If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.
1978 XS1100E K&N Filter
#45 pilot Jet, #137.5 Main Jet
OEM Exhaust
ATK Fork Brace LED Dash lights
Ammeter, Oil Pressure, Oil Temp, and Volt Meters Green Monster Coils SS Brake Lines
Vision 550 Auto Tensioner
In any moment of decision the best thing you can do is the right thing, the next best thing is the wrong thing, and the worst thing you can do is nothing.
And it's also Tube OR Tubeless...even nicer! I vaguely remembered that discussion, thanks to Nate and Steve for finding the info. Funny how it says Blackwall, but shows a large whitewall!
I had done some research as well, found an AVON tire that wasn't quite square profiled, but still designed for vintage style bikes and was available in 16" size, tubeless also.
716 lbs load, 110 mph speed. But their price is a bit higher than the coker!
T.C.
T. C. Gresham
81SH "Godzilla" . . .1179cc super-rat.
79SF "The Teacher" . . .basket case! History shows again and again,
How nature points out the folly of men!
Given the issues with the XS11 in cornering I have concerns about handling in curves with a car design style when the bike switches from the flatter surface to the edge. It really does not take much to induce wobble. Now for those that always cruise at normal speed and just need a tire or guys interested in more rubber during acceleration it might be an advantage.
To fix the problem one should not make more assumptions than the minimum needed.
Ron, for Fred a square profile works well since he has a sidecar on his bike. He doesn't lean much.
Nathan
KD9ARL
μολὼν λαβέ
1978 XS1100E K&N Filter
#45 pilot Jet, #137.5 Main Jet
OEM Exhaust
ATK Fork Brace LED Dash lights
Ammeter, Oil Pressure, Oil Temp, and Volt Meters Green Monster Coils SS Brake Lines
Vision 550 Auto Tensioner
In any moment of decision the best thing you can do is the right thing, the next best thing is the wrong thing, and the worst thing you can do is nothing.
The things to remember about the 'Darksiders' is almost all of them are riding large, heavy touring bikes or cruisers, and all of these bikes were designed to use radial tires. And none of them can generate large lean angles without seriously dragging stuff. While the XS was a large bike in it's day, today it's only a middleweight. And not designed for radials either.
If I owned one of those bikes, I'd make the swap in a heartbeat. I was very intrigued when I first came across this, and read everything I could find. But I came to the conclusion that for the XS (and my Harleys too) there just isn't any viable car tires that will physically fit and offer the advantages these guys are seeing. That tire I linked to was last used as OEM in the very early fifties and the tread was designed in the forties, even if the carcass features more modern contruction. It's not going to have the same wear/handling as a modern design and being a 'specialty' tire isn't cheap either. If you're running a sidecar like Fred is, this may be a great choice if the tire will last for 30K miles or more. The sidecar racers use flat-section tires, they do work...
There seems to be two main objections to 'darkside' tires from the manufacturers and 'normal' riders; one, the loss of contact patch when leaning. Very true, but when you start with a patch that's 2 or more times larger, a 50% loss while leaning simply puts you back to the 'normal' patch size. Two (and this one I find that the manufacturers are being more than a bit confusing on purpose), is that the car tire isn't designed for the stresses of motorcycle use. Again true, but what they fail to say is car tires are designed to withstand much more stress compared to a bike tire. Go to any autocross event and watch how the front tires on many cars flex under hard cornering. You'd trash a bike tire under those conditions quickly...
This definitely wouldn't work on every bike and for every riding style, but under the right conditions I can't really see why it wouldn't. And the big question is, if the tire manufacturers can improve car tires like they have, why haven't there been comparable improvements in bike tires? I can remember when a 40,000 mile tire was top of the line, now that's merely a middle-grade tire; you can get tires with up to a 90,000 mile treadwear guarantee now. Bike tire wear has remained pretty much the same for as long as I've been riding, how come?....
Fast, Cheap, Reliable... Pick any two
'78E original owner - resto project
'78E ???? owner - Modder project FJ forks, 4-piston calipers F/R, 160/80-16 rear tire
'82 XJ rebuild project
'80SG restified, red SOLD
'79F parts...
'81H more parts...
Other current bikes:
'93 XL1200 Anniversary Sportster 85RWHP
'86 XL883/1200 Chopper
'82 XL1000 w/1450cc Buell, Baker 6-speed, in-progress project
Cage: '13 Mustang GT/CS with a few 'custom' touches
Yep, can't leave nuthin' alone...
This definitely wouldn't work on every bike and for every riding style, but under the right conditions I can't really see why it wouldn't. And the big question is, if the tire manufacturers can improve car tires like they have, why haven't there been comparable improvements in bike tires? I can remember when a 40,000 mile tire was top of the line, now that's merely a middle-grade tire; you can get tires with up to a 90,000 mile treadwear guarantee now. Bike tire wear has remained pretty much the same for as long as I've been riding, how come?....
I remember seeing a video taken from the rear fender view of the rear tire of a big bike running one of these car tires and taking considerable corners and such, and it was able to flex to allow stable cornering and such, and they talked about the 10's of thousands of miles they were able to obtain vs. the bike tires.
Steve, I think that the tire manufacturers look at bikers as hobbyists, and that riders are doing it as a leisure sport activity, not as a commuter necessity. Cars for most folks are just shuttle devices, and they don't take corners very fast, so less stress overall. Our type/style of bike is a rather small percentage of the types of bikes that are popular in the U.S.. Sport bikes I would believe are a big part of the bike population, and they ride them for PERFORMANCE, speed, cornering, etc. and not taking multi-hundred mile trips across the country. So bike tires are considered expendable luxury items and not necessities, and so the tire companies are going to keep sticking it to us for our "toys".
T.C.
T. C. Gresham
81SH "Godzilla" . . .1179cc super-rat.
79SF "The Teacher" . . .basket case! History shows again and again,
How nature points out the folly of men!
- - - found an AVON tire that wasn't quite square profiled, but still designed for vintage style bikes and was available in 16" size, tubeless also. - - -
>
Hi TC,
that tire (excuse me, tyre) could well be a contender except that I don't see anywhere in the link that says it's tubeless.
Fred Hill, S'toon
XS11SG with Spirit of America sidecar
"The Flying Pumpkin"
and so I think they expected folks to look at the first one first to "learn" their tyre type designations.... after the tyre/rim size....ie. 5.00 x 16 it has TT after it which apparently means TUBE TYPE!
Looks like the Coker is a better choice if you're wanting tubeless!!
T.C.
T. C. Gresham
81SH "Godzilla" . . .1179cc super-rat.
79SF "The Teacher" . . .basket case! History shows again and again,
How nature points out the folly of men!
- - - Looks like the Coker is a better choice if you're wanting tubeless!! - - -
Hi TC,
nah, I rechecked that link. The leftside column in the spec sheet gives the spec headings like size, no. of plies etc. including Tube or tubeless.
The rightside column spells it out.
Sez TUBE TYPE
2 more scratched off the list.
Looks like I need to ask the tire store, "what you got that's cheap in a 130/90-16?"
Fred Hill, S'toon
XS11SG with Spirit of America sidecar
"The Flying Pumpkin"
Comment