Jumping gears.

[James England]

Am I correct in saying that the gears that need attention for the jumping in 1st and 2nd gear that needs the Dremel fix are 1, 2, 4 and 5? Ie each of them needs to be worked on to some extent?

I'm wondering about buying new replacements as the Dremel fix kind of scares me a bit...I'd hate to have to take the engine out again after doing the 'fix', so I'm considering buying new gears....

[crazy steve]

Pull the oil pan and look at them; I wouldn't do anything 'just because'...

The new 'improved' gears are still available and would forestall possible future problems, but at about $100 each that's a pretty big expense. You know how these need to be shifted, Yamaha came up with the 'fix' to allow for owners who didn't 'get it'....

What I found extremely interesting is that Yamaha originally put the 'taper' on the third gear dogs right from the get-go, but only offered them for 1-2 as replacement parts. As replacing third gear absolutely does require splitting the cases, were they trying to generate some service-counter traffic?...

[BA80]

The dremmel repair isn't that difficult James. The only difference between the dremmel fix and new gears is about $400 vs 30 minutes with a dremmel tool.

The engine doesn't need to be removed, it can be done on the bike.

[BA80]

What I found extremely interesting is that Yamaha originally put the 'taper' on the third gear dogs right from the get-go

That really doesn't make any logical sense considering the over engineering on the rest of the bike. Does it?

[natemoen]

That really doesn't make any logical sense considering the over engineering on the rest of the bike. Does it?

Gotta get customers for something I guess, might as well make it something big enough to scare people not to do it themselves.

[crazy steve]

That really doesn't make any logical sense considering the over engineering on the rest of the bike. Does it?

It will forever remain a mystery, like the round mirrors on the square bikes and vice versa...

[jetmechmarty]

James,

How much are you going to ride this bike? Is it going to be more of a showpiece?

I ride the snot out of mine. I went with the new gears and washer move. I also modified the suspension, etc. I ride it hard, fast, and often.

[MaximPhil]

James,

How much are you going to ride this bike? Is it going to be more of a showpiece?

I ride the snot out of mine. I went with the new gears and washer move. I also modified the suspension, etc. I ride it hard, fast, and often.

Hi Marty,
Having had the opportunity to ride your bike in the mountains of Georgia and I can attest that she rides as though on rails and shifts very nicely too.
Phil

[James England]

James,

How much are you going to ride this bike? Is it going to be more of a showpiece?

I ride the snot out of mine. I went with the new gears and washer move. I also modified the suspension, etc. I ride it hard, fast, and often.

Yes, good point. I have my XJR for riding and yes, this one will be more of a showpiece and more for the satisfaction of doing the job. I was just thinking that, since the engine is out of the frame and I've not actually ridden the bike (so don't know if it has any gear problems...maybe not.), it might be an idea to get it right and make sure the gears are OK. I suppose a good look should establish that?

Also, I may be a bit dense here but I can't really understand the transmission Dremel fix thread pictures!! I trawled the forum last night and found the post with the pix and drawings but I can't fully get my head round them and what I'm supposed to be attempting with the Dremel......... Any enlightenment would be appreciated!!

[dpotter58]

Also, I may be a bit dense here but I can't really understand the transmission Dremel fix thread pictures!! I trawled the forum last night and found the post with the pix and drawings but I can't fully get my head round them and what I'm supposed to be attempting with the Dremel......... Any enlightenment would be appreciated!!

I was confused as well until I had the gears in my hands. When you look at them and see how they mesh it's like a light bulb coming on.

[IanDMacDonald]

Actually, what I'm really surprised about is that nobody has ever had an opportunity to research who the actual engineers were of the XS1100, and pick their brains. Even if they were older in '77/'78, odds are they're still alive today. I also wonder if anyone at Yamaha could be contacted for some of our question?

[crazy steve]

I suppose a good look should establish that?

Once the pan is off, if you work the shift lever (while turning the driveshaft flange by hand) and watch what moves, you'll see the affected parts. All of the gears use the same dogs/slots arrangement to engage them, so if first/second are damaged you can easily tell by comparing them to the others and referring to the 'fix' photos. Clean square edges good, rounded bad....

James, like you I was uneasy about the non-precision aspect of the 'fix' (hand grinding gears by eye? Ya gotta be kidding!!??) but the results speak for themselves as proven here numerous times. Unless you have cracked or broken parts this works, and works as well as spending the money for new gears. The only way this can fail is by not putting enough 'taper' in the dogs/slots and/or fully removing any rounded edges.

You should try to make an effort to remove the same amounts at each point, get this as close as you can but it's not hugely critical. If the rounding is severe enough where you have to remove more than about 1/8" of material, well yeah, you probably should get better used or new gears. If you find this, you'll probably need to replace the shift fork too.

[jetmechmarty]

James, like you I was uneasy about the non-precision aspect of the 'fix' (hand grinding gears by eye? Ya gotta be kidding!!??)

I still can't get a grasp on why this doesn't result in broken dogs.

I guess the proof is in the pudding. Whatever that means.

[BA80]

I still can't get a grasp on why this doesn't result in broken dogs.

Not that much metal is removed if it's done right. Just enough to square the edges and slightly dove tail the dogs and just enough to angle the lands on the slots slightly down and in. Like everything else on this bike it's built much heavier than need be.

[crazy steve]

I still can't get a grasp on why this doesn't result in broken dogs.

I know what you mean, but I can't recall a single instance of that happening. I do know that the metal used is pretty soft (once you grind through the surface hardening) so maybe it's 'malleable' enough to absorb the shock of shifting without breaking.

IIRC, somebody did show up with broken dogs but the gear was still OEM so it must have been a factory defect or serious abuse...