Bike shuts off in gear....

[crazy steve]

..The neutral bulb has power to it, clicking the transmission into neutral adds the ground and completes the circuit. What this has to do with the TCI, I haven't a clue.

When the wire isn't grounded, that 12v seeks a path and it's into the pickups. The steady 12v overwhelms the 'pulsed' signal coming out of the pickups and the TCI stops firing the affected coil....

[bikerphil]

When the wire isn't grounded, that 12v seeks a path and it's into the pickups. The steady 12v overwhelms the 'pulsed' signal coming out of the pickups and the TCI stops firing the affected coil....

Thank you for explaning that Steve, that makes sense.

[BA80]

When the wire isn't grounded, that 12v seeks a path and it's into the pickups. The steady 12v overwhelms the 'pulsed' signal coming out of the pickups and the TCI stops firing the affected coil....

Thank you for explaning that Steve, that makes sense.

Yes, that does make sense. I have to stand by what I said previously though.

I had washed my bike when this occured and it wouldn't start at all, as a matter of fact it backfired violently a couple times.

I remembered that the neutral switch wire had be mentioned in relation to this so I disconnected it. The bike started and I rode it home however it wasn't running well.

Possibly just moving the wire made a difference?

I was having misfire problems coming home from XS Southeast in Chattinooga, Tn. in HEAVY rain. I guess I should have tried that.

I wonder if just grounding the wire with a jumper with alligator clips would work without disconnecting it.

[Schming]

When the wire isn't grounded, that 12v seeks a path and it's into the pickups. The steady 12v overwhelms the 'pulsed' signal coming out of the pickups and the TCI stops firing the affected coil....

Steve, You Sir, are a Godsend.
The Gift You have of deciphering an electrical problem and translating it into laymans terms awes me.

Thanxs

Now, enough of the mushy stuff ...what exactly is inside the protective black sheathing that shorts out ?

Would clear silicone, slathered appropriately, where the Sky Blue wire exits the harness be the "best" remedy or, for longevity, would it be better to open up the sheathing at said location and...do what ?

[BA80]

[crazy steve]

The best bet would be to strip off the OEM outer sheathing, make sure the wire insulation is still good (repairing/replacing as needed), and put some new shrink tube over the splices and any repairs. Then recover the harness with some Scotch33 or Plymouth Premium tape. You could also use shrink tube, but it generally doesn't withstand abrasion as well as the tape does. Resist the temptation to use cheap japcrap tape, that stuff will fall off and leave a mess behind...

[natemoen]

I think there can be 2 different things that can happen.

1) Neutral wire grounding through the pick-up coils.

Or

2) Pick-up coil wires grounding through the neutral wire.

Sort of the same thing but different things work as a temp fix. For you Greg I would say it was #2 since disconnecting the neutral wire fixed it. For me it was #1 because I had to ground out the neutral wire, and I would say #1 is more common by the threads here.

[BA80]

What Steve is saying absolutely makes the most sense. It's quite possible that what I experienced was do to the wire being moved just enough to break the short. In at least one coil anyway.

However, in my limited elacrical knowledge, shorting a short doesn't fix a short. If that makes any sense.

[crazy steve]

However, in my limited electrical knowledge, shorting a short doesn't fix a short. If that makes any sense.

The thing to remember is electricity always takes the path of least resistance. So if you have a short between the neutral wire and one of the pickup coils, shorting the neutral wire to ground is the 'easier' path for the 12v coming from the light. The pickup coils have a high resistance/ohm value, so giving the power a low-ohm path reduces the voltage 'bleed' into the pickup coils low enough (in some cases) that the TCI can 'ignore' it. There can be a fair number of variables involved depended on the 'quality' of all the connections in these circuits, so you may not always get the exact same results.

Technically, this would be called a 'shunt', so you're not really 'shorting' it...

[crazy steve]

Greg, in your case you probably had the two coils shorted to each other, and messing with the harness while disconnecting the neutral wire 'cleared' the short. That would explain the backfire; both pickup coils sending a signal to the same ignition coil 180 degrees apart...

[BA80]

The issue I'm having in my mind is the signal is created by by the reluctor passing over the magnet in the pickup coil which collapses the field sending the pulse to the TCI signaling it to fire it's respecive coil. Correct?

I can understand that a steady voltage would mask the pulse and disrupt the signal. But as you said electricity will take the path of least resistance so if shorted,such as explained by grounding the neutral wire, it seems it would short the signal to ground also.

I'm just trying to wrap my mind around this. Not arguing.

[crazy steve]

I'm no expert in solid-state electronics, but my understanding of the pickup coils is that there's a voltage impressed across the coils (with one wire being a 'ground' or 'common') and as the reluctor swings past the coil that causes a change in the voltage which is what the TCI senses. If the short is on the 'common' wire, you still would get the pulse reading at the TCI. This assumes that the 'short' isn't allowing more voltage than what is already supplied into the coil circuit, although that may not matter.

Any time you have an electrical fault (particularly between two separate circuits), you introduce a lot of factors with unknown values and don't always get expected results. Trying to explain this sort of thing (and plan for it) is why electrical engineers make the big bucks....

[Barnfresh]

This plug behind the fuse panel is the place where the TCI wires and the neutral wire come together. Clean/dry this plug or better yet, remove the blue neutral wire from the plug and jumper around it like in the pic and she will never fail you again... Like Steve said - this is where the tci signals get crossed up when wet. Bring on the car wash...

[BA80]

If my re insulation doesn't work I'll give that a shot. Thanks

[Schming]

Is it one, the other or both

Ok, what happens is the sheathing fills up with water and shorts out the splice of the pick up coil wires inside causing 2 cylinders to drop out when the ground is lost from the neutral light switch. Either wait for it to dry out or if you must ride it now, disconnect the neutral lite wire from the switch at the engine and attach it to ground. This will restore the 2 cylinders although the neutral lite will remain on in all gears, just be aware. The real fix is to waterproof that sheathing, there is a hole in it where the neutral switch wire exits.

Edit: Your spark plug wires or other wires might have also got wet, but if it runs fine until you dump it into gear, then the problem is what I first mentioned above.

This plug behind the fuse panel is the place where the TCI wires and the neutral wire come together. Clean/dry this plug or better yet, remove the blue neutral wire from the plug and jumper around it like in the pic and she will never fail you again... Like Steve said - this is where the tci signals get crossed up when wet. Bring on the car wash...

What is exactly inside the sheathing down by the shifter that seems to be the problem area ?