Electrical gurus needed!

[jwhughes3]

So the PO of Rising Sun was big on re-designing stuff - hence he designed circuit boards with LED clusters to make new LED turn signals and a flashing arrow taillight.

Fast forward to my time and one turn signal was burned up (I looked inside and it looked burned and didn't light up).

So I have a set of regular, standard turn signals for the front I can just pop them on and go, right? After all, I had added a mini set to the rear, because a single directional isn't legal in California, therefore wasn't legal on base and I had to - just tied into his wiring and worked like a charm.

Well - it isn't as simple as that-

There are bundles of wires he ran to each front signal - with a red and black for each side - factory only has a hot wire - I assume the LED needed a better ground... so I have a 50/50 chance of getting it right - I clip the 2 wires going to the bad signal and take it off - go to test which is hot and now the signals won't come on at all - in fact the instrument panel is dark completely -

I have traced those signal wires back to a relay

and here is back side:

and its fed with the original red/white wire from harness I think that comes out up front near coils on right:


So should I cut the whole thing out and start rewiring back to stock or is there a process I can go through to figure out what's what.

My dash lights (and tach) didn't go out till I started messing with this stuff and no fuses are broken (spade type in a new fuse block)

I have all three wires soldered together at the fuse block - two brown and the bundle PO added to the LEDs :


All ideas appreciated.

Thanks
John

[crazy steve]

Ya gotta love POs....

I think there's several things going on here. First, that relay should be for the headlight/instrument lights and I'm hoping that's actually a red/yellow; if it is in fact the red/white, then that relay has something to do with the ignition. The turn signal power should be a brown to the flasher, a brown/white after leaving the flasher to the switch. The hot wires to the turn lights themselves should be dark brown and green. Which means the harness has been hacked...

How many fuses do you have? I only see three of those. If the signals are somehow connected to the ignition circuit, you might have popped a fuse. I'd spend the time to see just what is going where too; sounds like somebody got 'creative'.

[motoman]

Not sure John, maybe LED's and conventional bulbs don't play well together with the signal circuit breaker.......

[jwhughes3]

Engine runs

Ya gotta love POs....

I think there's several things going on here. First, that relay should be for the headlight/instrument lights and I'm hoping that's actually a red/yellow; if it is in fact the red/white, then that relay has something to do with the ignition. The turn signal power should be a brown to the flasher, a brown/white after leaving the flasher to the switch. The hot wires to the turn lights themselves should be dark brown and green. Which means the harness has been hacked...

How many fuses do you have? I only see three of those. If the signals are somehow connected to the ignition circuit, you might have popped a fuse. I'd spend the time to see just what is going where too; sounds like somebody got 'creative'.

Even without signals so ignition is getting power. Only three fuses in block - main 30amp is a big yellow wire with a waterproof housing tucked behind block. I pulled each spade and checked to see if it melted. I know the two brown wires together on far right probably is part of the problem. My other bikes arent like that.

It could be red/yellow. Garage light makes it hard to see sometimes. I will check on it. Front wires definitely not brn/grn. I was trying to trace diagram and it made my head hurt.

@motoman - i ran the bike for a year with mixed signals, LED in front and LED+bulbs in rear without problems. Somehow I messed it up by removing the front signals, but I had to as with one burned up it would not be safe on road or pass inspection.

Thanks guys. Will look again tonight at it.

John

[crazy steve]

This will help with the tracing....http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=35337

[jwhughes3]

Thanks guys

I think Ive got it sorted out....i have all four signals blinking anyway even if it still isnt wired like stock!

I found the signals tied into ignition circuit, that wasnt helping , and separated it back out.

Looks like I may finish this bike in time for Friday to take to my brother-in-law in Lufkin. He has been after me for a year since I brought it home after Durango Rally. He and his youngest son (18) have both since gotten the course and licenses and are ready to start riding. Its hard enough to troubleshoot in person, so Im trying to make sure I dont have to do it over the phone on this bike

And before y'all say they should not start on the 11...been there said that...but he's grown up and will make sure they practice right and slow at first...they are 6'5" and 6'6" and need a bigger bike to keep from being cramped up like a monkey bike so I conceded to his argument. Plus not much city traffic to worry about in East Texas.

Thanks for all the help and diagrams!

John

[jwhughes3]

Damn this bike!!

I have all signals working properly every time.

Go to start and no spark. Was running (badly without a sync) before.

I got no spark at plug.
I get no juice to coil.
No voltage at #6 TCI power in wire (R/Y) second from bottom left looking at back of plug

Battery is fully charged and I even added a booster for testing to maintain full 12V while cranking.

R/Y ignition wire at fusebox has 12V both sides of fuse.

I did not mess with those wires when fixing signals.

Checked in headlight housing for shorts, none found near switch.

Aaargh!

Just venting...

John

[BA80]

You know the proceedure John.

1) pull the tank

2) bypass everything you can think of

3) change the fuse and reverse disassembly proceedure

[jwhughes3]

Thanks Greg

For letting me vent to you on the phone so I didn't shoot the bike or track down the PO for revenge...

I backtracked everything like you suggested and sure enough that lighting relay for the LEDs that wasn't needed was still needed because somehow the ignition coils are fed from it too.

So got it tied back in and vroom, vroom.

Five minutes to sync those really clean and purty carbies and The Rising Sun is roaring like it never has before.

Now that its all back together and ready for BIL I am not sure I want to part with it (but I will.....)

I sure hope I never become the dreaded PO. I will surely pass on that this funky wiring is NOT my fault. I suppose I should be grateful since this bike was a basket case in pieces when the PO took it on as a project. So it lives on now in better shape than when I received it.

BTW the really cool flashing arrow LED taillight was saved and still works.

Goodnight.

John

[natemoen]

So what is this really cool flashing led light? I am looking to make something that sounds like that. Maybe a little reverse engineering is in order here...

[jwhughes3]

You dont want to engineer this...

Everything is gobbed in orange RTV, there is foam glued with RTV (not well) and cardboard inside the taillight lens. Wires go to one of bulb sockets and melted in place with hot glue it seems.....

If you built this I'd revoke your Engineer title

Its a panel of LEDs in rectangle of plastic that fits inside lens. Has about 120 total in a 6x20 config. When taillight is on all are lit at regular intensity them brakes make it flash three times and stay bright. Turn Left or Right a progressive arrow 4 tall grows left or right, flashes then repeats.

You can probably buy one though.

If it was me I would have soldered wiring to inside base of an 1157 bulb for easy hookup and removal. But I dont know how to make the arrow thingy.

John

[natemoen]

I am not saying an identical repop of it. It is all about the concept and the components used that matters!

[fredintoon]

I am not saying an identical repop of it. It is all about the concept and the components used that matters!

>
Hi Nate,
you could also look at V-shaped repeater flashers built into your mirrors like I see on modern pickup trucks.
They are there on trucks so the driver knows his main signals are actually working but they would sure look trick on a bike.

[natemoen]

>
Hi Nate,
you could also look at V-shaped repeater flashers built into your mirrors like I see on modern pickup trucks.
They are there on trucks so the driver knows his main signals are actually working but they would sure look trick on a bike.

Not the same.

[fredintoon]

Not the same.

Hi Nate,
You want scrolling Vee LED turn signals which are not the same as pulsing Vee LEDs in your mirrors.
I know they are not the same.
Well kinda the same, neither of them look at all like the stock signal's boring amber blob, eh?