General question about production numbers & values etc.

[300kph]

While the 1978 XS1100 was a revolutionary bike for some reason it has not attained the esteemed collector status of say the CBX or the different configurations of the Kawi 1000...

Does anyone know how many XS11's were sold in 1978 in relation to say the CBX, GS1000 and KZ1000 (Z1Rs / KZ1000 & LTDs)

Sport bike enthusiasts I have communicated with say the shaft was part of the reason it is thought of differently in classic bike circles. The chain bikes for some reason have the mystique and seem to capture the sense of the era. The fact chain drive is still the gold standard of sport bikes adds creedence to that thinking I suppose.

I sold Yamaha at a multi brand shop in the late 70's - early 80's and would like to own an Eleven to round out my small stable of period bikes.

I am trying to establish a value of a clean low mile 1978... A contact of mine had a chance to pick up a 1978 6 years ago that was still in the crate and could not come up with the $6000 that the seller wanted. That seems (in retrospect) like a real steal... While there are no crate bikes out there the only option is finding something minty or restorable... Older bikes that have been in long-term storage do frighten me somewhat.

What are members thoughts on values of the 1978, up and downsides of old bike purchase... what should one expect to pay and what surprises should one expect with a really old bike that has not turned a wheel in years.

Will happily share Honda, Kawi and Suzi info with other members interested in sharing stories about older models.

300kph

[jmacsuga]

My XS1100E, Model Year 1978, $300.00. It runs just fine!!!

I got mine here in Spokane, and it was a real steal. You can see my photos at http://jimphoto.freeprohost.com/Yamaha78 I have had to do some work to it, and not quite finished yet, but it has been out on the road and seems to work OK.

[crazy steve]

...I am trying to establish a value of a clean low mile 1978... A contact of mine had a chance to pick up a 1978 6 years ago that was still in the crate and could not come up with the $6000 that the seller wanted. That seems (in retrospect) like a real steal... While there are no crate bikes out there the only option is finding something minty or restorable... Older bikes that have been in long-term storage do frighten me somewhat.

Clean, low-miles, all original '78s seem to go for between $4 and $5K, at least the last few examples I've seen did. I didn't see these in person, so I can't judge as to whether or not these were 'mint' or not. It will depend on just how close to showroom new you want, or if a 'very nice' example will do. Clean, unmolested bikes don't turn up too often though (maybe one or two a year?), so you may not be able to be very picky.

As far as a 'restorable' bike, I wouldn't let long-term storage issues scare you off if the bike is very good cosmetically, as any mechanical problems from storage are much easier overcome than tracking down some OEM parts. Doing a cosmetic restoration is much more expensive; replicating the OEM paint will be a $1K+ exercise, and finding a really good (not show quality) OEM exhaust will be in the $500-up range. For NOS exhaust, those have gone for $12-1600 on the extremely rare occasions when one turns up. There's very little still available from Yamaha for these, so you're pretty much limited to used/aftermarket and the increasingly rare NOS parts for restoring one. There are some very nice reproduction parts available out of Europe, but there are significant differences to the US models so you have to be careful there if 'originality' is important to you.

I'll throw one more thought out there; the '79F model is all-but-identical to the '78, with the paint color/graphics being the only easily noticable difference. There are a few other detail differences, but only the most sharp-eyed observer will spot them. These are rarer than the '78 models, as the new 'Special' model stole a lot of their sales.

[300kph]

Thanks guys! keep em coming!

[Rasputin]

Up here in Canada we have the advantage of having bikes with less mileage, rust etc because we can use them less. We also have the disadvantage of less market for these bikes due to a shorter season. The best advice I can give is to look a lot and do not buy the first thing you see. I have bought full bikes for 300 bucks that require little fixing to bikes for 150 bucks that drive me crazy with the amount of repairs needed. Do some research and find out what may be needed before buying. I do go through any bike I end up with and have spent quite a few bucks getting them back in running order. One big point is your ability/willingness to work on the bike. If you just want to ride it without repairs etc, you will have to find a showroom shape one. If you think that you can have it fixed at a dealers then you will spend way more than any XS is worth. This site is invaluable, if you want to work on it yourself.

[crazy steve]

I'll throw this out too....

If you don't insist on complete originality or flawlessness, you could fairly easily find a decent used '78-80 standard and get it to near-new condition or at least 'very presentable' (except for 'correct' paint and maybe a few other items) for under $3K no sweat. There's a handful of OEM parts that are hard to find; more or less in order of difficulty: exhaust, seats/seat pans, front turns/mounts (most went missing when fairings were fitted), sidecovers. Find a bike with as many of these parts present (in good condition; the exhaust and seats rust out) as possible and you're halfway there. There's quite a few of these around with fairly low miles that have been sitting, usually with carb or electrical problems, all issues that can be fixed. Some may have the dreaded '2nd gear problem' (pops out of gear under load), but even that isn't that big a deal.

