XJ1100 mid-drive and final drive fluid

[HalfCentury]

In the XJ650 world, some owners (me included) do not drain the mid-drive as the drain plug is prone to stripping. Lots of horror stories of major problems once the plug is ruined in situ.

It is thought that the lubricant in the mid drive and final drive eventually all intermix and that only draining the final drive is sufficient to service the shaft drive.

In this spirit, I drained and filled the final drive of the XJ1100 a couple of weeks ago for the first time since I have owned the bike. It was filthy and horrible smelling. It was broken down and rather thin. I have driven it at least 100 miles since then.

Today I removed the mid-drive plug and drained just the mid drive. The fluid is not dirty, does not smell bad, and is much more viscous than what came out a couple of weeks ago.

Removing the mid drain plug required laying on the floor with the bike on the kickstand to get the centerstand out of the way. I laid upwind of lean just in case the bike decided to fall.

My thought is that draining only the rear will be sufficient to get most of gear oil out of the drive if performed regularly.

Any thoughts?

[BA80]

The rear will get dirtier but the middle drive is pretty important too. No problems with the drain plug on the 11. I change both every spring and put fresh 75w140 synthetic in them.

Cheap insurance.

[puskrat]

No strippers

PO of the Dragon Lady told me the oil filter bolt was stripped. He meant Rounded off. Stripped is also used (incorrectly) to mean Cross-threaded, and if something is stripped, was it the plug or the drain hole? Depending on the clarification, properly draining filling and plugging the opening (WITH PROPER TORQUE) may avoid the problems you've feared. I learned to torque properly when I spent a summer building a deck system into an aluminum boat hull. It's amazing how many things go wrong just because we get in a hurry, and/or think we know better than the manufacturer how to install a fastener (or a drain plug)

[Prisoner6]

My thought is that draining only the rear will be sufficient to get most of gear oil out of the drive if performed regularly.

Any thoughts?

No question about it ... when draining/refilling the final drive oil, I would always drain/refill the middle drive as well.

Yamaha put a filler plug and drain plug on both drives for a reason ... why would you want to risk a problem by not servicing the middle drive as well as the FD?

To me, it's not worth the risk ... change the oil in both.

[TopCatGr58]

In the XJ650 world, some owners (me included) do not drain the mid-drive as the drain plug is prone to stripping. Lots of horror stories of major problems once the plug is ruined in situ.

It is thought that the lubricant in the mid drive and final drive eventually all intermix and that only draining the final drive is sufficient to service the shaft drive.

**SNIP**

My thought is that draining only the rear will be sufficient to get most of gear oil out of the drive if performed regularly.

Any thoughts?

Hey there,

**EDITTED, Apologies! Thanks Schming for correcting my faux paux! **

Glad to hear that it wasn't as smelly as the final drive and still had it's viscosity. You do not need to change it every time you change the engine oil.

Some folks have drained theirs and forgot to refill it, as well as have had them leak and loose their fluid so that they run dry, then overheat and can lock up at the most inopportune time....like running down the highway at 70 mph! So...it would behoove you to check it and change it per the recommended intervals in the manual, and also inform your 650 friends as well.

T.C.

[Schming]

In the XJ650 world, some owners (me included) do not drain the mid-drive as the drain plug is prone to stripping. Lots of horror stories of major problems once the plug is ruined in situ.

It is thought that the lubricant in the mid drive and final drive eventually all intermix and that only draining the final drive is sufficient to service the shaft drive.

Both the XJ 650 and XJ 750 middle drives, use the engine oil for lubrication and the small amount that could be drained, from the rear plug in the engine block, whilst performing an engine oil change, usually isn't worth the trouble.

[BA80]

Both the XJ 650 and XJ 750 middle drives, use the engine oil for lubrication and the small amount that could be drained, from the rear plug in the engine block, whilst performing an engine oil change, usually isn't worth the trouble.

That's interesting. I didn't know that. Is the XS 650 and 750 the same?

[Prisoner6]

Both the XJ 650 and XJ 750 middle drives, use the engine oil for lubrication and the small amount that could be drained, from the rear plug in the engine block, whilst performing an engine oil change, usually isn't worth the trouble.

That's interesting. I didn't know that. Is the XS 650 and 750 the same?

Someone CMIIW, but as far as I know, the XS 650, in all of its incarnations, was always chain drive ...

And the XS 750 was a shaftie ...

[Prisoner6]

Oh, and Brian ...

Just to be clear ... on your XJ11, when changing gear oil, you should always drain/refill the middle drive, as well as the final drive.

[Prothec]

... It was filthy and horrible smelling. ...

Any gear oil I've ever used in my FDs smells horrible.

I wish they would do whatever Marvel Mystery oil does to make it smell like peppermint.

[kboehringer]

Most commonly used tool... TORQUE WRENCH

.........we get in a hurry, and/or think we know better than the manufacturer how to install a fastener

Half Century,
I am a member of a few internet forums and frequently see wrong information posted and promoted. It's difficult to get that information corrected. Posters may have never actually taken a system apart or read anything provided by the OEM.

