Middle gear oil replacement - XJ11

[KA1J]

I was reading about the middle gear and read it needs to be filled with gear oil and I don't think I've ever changed the oil in the middle gear (I thought it was serviced by the engine oil). I've got some synthetic gear oil I used in the rear but I need to check the middle gear oil & find out what is what. I also have no idea how to check the level, I didn't get a tool for the rear when I got the bike. Is there a clear photo of where the drain plug is?

Is there any issue to be expected with removing the plug (I have to find it) and once drained on the center stand, how much oil should I put back in it? I've heard about a drain plug on other XJ's that is supposed to be a bugger to get at and undo; Um... would that be this one?

Thanks,

Gary

[jwhughes3]

Dipstick

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=72

That thread has dipstick measurements if you want to make one and a part number if you want to BUY one from the Dealer.

John

[trbig]

The middle drive drain plug is at the very back of the motor just in front of the rear mount. It's recessed up there, so yeah, it's a bit of a pain, but nothing big. The main problem is that it will drain right onto your center stand, and that gear oil reeks. And yes, use full synthetic in the middle and final drives.

[ESJr1642]

Do yourself a favor and make sure you can get the filler plug out before you drain the old fluid. These can be trickey to get out. DAMHIK...

[natemoen]

I think cbug has a sheet of printable dipsticks on his website along with all the manuals.

[KA1J]

Thanks for the replies. I went to the webpage JW linked to and cut out a piece of plastic the right depth. I was able to get both top & lower free without munging the allen & drained the oil. Brilliant location for the drain plug as mentioned... And yup, that oil stinks but good. Had some Mobil one gear oil around but it's hidden behind something so I used the last of the overpriced synthetic Royal Purple gear oil that I earlier put in my car's rear gear box.

It's nicely filled to the upper level and otter be good for a long time to come. There wasn't a whole lot of metal particles attached to the magnet so that bodes well for the future. The oil was dark with a little bit of metalflake which is probably normal for such gearing. There will always be wear...

Thanks for the help.

Gary

[motoman]

Thanks for the replies. I went to the webpage JW linked to and cut out a piece of plastic the right depth. I was able to get both top & lower free without munging the allen & drained the oil. Brilliant location for the drain plug as mentioned... And yup, that oil stinks but good. Had some Mobil one gear oil around but it's hidden behind something so I used the last of the overpriced synthetic Royal Purple gear oil that I earlier put in my car's rear gear box.

It's nicely filled to the upper level and otter be good for a long time to come. There wasn't a whole lot of metal particles attached to the magnet so that bodes well for the future. The oil was dark with a little bit of metalflake which is probably normal for such gearing. There will always be wear...

Thanks for the help.

Gary

If that RoyalePurple was NOT the 75w-140 variety, would reccomend changing to that, as that is the synthetic equivelent to the 80-90dino gear lube. The lighter vescosity synthetic does not 'cling' well and has a lower load 'pound out' spec. If that is still questioned, ask 3Phase bout the lighter vescosity Purple lube and what happens to final drive after a several thousand mile LD run.

[650mark]

gear oil

when I drained and refilled my mid drive unit I hadn't read anything about the best stuff to use in my '80 special so used royal purple 75-90 weight. i'm in Arizona, am I headed for trouble? do I need to drain and switch to the 75-140? recommendations please.. thanks

[650mark]

post script to previous reply:

I called Royal Purple and spoke to one of their technical guys. He did, in fact, confirm what Motoman said: the 75-140 gear lube would be best for long,very high speed riding. but he also said that their 75-90 would be more than sufficient for normal everyday use even here in Arizona(it's been over 110 degrees for weeks). he also recommended(I know, he's a salesman as well) their CycleMax 10w-40 full synthetic oil for the extreme conditions here in arizona. he claims that their oil is documented to run 10-20 degrees cooler in an air cooled engine than their competition and that it has much better sheer strength properties allowing it to run for 6-8,000 miles between changes. sounds good, but does anybody here have any experience with this oil?

[motoman]

I called Royal Purple and spoke to one of their technical guys. He did, in fact, confirm what Motoman said: the 75-140 gear lube would be best for long,very high speed riding. but he also said that their 75-90 would be more than sufficient for normal everyday use even here in Arizona(it's been over 110 degrees for weeks). he also recommended(I know, he's a salesman as well) their CycleMax 10w-40 full synthetic oil for the extreme conditions here in arizona. he claims that their oil is documented to run 10-20 degrees cooler in an air cooled engine than their competition and that it has much better sheer strength properties allowing it to run for 6-8,000 miles between changes. sounds good, but does anybody here have any experience with this oil?

