Rebuilding Petcocks & Carbs

[sail4free]

Good Guy!

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That seems to be the case; got this Email from him today:

"refuse those when they get there and order these, George"
- georgefix

So I'll wait a few days to make sure we don't get 'em mixed up on our end, and then order the right ones. I'll probably have to pay the return shipping but that isn't so bad. My mechanic is impressed that kit enough to rebuild *both* petcocks is so cheap! I don't buy that much online but a co-worker does . . . he says PayPal is the way to go -- Sellers don't like 'em so much but they do offer some protection for the customer.
JIM P. ~ BOISE, ID
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[IanDMacDonald]

Actually, when you "refuse", you don't pay return shipping. Simply write "REFUSE" on it, and put it back in your box.

[sail4free]

Refuse!

Actually, when you "refuse", you don't pay return shipping. Simply write "REFUSE" on it, and put it back in your box.

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Even better -- I guess -- does the shipper get charged when the item is returned to him? If so, I imagine he would deduct at least the return shipping before issuing the credit to my card? And maybe deduct the cost to ship it to me too?
JIM P. ~ BOISE, ID
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[sail4free]

Too Many Unknowns?

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My mechanic and I are having this conversation:
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TYLER: "Can you tell me the year and specific model of your XS1100, and also the parts bike? I swapped our needles/slides/diaphragms and want to make sure they are compatible."
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ME: "It's a '79 XS1100SF (where the 'F' is redundant = '79; 'G' = '80, etc.) -- the 'S' is just to distinguish the 'Special' from the 'Standard'. I dunno' exactly what year/model the used carbs are from . . . was only assured they would interchange with the original carbs on my bike -- but we know the jet sizes were different already. If you need more, I can run it past the group?"
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TYLER: "I pulled a few of the extras I had apart and there was some variation. So I need to pull the carbs off and make sure they are all the same.
Crap. I picked based on the best diaphragms and didn't even think about needle variation until today. My bad."
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Can anyone shed any light on this? I have a message in to tcoop to see if he remembers what this used bank of carbs came off of. I guess that's the first step.
JIM P.
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[IanDMacDonald]

Hey Jim- I guess you should re-fresh us on what exactly the convo entails? Is your mechanic talking about putting your carb parts in his 850? Or is he talking about putting your donor bike carb parts in your bike?

Either way, later bike carbs had different needles in the middle cylinders #2/3, than #1 & #4. The number of holes for each one is unknown to me, since I have an earlier Standard with same needles on all four. A simple search will net you that answer. The diaphragms and slides may also be different or the same?

However, does your mechanic not have your bike? Year is right on the frame. I'm a little worried that your mechanic may be in over his head with your bike. I have never had my mechanic ask me questions when it came to my bikes. I know he has an 850, which certainly helps working on the 1100. But, they're not the same bike . . .

[sail4free]

Hey Jim- I guess you should re-fresh us on what exactly the convo entails? Is your mechanic talking about putting your carb parts in his 850? Or is he talking about putting your donor bike carb parts in your bike?

Either way, later bike carbs had different needles in the middle cylinders #2/3, than #1 & #4. The number of holes for each one is unknown to me, since I have an earlier Standard with same needles on all four. A simple search will net you that answer. The diaphragms and slides may also be different or the same?

However, does your mechanic not have your bike? Year is right on the frame. I'm a little worried that your mechanic may be in over his head with your bike. I have never had my mechanic ask me questions when it came to my bikes. I know he has an 850, which certainly helps working on the 1100. But, they're not the same bike . . .

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He's rebuilding the carbs on my '79 XS1100 SF and I knew #3 had a piece of the internal casting which was broke and that carb body needed to be replaced. He discovered #1 was a mess (poorly repaired -- broken tower) and he broke a float hinge tower in #4 so we wanted to replace both those carbs as well. I bought a used set of carbs in fairly good condition. He ended up with three 42.5 jets and three 45 jets so I bought one new 42.5 jet believing we could get it to tune with those jets and the UNI air filter pods.
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I share your worry but we have four carbs which should work (plus a spare #2 -- which could work as a #4), the four jets and mains (large round) are the same at this point . . . guess I need to read more and learn the what/why of the differences among the needles, slides, and diaphragms. Does anyone know if the needles on the '79 SF are all the same? All help greatly appreciated
JIM P.
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[DiverRay]

Needles and emulsion tubes should be the same on the '79 SF. You can use the '79 F in place of it with no problems. Biggest thing is have all 4 carbs the same. Put the needles at the middle clip if they have been moved.