FYI.... I am a member of a Camaro forum/board where a ridiculous method for changing a fuel pump is commonly promoted as "quick and easy" but it is the most dangerous and stupid thing anyone could ever attempt for a number of reasons. I have tried to get the members to see just how stupid this "fast & easy" procedure is compared to the OEM's recommended procedure. When they turn themselves or their passengers into a flaming fireballs it will be too late......

Fortunately, this board has many members with extensive knowledge and hands-on experience. I not sure I have seen it yet on XS11.com, but I am certain that if someone posted something very inaccurate their post would get several quick corrective responses.

NUTS AND BOLTS:
I am a stickler for use of a torque wrench. We're dealing with many aluminum parts with steel bolts. It does not take much to cross-thread, strip the head, or over torque a fastener. If the OEM manual does not specifically state a torque for a fastener (RARE), I have a chart that indicates what the torque should be based on material construction and the bolt size. My torque wrench is one of the most commonly used tools in my box!

I also NEVER use a wrench to start ANY fastener (including drain plugs and spark plugs). If I can't get a couple revolutions started with my fingers....something is wrong.

Respectfully,
KURT

[Prisoner6]

NUTS AND BOLTS:
I am a stickler for use of a torque wrench. We're dealing with many aluminum parts with steel bolts. It does not take much to cross-thread, strip the head, or over torque a fastener. If the OEM manual does not specifically state a torque for a fastener (RARE), I have a chart that indicates what the torque should be based on material construction and the bolt size. My torque wrench is one of the most commonly used tools in my box!

I also NEVER use a wrench to start any fastener (including drain plugs and spark plugs). If I can't get a couple revolutions started with my fingers....something is wrong.

All very good advice ...

You get a much better "feel" for the threads by using your hand to gently start the revolutions (instead of a wrench).

And I've known so many guys who feel the need to "gorilla torque" everything ... RIDICULOUS!

Take the time to use the torque wrench ...

[HalfCentury]

Half Century,
I am a member of a few internet forums and frequently see wrong information posted and promoted. It's difficult to get that information corrected. Posters may have never actually taken a system apart or read anything provided by the OEM.

FYI.... I am a member of a Camaro forum/board where a ridiculous method for changing a fuel pump is commonly promoted as "quick and easy" but it is the most dangerous and stupid thing anyone could ever attempt for a number of reasons. I have tried to get the members to see just how stupid this "fast & easy" procedure is compared to the OEM's recommended procedure. When they turn themselves or their passengers into a flaming fireballs it will be too late......

Fortunately, this board has many members with extensive knowledge and hands-on experience. I not sure I have seen it yet on XS11.com, but I am certain that if someone posted something very inaccurate their post would get several quick corrective responses.

NUTS AND BOLTS:
I am a stickler for use of a torque wrench. We're dealing with many aluminum parts with steel bolts. It does not take much to cross-thread, strip the head, or over torque a fastener. If the OEM manual does not specifically state a torque for a fastener (RARE), I have a chart that indicates what the torque should be based on material construction and the bolt size. My torque wrench is one of the most commonly used tools in my box!

I also NEVER use a wrench to start ANY fastener (including drain plugs and spark plugs). If I can't get a couple revolutions started with my fingers....something is wrong.

Respectfully,
KURT

I agree and practice using fingers only to start a fastener. To that end, the mid drive drain bolt required about 5 minutes on my back under the bike to replace. This is my first fluid change on the XJ1100 and I have never been exactly there on the bike nor handled this bolt. I seems that the angle of the threaded hole is odd and I could not gingerly get the bolt started. In hindsight, after a minute of failure I should have inserted a wooden down a couple of inches to eyeball the angle of the threaded hole. It could simply have been that the bike was on the sidestand.

[HalfCentury]

Both the XJ 650 and XJ 750 middle drives, use the engine oil for lubrication and the small amount that could be drained, from the rear plug in the engine block, whilst performing an engine oil change, usually isn't worth the trouble.

Thanks for the clarification. Its the engine that shares lubricant with the mid drive. I change both engine oil and final drive 80W90 regularly on the XJ650.

[jetmechmarty]

NUTS AND BOLTS:
I am a stickler for use of a torque wrench. We're dealing with many aluminum parts with steel bolts. It does not take much to cross-thread, strip the head, or over torque a fastener. If the OEM manual does not specifically state a torque for a fastener (RARE), I have a chart that indicates what the torque should be based on material construction and the bolt size. My torque wrench is one of the most commonly used tools in my box!

I also NEVER use a wrench to start ANY fastener (including drain plugs and spark plugs). If I can't get a couple revolutions started with my fingers....something is wrong.

Respectfully,
KURT

+1

Use a torque wrench!

The advice given in the quote should always be followed. Use of a proper gasket won't hurt either. Adding more torque to a leaking plug will lead to damage.