Need guidance diagnosing no-start symptoms

[LoHo]

When I crank my bike, it half starts almost immediately, then just cranks, with the only an occasional cough/stumble of trying to start after that. Is this a lean or rich symptom? Reading the plugs is pointless, as it doesn't actually run enough to dirty them. Another symptom is that starter fluid seems to have no effect, making me think I'm set up too rich.

After running well for 14 years before my no-spark hiatus, I found my floats all set pretty rich when I cleaned my carbs. I left them as they were to avoid introducing yet another variable in my quest for restoring her to running status. If these signs indicate too rich, I'll go through them again and set the floats per specs.

[TopCatGr58]

Hey there LoHo,

Okay, trying to recall your no-start hiatus situation....I think you replaced your pickup coils, but more info would have been helpful to all of us that will try to help if we know what was done to the bike, what has been tried, etc.! Lots of threads and bikes to be able to keep all of the details without a refresher....since you started a new thread instead of using your previous one.

Starting fluid doesn't help. You've recently cleaned the carbs, we can only assume that you have verified that they are getting fuel...bowls full of fuel?

After the initial "fire" and then no start...you need to pull a spark plug from #1 and #2 and check to see if they are getting spark?

The TCI's are finicky, and if they aren't getting their 10.5+ volts, they won't work right, won't trigger the ignition coils, and no spark=no start.

My battery had gotten a little weak a while back, would crank the engine, but would never "catch". I put a booster battery to it, and it would start. I also used a booster battery clipped just to the Ignition fuse circuit so that I was giving just the ignition circuit the 12V boost, but not the whole bikes electrical system...bike would still start with the otherwise weak battery turning the engine over since the TCI was getting 12 v from the booster directly.

This sounds electrical more than fuel related.

T.C.

[soccer4m]

quick trick

Howdy Larry,,,,a quick trick to see if the carbs are flowing, is to just pull one of the outside sparkplugs, squirt/pour some gas into the hole, replace the plug and turn it over. If it sounds like it fires over for a second the carbs are the likely culprit. I am guessing you took a plug out and grounded the plug to the engine case, turned it over to check if there is spark or not. If you have and there is spark try the quick gas squirt and report back. Remember it takes a while to fill up the bowls and get the gas into the engine with cranking even with the prime position of the petcock lever. So, good luck and report back....Mike in Sun Diego

[motoman]

When I crank my bike, it half starts almost immediately, then just cranks, with the only an occasional cough/stumble of trying to start after that. Is this a lean or rich symptom? Reading the plugs is pointless, as it doesn't actually run enough to dirty them. Another symptom is that starter fluid seems to have no effect, making me think I'm set up too rich.

After running well for 14 years before my no-spark hiatus, I found my floats all set pretty rich when I cleaned my carbs. I left them as they were to avoid introducing yet another variable in my quest for restoring her to running status. If these signs indicate too rich, I'll go through them again and set the floats per specs.

Hi Larry.......first off, keep that damn startin' fluid away from it( any gas motor for that matter). If it don't start with its own source of fuel.......source out the issue and fix. Sorry for the rant, but hate to see folks resort to products like this instead of solving the issue. IMHO,your issue IS ignition, not carbs or fueling, as is generally the case with many thousands more than you. With an anolog meter, start following the voltage from batt. to coils. My guess, with limited info, would be at the ballast resistor. Bypass it and see what happens. Several other gremlin sources ignition wise, but that's a start.

[tarzan]

I have had the plugs foul on an XS11(new plugs), and also an XS850 that did the same thing. I changed the plugs and they ran. Bad gas can do that also.

[LoHo]

Hey Moto, I wasn't planning to carry a can of ether to replace wrenching, I just wanted to try to settle where the problem might lie. Jeez, I just need her to run a bit to give me some confidence...

[BA80]

It sounds like you might be rich. Pull a couple plugs after you get it to fire then it dies. If it's rich the plugs should have gas on them.

Brant is right about the starting fluid. If you want to prime the cylinders WD40 or carb cleaner works or you can just put some fuel in a spray bottle. Of course the sprayer will be junk after that.

Starting fluid will fry rings or build up and cause damaging explosions.


Try holding the throttle wide open when cranking it if it's flooding. That'll help clear it out.

[DiverRay]

LoHo,
Try putting a battery on the ignition side as mentioned in an earlier post. If you are running rich, it may still fire with a full 12.5V instead of the 11V. As I need to work to earn my $0.50 per day, I can't ride over to help. If you need some quick advice, give me a call. You can find my cell number with a quick look at this post.

[LoHo]

You know, I usually ask questions on here when I know the answer, but don't like it. If I say, "I have no spark", I know I need to check the wires from the TCI to the coil and from the pick-ups to the TCI, but I want someone to say, "Oh, just jump a wire from the orange wire to the green plug and all will be well."

When I was disappointed as hell about not getting her running after I solved the no-spark, I asked about lean/rich. I know the answer is, "Go through the carbs." I had worked on my carbs during the no-spark eon as a way of feeling productive. Even put a new kit in with those cool Viton-tipped needles. I just took them apart and compared old and new. These look okay, right?

[BA80]

That really shouldn't be an issue as long as the float level is correct.

[DiverRay]

Loho, I've got to ask if you replaced the seat AND "O" RING? IF the "O" ring is bad, fuel WILL leak into the bowel no matter what the needle is trying to do. All I can think of for now.

[skids]

He specifies a G model. No Oring.

[LoHo]

Actually, the "Okay, right?" remark was a joke. The needle on the right was the original (since I've owned it) needle, the left is one I bought. Obviously, the float tab would need major adjusting to get the same float height.

I'm going to take them apart again and see what's up, as going back to the old needles has them leaking all over.

[LoHo]

"fuel WILL leak into the bowel no matter what"

I beg your pardon, but what my O-ring does to my bowel is none of your business...let's keep it about the bike, okay?

Just kiddin' ya there, Big Ray.

[DiverRay]

He specifies a G model. No Oring.

Depends, as some DO have the "O" ring type carbs, not the screw in seats. As I've not seen his carbs, I have to plan for the worst.....

I beg your pardon, but what my O-ring does to my bowel is none of your business...let's keep it about the bike, okay?

Hey, it's ALWAYS about the bike! But then, if your cooking dinner for the next ride, that could be different.