.......may be good lubricant, but these clutch disc will likely slip if used. BTW, 75-140syn. in the middle and final drive, no matter what state your runnin' in, and yes, the final DOES run substantually cooler with the 75w-140syn. as there is less friction. The 75w-90 SYNTHETIC is NOT sufficient lubricant where equivelant weight dino is called for, in any differential application.

[MPittma100]

Which Oil?

If all else fails, put in there the petroleum based gear oil that Yamaha recommends? Synthetic oils are over priced and may also be over rated.

MP

[3Phase]

Royal Purple? Royal Purple. Royal Purple!

650mark,

Sorry about ripping off Steve Martin's "Cleaning woman!" bit. I put some of that Royal Purple 75W140 in Columbo's middle drive a little less than 6,000 miles ago. When I changed it last month before the Cali-rally it was dark and had gray ooze and sparklies in it just like the '750 FD that I killed/toasted during the Durango rally out in Colorado.

I'm beyond angry about it, and not just because I broke the windshield while I was draining the oil. I do have a few more good spare middle drives but this one was special. I was the best one that I had and when I swapped it in before Durango from my XJ11 it only had 14,000 miles on it.

After seeing the crud I flushed it with mineral spirits and turned the rear wheel to work the gears and bearings, then let it sit and drain again. I refilled it with some inexpensive 85W90 Wally World brand dino gear oil, then rode for while to get the oil hot. When I got home and drained the oil it was clean so at that time I refilled it with Redline gear oil.

I know that a sample of two isn't statistically valid but it's more than enough for me. I don't care what the salesman says, I'll run barefoot on hot tarmac in Phoenix in July during a dust storm to squeeze the oil out of a dozen dead roadkill armadillos before I'll use Royal Purple again.


For what it's worth I'm re-thinking root cause of death for the '750 final drive too. Failed XS750 Final Drive (Images and video link)

.

[clcorbin]

Strange. I FINALLY changed the middle gear oil after about 70,000 miles... It came out so clean and clear I thought something was wrong. I did use Royal Purple gear lube, but I don't remember if it was the 90 or the 145 oil. I DO know that after 15,000 miles, I checked the lube level last weekend and the oil looked like it just came out of the bottle (clear, with the purple tint). Maybe I got lucky and got a mid drive that was set up perfectly from the factory...

[3Phase]

What a bummer!

70,000 miles with Royal Purple in the middle drive! It looks like it's armaladillios at 'noon for me then because I won't use Royal Purple.

Yamaha XS1100 FSM Page 2-2 Lubrication Intervals:
Middle/Final gear oil: Replace (Page 2-12)
Initial @ 400 km (250 mi)
Thereafter @ 9,600 km (6,000 mi)

I used Royal Purple 75w140 one time and it turned dark and ate metal. The gears in the XJ11's middle drive were not set up wrong, it was set up perfectly by the factory and its oil was absolutely pristine when I put it in a glass jar before bolting it up to Columbo. It is not really possible to bolt it up wrong or out of alignment because it's machined for and located on the engine cases with metal dowels and the fine manual lists the torque values to use for the bolts. The 'new' middle drive has worked just fine and the oil passed the glass test with 75w90 and 85w90 for the last three 6,000 mile gear oil changes (that's 18,000 miles for them what don't have enough fingers but are too lazy to put down their beer to take off their boots and socks ).

I had 85w90 SuperTech from Wally World in the '850 final drive at the last oil change. There was no water or metal in its oil or on the magnetic drain plug and there was enough oil left in the drain pan (the pan went flying when I knocked over the bike and broke the windshield) to pass the glass test too. This time around I put Redline 75w140 in both drives and I'll see how it looks the next time I drain the oil.

FWIW the 6k gear oil change interval with 80w90 or 85w90 dino juice worked fine for 40,000 miles in the 'old' original '80G middle drive and the '750 final drive too until I wore out the final drive. The 'new' replacement '850 drive is definitely stronger than the 'old' '750 too.

.

[jrm000kc]

Royal Purple 75w90

I've been reading through this trying to figure out if I just wasted $22 on a bottle of Royal Purple 75w90...it was a long day yesterday and I wasn't thinking when I bought the stuff-I really wished I'd bought 75w140. I've already drained and replaced my middle and final drives with the 75w90. I'm not going on any cross country drives-just work and maybe my parents but nothing more than 100 miles. Maybe in a couple of months I'll change it for peace of mind but if there's nothing wrong with it so be it.