as schematics, there is enough difference to cause a lot of frustration. I would recommend getting the factory manual, or a CD from one of our list members (Rob Mills, host of the 2004 Bozeman Rally) that has parts list and manuals for the XJ as well as other XS 11s on it . Files are in PDF format, so all you need is a CD drive and Acrobat reader, which is a free download.

The XJ was sold in the US for only 1 year, 1982, and was sold in Canada and Mexico through 1984. This makes getting XJ specific parts a bit more of a challenge.

Welcome to the list. Glad to have another XJ represented!

[pflinker]

Wow,

Great to have such knowledgeable people available. You really gave me a great place to start.

One thing I was wondering about. The forks are different and Thai says the XJ has more support of its own the XS. Is a fork brace really needed on the XJ or did they redesign them to take care of the wobble problems?

Thanks,

Paul

[Jerry]

The XJ fender has an additional brace in it that makes it a bit more solid than the stock XS. Forks are unique because the bolt pattern for the calipers is different than on the XS, however you can swap complete sets of forks between bikes, and internal parts, like fork seals, springs, speedo drive, bearings, and other parts are shared between the XJ and other XS 11s that use the 'leading axle' style forks. (Axle does not go through the center of the fork.) There is a size difference in the leading axle vs standard axle for seals. Do a search on this topic and more details will come up.

I put a fork brace on my XJ and think it made a noticable difference. Would recommend it. Again, the XJ brace is different than the XS braces (2 styles, Special and Standard) because it has to rise more to clear the front fender. Fenders are different, you can't swap them back and forth, also due to mounting differences.

The XS and XJ 1100s were not known as great handlers when they were new, and 20+ years of wear have not helped. You can improve the handling by adding the fork brace, swapping out old brake lines (prefereably to braided stainless steel) and upgrading the shocks. Upgrade the fork springs to the progressive style. This gives smoother ride over small bumps without sacrificing load capacity or compromising handling characteristics.

You can tell by my comments that most of my attention has gone to improving the ride/handling/comfort of my XJ and I have not gone into the performace aspects, like custom exhausts, 4 into 1 systems, big bore kits, cams, and such. I was after a touring bike, so added the Vetter, luggage, and other comfort options. You will need to decide what you want out of your bike, and plan your upgrades accordingly.

Just a note on parts, or rather on Yamaha's part numbering system. Those parts that begin with 2H7 or 10M or have a letter in the first 3 characters are numbered for the first bike to use those parts. Your XJ's prefix is 10M. Most 10M parts will be unique to the XJ, but you will find parts from the original '79 XS11 (2H7) still used in your bike. These parts are interchangeable amoung all XS/XJ 1100s. In some cases the same parts were used in other Yamahas; brake rotors for same era 700 SECA models carry the same part numbers as the XS11. What causes some confusion is that in a few cases different part numbers will interchange; the XJ brake rotors (front) carry a 10M part number but the difference is only cosmetic; the XJ rotors are slotted but are completely interchangeable with the older XS units.

[pflinker]

Jerry,

Thanks for all the feedback, the information you have given me will be invaluable once I get started on the bike. I don't even pick it up until this weekend.

I bought this bike as a project, needed a little winter distraction. According to the owner the bike runs great, just needs a little TLC.

I'm not looking for a tourer, already have one, a 2000 Yamaha Venture that I've put 43,000 miles on. Wanted a smaller, lighter bike to play with and ride locally. Not that the XJ1100 is a little bike but it is 300+ pounds lighter than my Venture.

Paul

[Jerry]

Good luck with the XJ. I like mine, but the stock seat is terrible, IMHO. The first major upgrade I did was a new custom seat from Diamond Seat in Florida. At the time no one else was making an XJ seat, now you have Russell Day-Long and maybe Corbin to chose from as well. Last 2 will take your stock seat, use the pan, and build you a new seat. (Not sure of Corbin is doing this anymore...) Diamond has new fiberglass pans in stock, or they did when I bought mine a few years back, and will build you a new seat based on your weight, inseam, and height. Cost was $420.00, but it changed the XJ from a bike that was comfortable to ride 100 miles into one that can easily do 600 - 700 a day, and I've done that and more on more than 1 occasion. The Russell will be more in the $600 range. I had to swap the mounting 'fingers' from the old pan to the new one, ended up with 2 sets so both the old seat and Diamond seat are interchangeable.

