special fork questions

[jjz28]

OK, I have a 79 special. The left fork seal has leaked oil since I got it. I still ride it all the time so it don't bother me (never rode it when it wasn't leaking). I want to do the seals but it scares me. Anyway, it also leaks a little oil out of the air valve at the top. What would you guys do? Just replace the seals or look for progressive springs? Is the ride that much better with the new springs? One of my rear shocks is leaking too. Anyone have any advice or any links to the seals, springs new rear shocks? Thanks guys.

[GLoweVA]

Ah, the fork seals. I, myself, haven't done the front seals yet, but I'm ready.
I've got a set of replacments for my G, just haven't gotten around to it yet.
(seeing as the G is down for a while)
Here's the tech tip for the fork rebuild.
http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=37399
Last year I did take the forks off the SG for a fluid/oil change out and I did replace a cap on the G about 2 years ago too.

Somewhere on here I thought I read about the rear shock rebuild.

Hope this helps.

[Mr.Bill]

I did not think you can do any rebuilding of the XS1100 shocks, only the XJ shock were rebuildable ?

[barrelguy]

Piece of cake

I recently did the fork seals on my 80 Special - really very easy. Just watch out when you take off the cap - the spring underneath can transport that cap to another area code. I would also HIGHLY recommend a Tkat fork brace. It puts your ride on rails!

[650mark]

front forks

jeff, the springs in the forks have nothing to do with fluid leaks. fwiw, I have Works Performance springs in my '80 special and they are VERY firm. probably fine if you are "boy racer" or have a large fairing on your bike but I think for normal people doing normal riding the stock springs are more than adequate. if your fork seals are leaking then replace them both with GOOD QUALITY new ones, not a hard job at all, I've done a dozen with simple hand tools. be sure to check the condition of the sliders near the bottom of each fork tube as well. the stock rear shocks are not rebuildable, if yours are shot they'll need to be replaced. I have Works Performance shocks on my bike and they are a pain in the butt. they cost the previous owner about $700, really are for racing(on a stock xs11?) not regular street use, and they must be disassembled in order to change the spring preload. hagon makes great street shocks for about $200.

[TopCatGr58]

There are pros and cons with regards to the progressive springs. Because of your fork seal leak, you probably don't have the right amount of fluid in it, and it's OLD FLUID, etc. and so the ports in the dampeners may also have partial clogs, etc., so if your forks are DIVING on braking, it may not actually be the springs fault vs. the lack of fluids and it's condition.

Also, because the special fork uppers are LONGER, progressive only makes 1 length springs, and then they just supply a ~4" spacer to put in the tubes to take up the extra length.

Going up to a slightly higher viscosity of fork oil can help reduce the diving affect, but may also make the overall ride a little stiffer...feeling the small bumps a bit more...YMMV. Standard is 10 wt, so going to 15 can be a good experiment, and easily enough changed if found too stiff.

A tip someone posted that we should get added to the fork tip is to INDEX the cap once it's been removed. Remove the spring, then put the cap back on/in the tube, and get it to start threading in..then slowly loosen it back up along with applying a little bit of pressure, and FEEL for when the threads hop. This is the location of where the threads will start to mesh together, then take a marking pen and mark the cap/tube with an alignment line. THEN when putting the cap back on with the SPRING in...you will know exactly where to put the cap so that with a little pressure and twisting, you'll be able to get the cap threads started without worry about crossthreading it.

It's also suggested to have the front wheel up OFF of the ground or not yet mounted on the fork when putting the cap back on so that it's not putting pressure against the spring, way easier to put the cap on. This is helpful for later WHEN you just need to change the fluid, but not disassemble the front end. Others have posted about techniques to be able to better grasp the large cap nut to be able to apply the pressure and get it turning to start the threads...from a piece of wood drilled to fit the cap, etc..

I've got 4" over length uppers on mine.. but it still felt a little divey, so aside from the regular 4" spacer I had, I first tried a 5" one, but that made it too stiff from too much of a spring preload...cut it down to 4.5" and that was just right....along with using Dexron III tran fluid for fork oil....cheaper, and similar weight to 15, with detergent and non-foaming properties.

T.C.

[jjz28]

Is the fork seals what is letting oil into the air valve? I ride it all the time but the front does dive when I apply the front brake but it doesn't bother me. I pushed the air valve to see if any air would come out and the one that the seals leak had nothing but the other one has air in it. Will seals take care of the oil in the air valve too?

[BigRed]

I replaced my fork seals, and put in progressive springs and rear shocks. None of it was too difficult; just look into the tech tips for taking your forks apart, and be aware that specials and standards have different size forks, so they need different size seals. My only advice for the rear shocks is don't bother buying the HD springs. I opted for them because I'm a heavy guy, but I've got it on the softest setting and it's still too stiff.

