Waterproofing Connectors - Biker Friends....

[BA80]

Are these bikes really that big of a problem in the rain? I've never had issue.

I suffered with mine dropping 2 cylinders riding in heavy rain or at the car wash after washing it for several years. I tried several different things, coils, waterproofing harnesses, I can't remember what all. Finally, someone on here mentioned the pick up coil plug behind the fuse panel and how they had the same issue and cured it by sealing that plug with dielectric grease. I tried that and it cured my problem also.

Haven't had the issue again for years now. I'm a firm believer in K.I.S.S. and if it works don't fix it. Well, the dielectric grease is simple and it works.

Now, I know there are those out there that believe if a little is good then a lot must be better. I can see how someone with that train of thought could cause problems with just about anything by overdoing it.

[kboehringer]

Backwoods Engineering Degree?

Are these bikes really that big of a problem in the rain? I've never had issue.

Marty,
As the starter of this thread, I would have to agree that "Stockish" XS11's are not any problem in the rain. Last year at XSSE I drove my "Relatively Stock" DUCK in Miles and Miles and Miles of heavy rain and through standing water more than 6" deep at times without ANY electrical issue whatsoever.

However, my DEAD DUCK is a "Kurt MODIFIED XS11". The fenders are shorter, the ignition module was moved from its protected space under the OEM seat, the side covers are different, the seat is from a sportster, the headlamp mount is from an XJ550, etc. The Yamaha ENGINEERS did a GREAT job.... MY BACKWOODS RE-Engineering introduced new variables and exposures that created my issues for me.

IMPO - Every time something non-OEM is done to one of these old bikes we run the risk of making a problem most of us (certainly not me) are not capable of the engineering prowess the Yamaha engineers had way back when. There are a couple other "Design Changes" we do/suggest around here that may also have ramifications which are unforeseen. For that reason, I won't make those changes on my bikes. I did however perform two "Washer Swaps" and it does not SEEM that design change has had any ill effects only good results.

In order to ATTEMPT to compensate for the backwoods engineering changes I MADE I need to do some additional backwoods engineering changes. Hopefully, this latest set of modifications will REDUCE the exposure to the elements that I created.

I have used rubber tape on the BACK of all the connectors (Male & Female) where the wires enter the connector. The mating area EXTERIOR of the MALE portion of the connectors has been LIBERALLY coated with dielectric grease. Personally, I put NONE inside the connector. Hopefully, that work will keep water OUT of them!

My final project will be to attempt an additional rain guard for the area above the horns & below the tank where I think my shorty from fender was blasting water toward my coils. It does not APPEAR that a reduction in air flow through that area SHOULD hurt anything but...... here we go again with another "backwoods design change" that could cause some other issue?

I guess all the other guys with these BOOBERS (especially those without any front fenders) must just stay home in foul weather?

Respectfully,
KURT

[BA80]

guess all the other guys with these BOOBERS (especially those without any front fenders) must just stay home in foul weather?

My bike is a stock SG other than a 79 engine and Mac exhaust. I just put pods on it last spring.

[jetmechmarty]

The XS1100 has a PMA alternator, does it not? I never messed with it because it works and make the assumption because I'm not replacing brushes. That being said, the faster that rotor turns, the more current is induced into the stator. The alternator is going to make current whether you need it or not. The excess needs to go someplace. It's going to be shed as heat. Make sure the rectifier/regulator has cooling air.

[motoman]

Are these bikes really that big of a problem in the rain? I've never had issue.

These bikes are now almost 40 years old. Mother Yamaha may not have intended them to be on the road that long. Anyway, I believe the bigger issue is corrosion.

She is made of copper. When copper looks like this it conduct electricity as well as when it's clean. I have not noted that the XS1100 was put together with plated wire. It's bare copper. With bikes this age all of the connections need periodic cleaning with a quality solvent designed for the purpose. My own bike is overdue. The pins in the connectors aren't a big corrosion problem, but I'm sure they still oxidize. Clean them up.

I haven't used it, but a lot of folks seem to rave about this stuff.

Good reminder Marty. I'll keep that product in mind for any future connector cleaning that may be needed.

[kboehringer]

Splash Guard Installed....

My final project will be to attempt an additional rain guard for the area above the horns & below the tank where I think my shorty from fender was blasting water toward my coils.