I know it is a lot of money; I paid only $650 for the bike so putting a $420 seat on it really took a leap of faith, but no other single upgrade made such a big difference in the 'rideability' of the XJ.

[pflinker]

Confortable Seat

I know what you mean about a confortable seat. When I went back to riding about 5 years ago I started with a Honda Shadow, couldn't do more than 50 miles on that seat! Switched to a mustang seat and just rode and rode.

The seat on my Venture has been one of the real suprises. The stock seat is just great, riden many 500 mile days and 1000+ trips with no trouble or disconfort.

Since the XJ is a project bike for fun I will not be in any hurry to buy expensive items. When warm weather returns I'll give it some rides and see how it feels and go from there. I still expect that most of my major rides will be done on the Venture.

[Lamric]

What parts fit what

Hey Paul,

You can use XS Part Number Finder to find out which XS1100 models have your XJ1100 parts. Also has the XJ microfiche online.

Happy hunting.

[pflinker]

Parts Finder

Brian,

What a great site. Thanks for the link.

Paul

[MAXIMAN]

Originally posted by Jerry
...but it changed the XJ from a bike that was comfortable to ride 100 miles into one that can easily do 600 - 700 a day, and I've done that and more on more than 1 occasion. ...but no other single upgrade made such a big difference in the 'rideability' of the XJ.

That surprises me. When I got my XJ1100 in September, it was stock original with only 5300 miles (as I've stated several times).

I've taken "Zilla" on 3 road trips. Two were 800+ miles and one was 2500 miles...in the past 3 months. I've been in the saddle of that bike (stock seat) for 11 hours once and 12 hours another day.

Maybe I'm speaking out of ignorance, but every long trip I've taken I felt great. Even the next day or two I felt good. No soreness...wasn't tired. And I'm a 44 year old grandfather.

If a Corbin will improve the ride of an XJ1100 much better than the stock seat I'd be whistling zippa-dee-do-dah out my a$$.

If you have pics of your custom seat I'd love to see them. After reading your recommendation I may seriously consider a new saddle. Afterall the reason I bought this baby was to TOUR...TOUR...TOUR!

Thanks

[Pat Kelly]

Everyone is a different shape. Looks like you're XJ shaped . What a sign that you have the right bike for you.

[MAXIMAN]

pflinker

One thing I've heard about the XJ vs XS is the valve train. The obvious difference is the styling (gas tank, seat, etc.).

A local motorcycle guru where I live, informed me one difference was the valves on the XJ are larger than the XS and the timing on the XJ has been retarded to result in better gas mileage.

I dunno if it's true but....ther ya go.

[Jerry]

Timing on the XJ is different, full advance happens at a higher RPM. Change in valve size happened earlier, maybe '80 or '81? There have been some past posts on this. Another change made earlier and carried to the XJ is different compression ratio. First XS11s had 9.2 to 1, was dropped to 9.0 to 1 in later XS11s and the XJ. These changes, plus the YICS induction system, make the XJ the slowest (1/4 mile) bike of the 1100 series. Yamaha introduced the FJ as the 'performance' bike in the line as the XJ was being phased out.

I put together a web page that briefly notes differenced between the Diamond seat and the stock XJ seat. URL is:

http://idisk.mac.com/jerryfields/Pub...eat/index.html

I rode the stock seat for a year (2000) before ordering the seat that fall. By spring of 2001 I had the Diamond. Stock seat and I did not get along; I ended up wearing a support belt to keep my back from hurting on long trips.

[MAXIMAN]

Jerry thanks. I 'll check out the seat.

I can testify to the "sluggishness" of the XJ. Though it's no 'weakling" it's not nearly as hot as the early XS11.

For two up it has way more torque than my 750 and thus pulling power.

But one on one in the 1/4 mile I think Maxine can clip Zilla. She is simpy quicker than Zilla out of the hole.

As far as the compression issue I've had a local XS guru tell me a good TCI replacement with a modified advance curve will partially rectify that issue. Of course he said my mileage would drop to. He suggested ERD out of New Zealand. They built performance ignitions and TCI for vintage UJMs. I've seen their units on eBay. Dunno how good they are.