Tyres numbers in (brackets)?

[fredintoon]

Went and had a look at my rear tyre/tire the four numbers were 3705.
So that would indicate 2005 or close enough to 8 years old.
This begs the question "how old is too old"? The tire has pretty well full tread depth and shows no sign of cracking.

Hi Brad,
never mind the horror stories, what's most likely is the 8 year old rubber has started to go hard and hard rubber has less grip.
Us sidecar users like that because we'd trade almost anything for tire longevity but solos is different.
Tire mfrs say don't buy a tire more than 5 years old and while that's mostly a CYA thing, 8 years is pushing your luck, best you replace it.

[trbig]

Fred, don't listen to the horror stories?? At least mine was a personal.. not like Nate's that was basically, "I knew this guy this one time from band camp..."

[fredintoon]

Fred, don't listen to the horror stories?? At least mine was a personal.. not like Nate's that was basically, "I knew this guy this one time from band camp..."

Hi Tod,
it's that while catastrophic tire failures do happen, (and not just to over-age tires, neither) they are very rare.
I'd say that 99% of over-age tire incidents are from age-related loss of traction and the most likely failure mode is the one to guard against.
But we are in agreement, go buy new rubber!

[3Phase]

... I'd say that 99% of over-age tire incidents are from age-related loss of traction and the most likely failure mode is the one to guard against.
But we are in agreement, go buy new rubber!

Fred,

Do you mean like when a rider that's new enough to riding that he doesn't know how to read date codes and doesn't seem to believe why they're stamped on the tyre in the first place grabs a handful of brake at an intersection on his six-hundred-pound motorcycle with the old tyre he was asking about and hits a bunch of people kind of loss of traction, or the kinder, gentler, kind of loss of traction where only he and his bike and his old tyre and no inanimate objects are involved?

"Some guys on a Yank website on the other side of the planet told me the tyre was good!"

Nope, not going to happen! Far Canal -- please get a new tyre!

[fredintoon]

Fred,
"Some guys on a Yank website on the other side of the planet told me the tyre was good!"

Hi Scott,
what you been smokin' that makes you think I said that?
What I said was that there's only a 1% chance that an 8 year old tire will blow up like a grenade but a 99% chance that it has gotten hard and lost traction.
And my final sentence was much the same as yours.
"Best you buy a new tire"

[3Phase]

Far Canal -- get a new tyre, tire, or whatever!!

Fred, it was the "never mind the horror stories" part. I saw that you told him to get a new one but it almost looked like a <wink><wink><nudge><nudge>. No, they don't always explode when they're old but it's the fact that they have done along with the other fun things that can happen with old rubber so that's the problem that makes a good horror story. And you know how difficult a good horror story can be if you and the people around you are in shape to tell it after you pry the seat from between the important spots.

Me? I used to date Murphy's daughter in high school. We broke up when I told her dad that he was a homicidal maniac but he's never forgotten me. Every now and then it's "Whack!" when I least expect it while Murphy laughs!

I'm off to go pick up a new windshield and finish packing for the rally this weekend.

Far Canal -- get a new tyre, tire, or whatever!

[crazy steve]

I'll be the contrarian.....

That 'six year expiration' on tires is fallout from the Ford Explorer/Firestone tire debacle years ago. In the wake of all the finger-pointing, some testing was done by the Federal government as well as the tire/car manufacturers and that number was agreed upon. Note that this isn't an 'official' recommendation, but was adopted by the manufacturers... who have a vested interest in selling you more tires and avoiding liability. What wasn't mentioned is that's a worst-case deal; entirely true if you live in Phoenix Arizona (which is where the testing was done and has the most number of sunny days and the highest average daily temperatures of any metropolitan area in the US), but careful reading of the full report reveals that the rate of degradation falls off sharply in more temperate climates. It's also interesting to note that the USDOT was unable to find any verifiable cases of tire age being the sole cause of tire failure or accidents. You'll hear lots of antidotal horror stories, but there's no proof....

Everyone urging you to replace over-age tires (with the exception of Fred) lives in the US 'sunbelt', where this can definitely be an issue. I've personally never had an issue with a 'over-age' tire (or know anyone locally who has) unless the tire is really old (14 years +), but I live in the Pacific northwest part of the US with lower average temps and store my bikes out of the sun (and sunny days aren't all that common...).

Bottom line? It's a judgment call on your part, and you know what your local climate is. If the tire is showing signs of weather-checking (cracks in the sidewall or tread), by all means replace it. How much you abuse your tires will enter into it as well; if you heavily load the bike and/or travel at high speed for extended periods, tire condition (and initial quality) becomes more important.