For the leaking air valve, you don't need air with progressive springs, or you could use some thread tape and a good cap, or unthread the inside of the schrader valve, put some grease on it, and thread it back in... that might fix your air leak.

[jjz28]

Thanks guys. I know I really need to do this but I ride it all the time the way it is. I might wait until winter. I am guessing that a would have much better handling since my forks aren't really working right at all. I am going to order the seals. I think I will just replace the seals and not worry about the springs. My bike hasn't hit 14,000 yet so I would say the springs are probably good aren't they? Like I said, I ride all the time and to me, I love the way it rides and handles but I know its not right with the front being so soft.

[motoman]

Thanks guys. I know I really need to do this but I ride it all the time the way it is. I might wait until winter. I am guessing that a would have much better handling since my forks aren't really working right at all. I am going to order the seals. I think I will just replace the seals and not worry about the springs. My bike hasn't hit 14,000 yet so I would say the springs are probably good aren't they? Like I said, I ride all the time and to me, I love the way it rides and handles but I know its not right with the front being so soft.

Aside from needing new fork seals, if you'll always run 6-11psi in the forks, the air pressure helps force inner lip of seal tighter around fork tube. This was an old trick we used 4 decades ago on our moto-X bikes drilling and tapping top cap for a Schrader valve. This gave the bike a bit more compression dampening, plus extended sealing ability without creating too much oil areation. My Venturer is only on it second set of seals since new, if thats of any concelation.

[jetmechmarty]

Thanks guys. I know I really need to do this but I ride it all the time the way it is. I might wait until winter. I am guessing that a would have much better handling since my forks aren't really working right at all. I am going to order the seals. I think I will just replace the seals and not worry about the springs. My bike hasn't hit 14,000 yet so I would say the springs are probably good aren't they? Like I said, I ride all the time and to me, I love the way it rides and handles but I know its not right with the front being so soft.

As far as springs, your bike is probably riding as it's supposed to. The OEM springs are progressive wound. The ride and handling of these bikes is very subjective. What I like, you may not like. As an example, I am not really a fan of progressive wound springs. Mine are straight rate, and custom wound for me. I like a sporty ride, so it's pretty stiff. I tried heavy duty XS1100 rated springs in the rear. They were no good for me. Mine are heavier still, and while I'm not small, I'm no heavyweight, either.

I suggest you go though the forks. Clean things up and replace the seals. You can do a little tuning by changing viscosity as suggest by TC. You may also alter the amount of fluid in the forks. Less air space, means less dive, as oil does not compress. Too much fluid and you blow the seals. The tuning range is generally 110-150 mm measured from the oil surface to the top of the tube with the fork compressed and the spring removed.

This is probably more than you wanted to know. You have a lot of options. Much of it will cost you very little.

[Tat2demon]

I want to do the seals but it scares me..

I finally decided to do mine and was quite surprised at how easy it was. In fact it was so easy, I did my XJ650 the very next day.

It is however, a fairly messy job.

[DGXSER]

If it helps HERE is a thread I did specifically on the Special forks.

I highly recommend putting something around that collar on the upper tube to prevent it cutting the new seal on its way in. I also took an old piece of 1X4 oak and cut a notch to fit the cap, similar to the wood tool Phil used. It made the job MUCH MUCH easier.

An affordable upgrade for the rear shock is the XJ shocks IMHO. I have been running those on my SH for a while now and really enjoy them.

[jjz28]

If it helps HERE is a thread I did specifically on the Special forks.

I highly recommend putting something around that collar on the upper tube to prevent it cutting the new seal on its way in. I also took an old piece of 1X4 oak and cut a notch to fit the cap, similar to the wood tool Phil used. It made the job MUCH MUCH easier.

An affordable upgrade for the rear shock is the XJ shocks IMHO. I have been running those on my SH for a while now and really enjoy them.

Thank you very much don! Just what I was looking for. I am glad to hear the special doesn't need the special rod tool. I am going to order 2 sets of seals just in case I cut one. I will probably use the pop bottle wrapped to get into tube. Thanks again, great write up.

[mack]

Rear shocks

The rear shocks on a special can be redone to some extent. The most probable cause for leaks is a small O ring on the respirator adjustment shaft. I have one apart right now from my LH, but got busy with the E so I haven't finished the rebuild on the shock. It's probably easier just to replace/upgrade with new but I like to keep mine original.
If I can find some time I'll post a rebuild video for like minded XS'rs like me. I have to pull a good one apart to verify the fluid volume required.