1980 XS 1100 special--TIRE- Cheng shin Barracuda C926

[jerro]

Hi good people, Has anyone used these Cheng shin Barracuda C926 100 90 19 front street tires or any Cheng Shin tires on their m/cycle. I want to put a front 100/90/19 Cheng Shin on my XS, the reviews all seem pretty good for them but i would like to hear if anyone has any experience with them? Thanks.

[crazy steve]

Never ran them on a XS, but I have ran these on other bikes with good results. One problem though; Cheng Shin pulled out of the US market several years ago, so those have been sitting somewhere for quite a while. And forget about any warranty. When you could still get them, the front cost about $40 and the rear $60 new.

Shinko 712's are the popular 'budget' tire these days, about the same price from most on-line vendors.

[650mark]

tires

the shinko 712's work pretty well on my '80 1100 special. have put about 2,000 miles on them and they ride well. so far all on dry streets. will probably find out how they do in the wet tomorrow here in phoenix. annual new years day ride with about 500 of my closest friends, and it may rain

[motoman]

Never ran them on a XS, but I have ran these on other bikes with good results. One problem though; Cheng Shin pulled out of the US market several years ago, so those have been sitting somewhere for quite a while. And forget about any warranty. When you could still get them, the front cost about $40 and the rear $60 new.

Shinko 712's are the popular 'budget' tire these days, about the same price from most on-line vendors.

Actually ChengShin sold out to Shinko...........unfortunately using the same cord technology, just different tread pattern molds. Was told this by a local dealership purchaser a few years ago. Used the ChengShin tires some 30yrs. ago on my Venturer........once was enough. Just okay when new, but VERY uneven wear gradually became the norm with use. IMO, these fit the mold of 'ya get what cha pay for'.

[Bonz]

Had a set of 712's on the Nighthawk 550 I bought last spring, they were a good tire on that bike, and can't see why they wouldn't be good on the XS, other than the Nighthawk is a 440 lb bike, compared to the XS's 600 lb. Fixed the Nighthawk up and turned it around this fall to a young local fellow. I put about 600 miles on the Nighthawk, and it was a seriously fun bike. The kick from 7000 rpm up to 10,000 rpm redline was amazing, and the shaft drive with hydraulic valve adjusters made it the most easy to own bike that has ever existed. My seat of the pants says it would stay with the XS on about any road I could think of, other than a wide open stretch where top speed of over 115 would come into play, or pulling long uphill grades at interstate speeds while loaded.

Ok, enough about the NH550... Good bike, would buy another one in a heartbeat, just want it to be in better cosmetic shape than the last one to make it a keeper.

When I picked up my used 80G project a month ago, I put a Shinko 230 Tourmaster on the front. Thought about the 712's, but since I know they are a great tire already, wanted to try something different.

Go for the 712's or for a few bucks more, the 230's. Either way I think you will be really happy for not a lot of $$.

[Czekus21]

I put a set of Chen-Ching's on my ol' 79 (Miyami) They seamed to not last very long. I got about 3000 miles on them and had to replace them. I replaced them with the Dunlap Elite series. I will never use Chen-Chings on anything again. Spend a few extra bucks and get good rubber that will last a little bit. You only have two tires between you and the road. Make them good ones. Price being said, I mount and balance my own tires. I've seen too many botched up jobs at $120.00 an hour. The last set of rubber cost me around $140.00 for both front and rear (compaired to the JCW Chen-Chings, $80.00 front and rear). Good rubber will save you money in the long run.

[crazy steve]

Keep in mind tire price rarely reflects mileage; spending twice as much doesn't mean it lasts twice as long, which was the main reason I liked the Cheng shins. They only lasted 2/3 as long as the 'name brand' tires, but cost less than 1/2 as much...

The Dunlop Elites had a reputation for excellent wear, but recent users have reported much reduced mileage, without a corrosponding reduction in price...

[Bonz]

I don't go so far as to get caught up in the "only two tires between me and the road" debate, as I have yet to see an unsafe condition because of any tire or brand.

When I say that, there is always an exception to the rule, and I have heard of brand name tires where a bad one shows up now and then and is written off as an anomaly, just like a bad one now and then with "less than name brand" tires and that tire being black balled as inferior. Seems like unequal treatment for the same sin, per se.

Crazy Steve is very right, tire life is not a function of price. Usually the more expensive tires have higher speed ratings, which by design dicatates a less durable tread compound. Pick your poison, great performance for most any riding you will do at a moderate price or spend the extra money for performance these bikes probably can't use anyway.

Yes, some tires don't balance as easily, some wear longer, some wear differently or more quickly, grip better in the wet or dry, etc. But those are comfort/convenience issues and the rider should be in control as the final link in the chain. Ham fisted riding can't be "tire fixed". Even the low end of tires these days is ahead of what our bikes came from the factory with 30+ years ago!

