Won't Start after adjusting cam chain.

[zeeboid]

i went to adjust the Cam Chain, and I goofed it up. it was making a clicking nosie that was getting worse, allong with ease of starting. i went to adjust the cam chain, and i think i cranked it over too far, or the wrong way or something. when starting, it used to sound like... wurr--wurr--wurr-- till it starts... for one, i can't get it to start... for two, it goes wurr.wurr--wurr-- two close together and one seperate after, repeating of corse, forever with no starting...

I took off the cam cover and on the intake cam, the sprocket that the chain goes on... the bolt that holds the sprocket on the cam loosened up and the intake cam wasn't spinning with everything else. i alligined the exhaust cam to the mark on the left side of the engine, than turned the intake cam to the mark, and tightened everything else up... unfortunatly it still wouldn't run. there was a loud clicking comming form the engine. it had the typical wur--wur--wur-- of the eingie as it was trying to start, and i had a friend ride on it and try to start it while i pushed but no dice. the engine is getting spark, but won't light up. i couldn't get the left engine cover off... there was a bolt on the crank (a 10mm) that I couldn't get off that looked like i could pull the cover of that wasn't holding it on... I tried looking on your site (which is a kick ass resourse) but i couldn't find how to take the left engine cover off after getting all the allan bolts off... but yea... any sugguestions?
got a kick butt syssy bar on the bike for the wife, but the bike isn't going anywhere now..

i couldn't get the engine cover on the left side completly off, and
the cams were off by like, 25 degrees, the intake one was screwed up from before, so i pulled the gear enough off of it to time it with the crank. i removed the pin holding the gear in place on the exhaust cam inorder to turn it... the other pin must have come out when this whole thing happened. i tried starting it, and no dice.. the engine has compression, there is resistance when i try to kick start it... when i pushed it with a firend on it, trying to start it, the bike didn't give any noises that sounded like it was fiering or anything like that, it just sounded like the bike was off and everything was spinning...




after getting all the bolts around the cover off, it feels like there is a bolt holding it on in the middle. i tried to unbolt the 10mm bolt thats inside the part that you'd grab to set the chain tension, but its on WAY TOO TIGHT and i'm gunna strip the nut if i try any more... all the cyclanders have compression...

Anyone have any sugguestions?

[ratbyk]

Won't Start

zeeboid, what make and model bike are you asking questions about?
If you are talking about an XS-XJ 1100 Yamaha it is difficult to comprehend some of your questions. Are you talking about the left side engine cover (left as would be left while sitting on the bike)? There is no 10mm bolt holding the left engine cover that covers the ignition/timing marks on an XS 1100.
From your comments as to what you have done so far it does not sound very good. It is a good possibility that you have turned the engine over with the cams out of phase. This would result in bent valves. Verify compression with a compression guage. Simply thinking that you have compression while kicking over is not a true indication that you have over 100 psi compression necessary for the engine to run.
Ken/Sooke

[Czekus21]

Yes, we need to know if this is a four or a three cyl. cauz there's a difference in adjustment between the two. No matter what though, If the motor is at TDC on #1, Your contacts are pointed at each other on your pickups and the cams are closed tight on #1 cyl. Cycle the motor over by hand with the plugs out and make sure that when the @2 cyl. is at TDC, cams are closed and contacts on pickup coils are lined up. Do this for EVERY cyl.. This will make sure that everything is lined up. If it's off by 25% and you turned the motor over, you may have damaged your valves and possibly the pistons, ( you mentioned and tapping sound ).
Also, you do have a manual for you machine, Right?

