Oil Drain Plug

[Shadow]

Well, my claim that I'm not mechanically inclined has just been proven. I change the oil in the XS before I finally take it on the road for the first time. I then go for a little spin around the block, I guess somthing got into the threads on the drain plug & she began to bleed oil. Unfortunatly I didn't notice that fact until the bike wouldn't go into gear anymore, and had to get help pushing it home. So if I damaged the threads on the oil drain plug or hole what's the easiest way for me to get it going again, and did I do any damage to it. The engine still turns over & runs fine, the rear wheel will not turn by hand if it's in gear (engine off) but it will not move under engine power, actually when I try to move the bike with the engine it's like it's not in gear because it doesn't stall. Thanks Guys I've learned alot so far, and while she was moving it's nice ride.

[Ken Talbot]

Oh oh! Sounds like you may have drained the middle drive rather than the crankcase. The crankcase drainplug is pretty close in behind the filter cannister, and it points forward. The middle drive drain plug is further back, tucked in up above the centrestand, and it points down. Can you confirm this?

[John]

Did all of the oil leak out, or just some of it? From what you describe, I would look at the clutch itself first. I know you said that the rear wheel wheel won't turn if the trans in in gear. Have you tried to engage 2nd or 3rd gear and start out that way? Does the trans chatter when you try to engage 1st gear? I had an XJ that you couldn't even engage 1st, and would jump out of second under acceleration. A 3rd gear launch will give the clutch a good test. If it stalls or is needs a lot of slippage to take off from a stop, then the problem lies else where. How about the middle drive? Have you changed the gear oil in it? With out more informtion it's hard to figure out.

[Shadow]

Ken, it was the engine oil plug just behind the filter housing facing the front of the bike that I apparently messed up. I still haven't succesfully located the middle gear drain plug (No bike lift).

John, Nope all the oil didn't get out of the compartment she was still drip bleeding when I brought her home. I tried putting her in second and starting but got nothing, no chatter putting her in gear either. Either way if I re-fill the oil chamber it'll still drip out, first I got to fix the drain plug then I should be able to do some testing. I'll definatly try the 3rd gear launch as soon as I can fill the compartment.

Although you both brought up a good point I haven't changed the middle drive oil yet I'll remeber to do that before I try it on the road again.

[Ken Talbot]

One more thing to verify is the proper placement of the o-ring on the filter housing. Assuming that you dropped the housing to get rid of the oil there too, and perhaps changed the filter at the same time, it is quite possible to forget the o-ring or have it sitting out of its channel when you put the filter huusing back on. I did this once (forgot it completely) and made it almost to the end of the street before it dawned on me that the oil light shold have gone out by then. We lived through most of a summer with the oil streak on the road running out of our driveway, up the street, and back around to the driveway - real obvious to our neighbours where it came from! The threads on the drain plug are pretty coarse, and it seems it would be hard to screw them up??

[skids]

Well, maybe you better check out the middle gear oil also. You can take the crank case oil plug to the autoparts store to match-up the threads and go to the "helper parts" rack. I did this. Get one of those longer drain plugs that have nylon gaskets. There are more threads in there, deeper. The plug I got has slots in the sides to clean the female threads as you insert it. Do not overtighten it and get extra gaskets for future oil changes. If your middle gear "differential" is toast, pick one up on ebay for cheap.

Originally posted by Shadow
Ken, it was the engine oil plug just behind the filter housing facing the front of the bike that I apparently messed up. I still haven't succesfully located the middle gear drain plug (No bike lift).

John, Nope all the oil didn't get out of the compartment she was still drip bleeding when I brought her home. I tried putting her in second and starting but got nothing, no chatter putting her in gear either. Either way if I re-fill the oil chamber it'll still drip out, first I got to fix the drain plug then I should be able to do some testing. I'll definatly try the 3rd gear launch as soon as I can fill the compartment.

Although you both brought up a good point I haven't changed the middle drive oil yet I'll remeber to do that before I try it on the road again.