My ZRX 1200 has a set of Shinko 009 tires on it, the rear has just under 10k miles on it with absolute predictability all around, and it is a great wet weather tire (it is getting replaced this spring as it is almost to the wear bars). The only difference with the front tire is the "hands off" wobble the tire has developed as it wears. Cannot see any cupping or scalloping. The previous Bridgestone BT020 on the front of that bike did the same thing, AND had severe cupping on the left side of the tread.

A previous V Strom 1000 had a Metzeler Tourance on the front and rear. Rear did really well, front cupped and developed the hands off wobble. The Maxxis Presa Detour tires I put on as replacement wore faster, but had no ill handling effects througout their useful life.

My 80 SG has a Dunlop Elite 3 on the rear, 8000 miles and counting, with 4.5 mm of tread depth still remaining. The front Dunlop 404 is wearing out faster than the rear, otherwise this bike has no tire induced quirks and I can lean it over to the edge of the tread on the rear.

I suspect I will be able to to the same on the 80G I am rehabbing, it has a good D404 on the rear, with a new Shinko Tourmaster 230 up front. I did not put a D404 up front because of the tread life on my above mentioned 80 SG.

Ultimately what I am saying is the "Tire Wars" can be whatever we want to make them. As for me and my bikes, I know from experience all tires have always brought me home safe and sound.

[crazy steve]

What always makes me take motorcycle tire claims with a big grain of salt is the fact that in the 70s, a 40K car tire was top-of-the-line, and now with the improvements in technology that's only a moderate-quality tire. Motorcycle tires have totally failed to keep pace, with only minor improvement in wear over the years....

And as Howard pointed out, the XS features a late-70s suspension and really can't take full advantage of what tire improvements have come down the road.

[Bonz]

With all sincerity, what was the tread life of OE tires that came on the XS and bikes of that ERA?

Car tires have gotten much better in terms of tire life, however car technology is so much better in terms of suspension, that tires are able to be built for better mileage and still have more than adequate grip, and good ride characteristics because the suspension is so much better.

On the flip side, performance car tires are similar to "performance" motorcycle tires in that they don't have the best tread wear, but safely allow for higher speeds and more grip.

The thing that is over done, in my opinion, is the speed rating being built around the highest sustained speed the vehicle is capable of, even though they may never see that speed for a one second.

While bike suspension has gotten better, motorcycle tires have to operate in a very different way with leaning for corners, accelerating on one contact patch, braking with the front tire and it's relatively small contact patch, etc. Loss of grip in a car ends up in a wide faced grin after you spin out and continue on the way. Loss of grip on a bike not so much.

Thus back to my question in the beginning, what was the life of OE tires of the XS era, and I'll pose the question as to whether cycle tires could be designed for tread wear on par with cars and still do what a motorcycle tire has to do?

[crazy steve]

Thus back to my question in the beginning, what was the life of OE tires of the XS era, and I'll pose the question as to whether cycle tires could be designed for tread wear on par with cars and still do what a motorcycle tire has to do?

Howard, the OEM tires that came on my bought-new XS wore about the same as what's available now. At 15K miles, I had installed my third rear tire on mine (you can see that third tire here: http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36698). I've personally never gotten more than about 8K out of any rear tire on any bike given my riding style and road conditions. And while you won't find big 'chicken strips' on my tires, I'm not a maniac either.

The OE rear Bridgestones went about 7K each, the Continental (3rd) looked like it may have done a bit better (but the bike got wrecked/parked before I found out). Front tire wear was the typical of about double the rear. So there's been essentially no change in bike tire life in 30+ years...

[Bonz]

Thanks for that perspective on tire life from your experience.

Would you say even though tire life has not increased dramatically or at all, the performance of modern tires (wet/dry traction, cornering grip, braking distance) is materially ahead of tires from the XS era based on having ridden these bikes through the years? We've been focusing on tire life, so how about a feel for the performance?

[crazy steve]

In some aspects yes, some no. They have improved tread designs over the years and problems on things like rain-grooved pavement and grated bridges aren't nearly as prevalent as they used to be. The OEM Bridgestone on the front of my '78E was scarey as hell on a bridge grate. And I'd say that modern tires probably do better in the rain, although not by a huge margin. But again, I think that has more to do with the design, rather than the material used. But overall, I haven't really seen big improvement when 'just' riding.

It's hard to ignore the experiences of the 'Darkside' riders (using car tires on the rear of their big touring/cruisers) who get 20K and up (30K isn't unknown) from less-expensive car tires with few reported problems. Most report 'different' but equal handling and better braking.

We're a very small part of the tire market and a captive audience. I personally think they could produce a much longer-lasting tire, but have no incentive to do so; they're the only game in town, if you ride you'll play by their rules....

Just my .02....

[Bonz]

My take on tire design... And I am NOT an expert, just what I glean from reading the ariticles and info from people that are experts in the field.

The compound more or less determines how well it wears or doesn't, with construction dictated by the need for a stiff side wall, rounded profile and contact patches to transfer acceleration and braking forces. If you've ever weighed tires, touring tires are generally the heaviest, and to my mind that would mean a denser compound, thicker tread and less tire flex (from heavier internal construction) which means less heat is generated, and longer tire life.