[IanDMacDonald]

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He's rebuilding the carbs on my '79 XS1100 SF and I knew #3 had a piece of the internal casting which was broke and that carb body needed to be replaced. He discovered #1 was a mess (poorly repaired -- broken tower) and he broke a float hinge tower in #4 so we wanted to replace both those carbs as well. I bought a used set of carbs in fairly good condition. He ended up with three 42.5 jets and three 45 jets so I bought one new 42.5 jet believing we could get it to tune with those jets and the UNI air filter pods.
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I share your worry but we have four carbs which should work (plus a spare #2 -- which could work as a #4), the four jets and mains (large round) are the same at this point . . . guess I need to read more and learn the what/why of the differences among the needles, slides, and diaphragms. Does anyone know if the needles on the '79 SF are all the same? All help greatly appreciated
JIM P.
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Well, you just need to verify what bike you're borrowing carbs from. The 45 pilot jets may have been off a 1978 XS, where-as the 42.5's coulda been off a 1979. With the exception of the Mains, Pilots, and air jets, the '78/'79 carbs were the same. 1980+ were different.

[sail4free]

Needles and emulsion tubes should be the same on the '79 SF. You can use the '79 F in place of it with no problems. Biggest thing is have all 4 carbs the same. Put the needles at the middle clip if they have been moved.

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So all 4 carbs should be the same. What are the "emulsion tubes"? I'll remind Tyler to put the needles at the middle clip. So if I learn the used set of carbs I bought are from a '79 F, we should be good. Any way to see a difference between '70 SF and '79 F carbs?
JIM P.
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[IanDMacDonald]

The emulsion tubes are exactly that: the tubes that the needles slide in, and capped via the Main jet. There is a great thread regarding the differences between carbs. But, I believe the '79F/SF carbs are the same.

[sail4free]

Well, you just need to verify what bike you're borrowing carbs from. The 45 pilot jets may have been off a 1978 XS, where-as the 42.5's coulda been off a 1979. With the exception of the Mains, Pilots, and air jets, the '78/'79 carbs were the same. 1980+ were different.

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So some things are starting to make sense What are the "air jets"? IIRC, the set of carbs I bought *were* from a '78 XS -- which would explain where the 45 pilot jets came from . . . with the 42.5's as OEM on my '79 SF. All four pilot jets (42.5) and main jets (large round) are the same now -- dunno' about the "air jets". So it would seem the slides, needles (?metering rod?), *and* the diaphragms should be the same? But he's noticing some minor differences?
JIM P.
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[IanDMacDonald]

The air jets are on the intake side of the carb. Nothing for you to really worry about, passing it on from advice of other's.

[motoman]

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So some things are starting to make sense What are the "air jets"? IIRC, the set of carbs I bought *were* from a '78 XS -- which would explain where the 45 pilot jets came from . . . with the 42.5's as OEM on my '79 SF. All four pilot jets (42.5) and main jets (large round) are the same now -- dunno' about the "air jets". So it would seem the slides, needles (?metering rod?), *and* the diaphragms should be the same? But he's noticing some minor differences?
JIM P.
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Yikes....sounds like a puster-cluck to me.
42.5 pilots are stock for 80-81 carbs.....NOT the earlier carbs(79-79).
80-81 Special and Standard metering rods are different from each other. XJ is different even yet, as is its stock main jetting.
80Standard(G) and 81Venturer(H) had 'staggered' jetting, mains ONLY.
80-81Specials had same mains across all four(110's)
" " Standards had 115 mains outer cyls./120mains inner cyls. to better cool/'quench' inner two cyls. assuming the Standard in most cases would be packing a load over longer distances as opposed to the more sportier bar-hopper Special,lean'n'mean with the bit shorter, quicker taper metering rods for added attitude.

The air jets (in back of intake bell) on the later carbs is 185. They're just the SMALL round Mikuni main jets.

IF ALL jets used are not genuine Mikuni with their curly logo......all bets are off for any decent running ability if using K&L's or RD jets.

[IanDMacDonald]

Yikes....sounds like a puster-cluck to me.
42.5 pilots are stock for 80-81 carbs.....NOT the earlier carbs(79-79).
80-81 Special and Standard metering rods are different from each other. XJ is different even yet, as is its stock main jetting.
80Standard(G) and 81Venturer(H) had 'staggered' jetting, mains ONLY.
80-81Specials had same mains across all four(110's)
" " Standards had 115 mains outer cyls./120mains inner cyls. to better cool/'quench' inner two cyls. assuming the Standard in most cases would be packing a load over longer distances as opposed to the more sportier bar-hopper Special,lean'n'mean with the bit shorter, quicker taper metering rods for added attitude.

The air jets (in back of intake bell) on the later carbs is 185. They're just the SMALL round Mikuni main jets.

IF ALL jets used are not genuine Mikuni with their curly logo......all bets are off for any decent running ability if using K&L's or RD jets.

Why a cluster puck? He's using a combo of '78/79 carbs (hopefully). 42.5 pilot jets were stock from '79+. The '78 was the only year with the largest pilot and air jets, going along with their unique timing curve.

[DiverRay]

As long as ALL FOUR CARBS ARE SET THE SAME it does NOT MATTER!! I've swapped set's between '78, 80, '79, Etc. IF the bank is good, it will work well. The fine tune CAN be done once it runs.
ALL carbs mix air and fuel to a 14:1 ratio(or close to it!). Once close, with Mikuni jets, you can tune any year carb for any engine.