XS Friends,
Today I pulled this bike apart again to accomplish other minor fixes. In the bright Georgia sun it was obvious that water had been getting shot up under the tank. My problem was most likely from the shorty fender.

Although tough to see in this crappy pic. the connectors for the coils have been sealed as mentioned previously.


I also fabricated a small guard for the front of the frame which should keep water from being shot directly at the coils.....


Hopefully, I will still get enough air in that area to avoid causing some other problem like overheated coils.

KURT

[BA80]

Lemme know how that works out for you Kurt.

[Radioguylogs]

Nice job

Kurt:

You're the only member praying for rain.

[TopCatGr58]

Lemme know how that works out for you Kurt.

Hey Greg,

That's a lot smaller than the big FAIRINGS people have on the front of their bikes. He'll probably still get plenty of air circulating around that little piece/guard, possibly even more that what some folks get with full fairings.

T.C.

[ViperRon]

Issues with waterproofing connectors are in two basic groups first is the issue with filling with water and the shorts that moisture creates a short term problem if it can drain and dry. The second is a long term issue. Any void that is exposed to a temp change will create and keep moisture. Usually moisture that evaporates off a connector quickly causes no issue but if there is dampness in a connector for a long time it corrodes the connector and can penetrate even the wire shielding. When applying rubber tape, paint on coverings, and even shrink tube it works better when you treat the metal connections with a corrosion resistant coating and fill the void with a non conductive like dielectric. This way you do not open a covered connector looking for a problem to find dust.

[BA80]

Y'all keep mentioning dust, sure dust will collect on the OUTSIDE. It'll do that anyway. If the connector is waterproof I can pretty much guarantee it's dustproof too.

[ViperRon]

Greg
In my reply I was talking about connectors that not cleaned or protected and moisture collecting in a void and causing the connector and wire to corrode to nothing but dust. If a connector is cleaned and treated and especially filled with non conductive grease and sealed there can be no problem.

However if a bad connector is just covered up it might corrode quicker.

Ron

[clcorbin]

Electrical connectors are no place for it, in my not so humble opinion.

Electrical connectors are a GREAT place for dielectric grease! If your connectors are in good shape, even if you pack that connector completely FULL of grease, there will NOT be any grease between the actual electrical contact points when the connector is assembled. The actual contact point (usually a line) on an electrical connector actually goes together with thousands of PSI of pressure and it is a sliding contact. The grease, along with the oxide and other crap gets forced out of the contact surface when you assemble it.

If that doesn't happen (either the oxide or the grease remains), then you have a bad connector that has lost too much tension. The crappy 35+ year old contacts on these bikes are prone to ****ty contact because they have lost tension. But that is still a problem of ****ty contacts, not a case of dialectric grease. If you can't make a good connection with dialectric grease, but you can without it, replace the connector because it is only a matter of time before it will leave on the side of the road.

The advantages of dialectic grease are many, but mainly they keep moisture out of the contacts (which reduces corrosion and extends the life of the contact) and can prevent water from shorting out adjoining contacts. The pros definitely out weight the cons.

[CaptonZap]

Electrical connectors are a GREAT place for dielectric grease! If your connectors are in good shape, even if you pack that connector completely FULL of grease, there will NOT be any grease between the actual electrical contact points when the connector is assembled. The actual contact point (usually a line) on an electrical connector actually goes together with thousands of PSI of pressure and it is a sliding contact. The grease, along with the oxide and other crap gets forced out of the contact surface when you assemble it.

If that doesn't happen (either the oxide or the grease remains), then you have a bad connector that has lost too much tension. The crappy 35+ year old contacts on these bikes are prone to ****ty contact because they have lost tension. But that is still a problem of ****ty contacts, not a case of dialectric grease. If you can't make a good connection with dialectric grease, but you can without it, replace the connector because it is only a matter of time before it will leave on the side of the road.

The advantages of dialectic grease are many, but mainly they keep moisture out of the contacts (which reduces corrosion and extends the life of the contact) and can prevent water from shorting out adjoining contacts. The pros definitely out weight the cons.

Finally! A sane voice in the debate.
Thanks for the lucid explanation, Clint.
Pearls before swine, and all that.

CZ

[BA80]

Finally! A sane voice in the debate.
Thanks for the lucid explanation, Clint.
Pearls before swine, and all that.

CZ

I've been saying that since post #12.