[Shadow]

Ken: Checked to O-ring, it was nice and snug. Apparently I was talented enough to destroy the treads on the drain plug as I discoverd today. After taking the plug out, I tried putting it back in and found it wouldn't tighten. I took Skids advice and went to Candadian Tire and got a new plug as a precaution, I'm going to try somthing called thread restorer first. It says it'll rebuild damaged threads & even has oil drain plugs as an example of the application.

About the middle drive oil, my bike didn't come with the dipsticks. Any suggestion on how to determine how much oil I have to put back in?

Is it possible I damaged the clucth? Since I put it in gear and let out the clutch the bike doesn't move nor does it stall. I'm still going to replace the crankcase oil & see how the bike reacts.

[steelcat]

Check out the maintance section, oil & lubrication - gear oill dip stick. easy to make

[mitch]

OH OH

You dont wanna hear this , but if you ran the middle drive dry , your gonna have to rebuild it or replace it. Same thing happened to my cousin, drained the wrong fluid put 50 miles on it and burned up the middle drive bearings. Ed Condly has a middle drive he will sell , look under bkr in the members list and email him . Hes a good guy and will treat you fair ......................MITCH

[TopCatGr58]

Hey there Shadow,

Okay, well, first, since you didn't drain the middle drive gear oil, then we can hope that it still had some in it and that you haven't fried it. However, running out of oil in the engine, could have created a considerable amount of heat and friction, and since the clutches are supposed to be immersed in oil, they could have gotten worn down very quickly, hence, when you put it in gear and let out the clutch, the engine keeps running but the bike doesn't move and it doesn't stall!!! You will also want to check out the clutch adjustment tech tip, where you reset the clutch at the engine, not just at the handlebar. However, after resetting it, and if the bike still won't move or doesn't stall, then you will probably need a new set of friction plates at the least!

You said that you were able to push the bike home after it died. Was the back wheel turning at all, or were you skidding it along the whole way? You said that you couldn't turn the back wheel if the bike were in gear, but not running? That IS a symptom of a damaged tranny, but not necessarily the middle gear. IF the middle gear is burned, even in neutral it won't turn, so if the back wheel can turn in neutral, then the middle gear IS turning.
Good luck!!! T.C.

[Shadow]

TopCat

When I pushed the bike home in Neutral the rear wheel was turning nice & free, even coasted down two hills with it. The weather hasn't been nice enough for me to repair the drain plug so I can't start it, but I just went outside put the bike in gear and grabbed the rear wheel & was able to turn it with a fair amount of resistance. One thing I should mention, I only lost about half the oil out of the engine.

If I end up needing a clutch job, oh well, it's probably better off having a new clutch in it with me still learning how to ride and the clutch control being what I'm worst at. Now the only dilema there is since my Yamaha dealer mechanic wants nothing to do with my bike what so ever (not even to do a mechanical) I may have to bring it the HD/Honda dealer (don't have the tools nor space to do that one).

[Ken Talbot]

Reading back through all of this, now I'm starting to think something's gone haywire with the clutch. When you work the lever, does it 'feel' normal (i.e. there's a bit of slack in the cable, then you can feel yourself pulling against the springs)? Have you tried the suggested clutch adjustment procedure yet?

[Shadow]

It's the clucth, and unfortunatly I can't use the clutch adjustment procedure because the screws stripped. Looks like I may as well get a clutch job done.

[TopCatGr58]

Hey there Shadow,

Doing a clutch job isn't as tough as you might think. About the only special tools would be a wrench socket big enough for the clutch main nut, and a low range non clicking torque wrench, in the 5-75 lb range, sold at Sears for around $20.00 since the clutch bolts need only 7 lbs, most standard torques start at 10!!

I broke my star pressure plate the first time I did mine, thankfully it was still available from Yamaha at the time. Since then, I've done mine twice, and a couple of other bikes when I did their gear fixes. Everything else is simple allen head and regular box wrench stuff, you could do it in a day or less!!!!

It shouldn't be too hard to get a replacement of the clutch adjusting screw/pin, get a set of new springs while you're at it, and then a set of friction plates. If the adjusting screw is stripped, and the clutch plates are already engaging fully and you still have this slippage, it's difficult to say whether you would need a set of steel plates? As long as they aren't warped, you can clean them up removing varnish and slight burns with fine emory cloth. At least you now know what the problem is, good luck!!!
T.C.