[zeeboid]

Sorry guys... its an xs750 3cyc... i know this is a 4cyc board, but you guys seamed to know what you were talking about on alot of the posts i've read here..

oh, yes i have eather, yes i've tried to use it, no dice... the enigne seams to be turning pretty easy when i'm cranking on it... maybe too easy...

oh yea... no manual... i should probably invest on one of those....

as far as compression, i need to buy a gague yet... i feel the puff puff out of the spark plug hole, but yea... i'm not sensatiave to know how high PSI

[ratbyk]

Dead Bike

zeeboid, you seem to have now answered most of your own questions.
Yes, get the manuel.
Yes get a compression guage.
Yes, I think you have bent valves and are going to need that manuel before you destroy anything else.
Ken/Sooke

[Bill__Woods]

I have 5 suggestions.
1. complete 78 xs750 engine in with 18k miles.
2. Long block 79 XS750 enigne (complete engine but starter, stator, stator rotor, stator cover, ignition pickups & cover have been removed) . 33K miles - .

I sold my XS750 and still have some stuff for them. I had both of these engine running 2 years ago before I removed them from the frame. They both should still be fine. I am ready to deal as they are taking up my garage space.

3. re-check Cam timing
4. Check compression
5. repair or replace engine

good luck on your fixin'

[zeeboid]

okay... got the manual, no help, got the compression tester, the compression is all good...

something i knoticed though.... on that first image...



that shows the timing marks. now, i on the intake cam caps, they are labeled T-1 though T-4... the exhaust cam caps are labled F1-F4. the manual says

"the dots on the cams must be aligned with the arrows on the No. 1 Cam Caps. The No. 1 cyclinder must be at TDC (the no 1 T mark on the governor aligned with the stationary timing mark)"

anyone know what the F mark is for?

and the crank turns twice for the cam's turning once, right? if so, its possible for the cams to be 180 off?

any sugguestions would be great, with the compression tester, the manual, i just can't get it to fire up... not sure what the deal is

[ratbyk]

Dead Motor

Don't own a triple. Never worked on a triple. On the XS11 "t" mark is for TDC. The "F" mark is for use with a timing light to set the ignition timing. Would assume same on triple but do not know for sure.
Compression is a GOOD thing. With compression all you need is the right amount of fuel and a healthy spark at the right time and the engine will run. You are obviously lacking either fuel or spark.
Are the spark plugs wet from to much fuel? If dry try squirting some gasoline into mouth of carb. and turning over to see if it will fire. (remove the gasoline source before turning over in case it backfires out the carbs). If it still won't fire with compression and fuel you either do not have any spark or the spark is at the wrong time. (is the engine kill switch in the on position?)
With compression you should be able to make the thing run.
Ken/Sooke

[nashville_bill]

If the timing is 180 off, then it is still OK -- it would just be on the on the exhaust stroke in stead of the compression stroke. If you have compression, you need to look at the other components that have to be there to make an engine run:

1. Compression
2. Spark
3. Fuel/Air

1. You have compression.

2. Do you have spark? If so, is it at the correct time? Do the spark plug wires go to the correct plugs? You can check this with a timing light. What do the plugs look like?

3. If the spark plugs are not fouled with gas, then you can substitute starting fluid for the fuel mixture by removing the air cleaner and sqirting a little in the carb.

If you have all three of these, it will at least try to start, so something has to be missing. Do you know any experienced mechanics that you could ask for help?

Good luck,

[zeeboid]

yea, all three intake valves are bent...

there it is.

[Czekus21]

Gld to here that you found the problem. Figured it would be somthing like that. Now ya just gotta figure out, Do you want to venture into fixing them yourself or take it to a shop. Around here in S.D. they like to charge around $200.00 plus parts. If you do this yourself, think, top end gaskets, Valve spring compressor tool ect...if a shop does the job, Save yerself a few $$ and pull the head yourself. Just about any " competent machine shop" should be able to take care of those valves. They may even lap them for you.

[zeeboid]

so its not just as easy as pulling the valves? baaaaaaaa!!!

[nashville_bill]

Zeeboid, It sounds like you could use some help. Where do you live? There could be a member that is near you.

[zeeboid]

I'm in S. St. Paul, MN

i found a place that has a head with good valves for 200 bucks... hmmm...

[Czekus21]

Too bad that's a triple. I've got a 4 cyl. head here in the garage I bought for parts but now that I have it I don't need the parts. If the vales are the same size and/or the valve shims are the same size. I'll ship em to ya. Just let me know.