[fredintoon]

Hi Steve,
I'll be an antidote and post my "old tire" anecdote.
Back at the very end of the last century I bought, on my son's behalf, a 1980 XS650 with less than 5,000 KM on it.
It still had it's original Yokohama tires on it.
Remember, this is Saskatchewan, sunny all Summer, frozen solid all winter, but still, the tires were 20 years old.
They looked perfect, hardly worn at all and no cracks showing anywhere but after 20 years they were as hard as wood.
Made the deal and rode the bike home, mebbe 5KM.
Handling was horrible, I thought
"This bike runs perfect but these tires have gotta go!"
Handed Eric the keys and told him,
"It runs nice but those tires have gotta go."
"Tires are expensive and those look perfect."
"Try it round the block but ride careful"
5 minutes later he's back.
"Hows it run?"
"Runs perfect but those f**king tires have gotta f**king go!"

[crazy steve]

Fred, even I would replace 20 year old tires.......

[Far Canal]

Thanks for all the feedback chaps.
Yesterday I went to the bike shop to get a new front tire fitted as the "Dunlop Qualifier" that was on there looked to be the original one the bike came out with. Although it still had plenty of tread it was hard and had many cracks between the treads. A real no brainer..this one had to go.
At the bike shop I asked the question "How old is too old?".
No one there could definitively answer it. The agreed verdict was "keep an eye on it"
Whaddya mean? I said.
"Well after riding the bike, look too see if any cracking has appeared in the tire."
I wondered later, how would you would keep an eye on a tire that explodes at speed?.
Five years ago I did a total restoration on my 850 Guzzi Le Mans (pasta blaster).
This included 2 new tires. They still have heaps of tread on them and I would not have considered changing them because they are old.
So what will I do about the XS?
I don't know. It's not like these bikes are famous for their footrest scraping cornering ability or anything and no stunt riding is planned for this bike. So realistically its tempting to ease into it and "keep an eye on it". Hmmm

[trbig]

I don't know. It's not like these bikes are famous for their footrest scraping cornering ability or anything...

Ummmm... OK. I wish someone had informed me of this before I got scrape marks all over mine..

[fredintoon]

- - - - So what will I do about the XS?
I don't know. It's not like these bikes are famous for their footrest scraping cornering ability or anything and no stunt riding is planned for this bike. So realistically its tempting to ease into it and "keep an eye on it". Hmmm

Hi Brad,
it's quite easy to get an XS11's footpegs scuffing, it only has to go over about half as far as your Guzzi, eh?
And when you are touching down on 2 bits of rubber and a metal thing is when you REALLY need the tires to grip.
And while your Guzzi's rubber still looks good after 5 years, the way an XS11 burns through tires, especially rear tires, I don't see an XS11 that's in normal use ever having a tire that lasts 5 years anyway.

[Rasputin]

I once took a 23 year old tire that looked good into my local Yammie dealer. I was told that there was nothing wrong with that tire. It was truly serviceable.
Gobsmacked I left and did what any sane person would do...Replaced that tire.
Now some point to the old fact that some old tires were found on trucks, but if you check out any UK site you will find it is illegal to run tires that are over six years old. Point is that you have to do what is right for you in this life. Want to trust your life to old decrepit tires or replace them? It is your choice but the only thing holding you on the road is that particular choice.
I, myself have too many bikes and far too little mileage to really change them on the date code only. I wish I had the money to do that as I would for sure.
Guess what I am saying is that if you are comfortable with the tires then go for it but if I had my choice I would change them.

[3Phase]

Far Canal -- I'm glad to see you replaced the tyre!

crazy steve,

Contrariness is fine but it's not a Merkin thing, it's a Commonwealth thing.


Emphasis mine:-

tirerack.com -- Nothing Lasts Forever...and Tires Are No Exception

The current industry association recommendations regarding inspecting and replacing tires due to age originate outside the United States.

The British Rubber Manufacturers Association (BRMA) recommended practice issued June, 2001, states "BRMA members strongly recommend that unused tyres should not be put into service if they are over six years old and that all tyres should be replaced ten years from the date of their manufacture."

[crazy steve]

From your link.......

"Unfortunately it's impossible to predict when tires should be replaced based on their calendar age alone"

"Therefore every tire's life expectancy ultimately depends on the environment in which it operates and its individual service conditions. The difficult task remains how to attempt to quantify tire life based on calendar age. Arbitrarily replacing tires prematurely based simply on age may result in tires being discarded before their time, contributing to increased operating costs, as well as waste disposal and recycling concerns."

"The NHTSA tire aging field study also indicated a strong correlation of the speed rating with tire durability, with higher speed-rated tires losing the least capability with increasing calendar age. Drivers living in hot climates may want to consider purchasing higher speed rated tires than those that came as Original Equipment."

I'll repeat what I said.... these recommendations came about because they have a vested interest in selling you tires and/or avoiding any possible liability due to failed product, not because they have any definitive proof that tires of a certain age are more prone to fail. Again, if you live in the sunbelt and your tires are exposed to severe environmental conditions, then they're probably fairly accurate as those were the test conditions that produced that number. But if you live in a milder climate, they last longer, and they admit they can't say how much longer.