Now, I'm assuming you can 'do it yourself'; if you're planning on paying somebody to do the work, spend the $4K+ on the nicest one you can find, it'll be cheaper...

[jetmechmarty]

If you think that you can have it fixed at a dealers then you will spend way more than any XS is worth.

I have spent far more than mine is worth, doing all the work myself. I like to think it rides better than when it was new. It probably does.

[XS1100_OEM4ME]

Jimho

JIMHO, the reason that the XS1100's arent selling for big $$$ is the law of business, supply and demand. If I got my info correct, The XS1100's took Yamaha to 1st place in sales on Jap bikes, especialy the Specials, so there were a tone of them made, and because it was well made, there is a tone of them still out there. The CBX was a very limited production bike, due in part to the cost, and they demand a big prem. in mint shape today. Take for example the 1969 BOSS 429 Cobra Mustang, only 856 ever made, not much better then a 428 mustang, but worth 10 times as much, or the Mopar Hemi's. the Mopar wedges ran better on the street, but the hemi's are bringing over a million dollars for the right model and condition? I had a 2001 BMW M 3.2 Roadster, they sell for three times as much as a 2001 3.0 Roadster cuz they only made 400 of them for the US, sure it was a little faster then the 3.0 Roadster, but not that much. Again, JIMHO

While the 1978 XS1100 was a revolutionary bike for some reason it has not attained the esteemed collector status of say the CBX or the different configurations of the Kawi 1000...

Does anyone know how many XS11's were sold in 1978 in relation to say the CBX, GS1000 and KZ1000 (Z1Rs / KZ1000 & LTDs)

Sport bike enthusiasts I have communicated with say the shaft was part of the reason it is thought of differently in classic bike circles. The chain bikes for some reason have the mystique and seem to capture the sense of the era. The fact chain drive is still the gold standard of sport bikes adds creedence to that thinking I suppose.

I sold Yamaha at a multi brand shop in the late 70's - early 80's and would like to own an Eleven to round out my small stable of period bikes.

I am trying to establish a value of a clean low mile 1978... A contact of mine had a chance to pick up a 1978 6 years ago that was still in the crate and could not come up with the $6000 that the seller wanted. That seems (in retrospect) like a real steal... While there are no crate bikes out there the only option is finding something minty or restorable... Older bikes that have been in long-term storage do frighten me somewhat.

What are members thoughts on values of the 1978, up and downsides of old bike purchase... what should one expect to pay and what surprises should one expect with a really old bike that has not turned a wheel in years.

Will happily share Honda, Kawi and Suzi info with other members interested in sharing stories about older models.

300kph

[DGXSER]

Hey OEM, We all wish it was purely a matter of numbers made. There also has to be a demand for the item. Which there is a limited amount of that as well. If you mention a Boss 429 Mustang you would be hard pressed to find someone who would not know what your talking about. But mention an XS1100, and nine times out of ten I get blank stares. Kind of like the Porsche 914-6 kind of a rare car, not alot made, but not a big market either. Not alot of people know what it is.

[XS1100_OEM4ME]

I agree

I agree, If 9 out 10 guys knew what a XS1100 was and they all wanted one, you couldn't buy for 10 thousand dollars! If you mention "pan head" or "shovel head"
most guys dont know the real differance, they just know its an HD and thus COOL, ITO, and as such, they bring big $$$

a quote from my post:

"JIMHO, the reason that the XS1100's arent selling for big $$$ is the law of business, supply and DEMAND"

"

Hey OEM, We all wish it was purely a matter of numbers made. There also has to be a demand for the item. Which there is a limited amount of that as well. If you mention a Boss 429 Mustang you would be hard pressed to find someone who would not know what your talking about. But mention an XS1100, and nine times out of ten I get blank stares. Kind of like the Porsche 914-6 kind of a rare car, not alot made, but not a big market either. Not alot of people know what it is.

[crazy steve]

Yamaha never released any production numbers, so all you have is best guesses as to how many were sold. But I personally don't think the numbers for the '78 model were all that huge (under 10K in the US?), as I rarely saw another one when riding mine around 'back in the day'. We tried to do a 'hi-low number' search here (http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread...serial+numbers) and the biggest number that showed up was 2H7-009251, which would have been 9150 bikes. The styling I think was a major stumbling block for many, as the bike was very 'non-traditional' looking compared to other models. The later Specials sold much better, with their 'Harley-esque' styling and more conventional round lights.

The CBX gets points for being exotic; it didn't sell all that well either, but had the advantage of being the 'first' (at least from a still-in-business maker) six-cylinder street bike available to anyone with a reasonable amount of money. The XS11 didn't have any big tech 'firsts' (unless you count the vacuum advance, which few people were even aware of), 'just' being a combination of ideas that had all been seen before, but maybe not all in one place. Or as fast....

One other thing that has hurt the XS is Yamaha is the poorest of the 'big four' Jap makers at servicing their 'vintage' bikes with OEM parts. Yamaha discontinued a lot of parts pretty early, and being unable to get the 'right' repair parts when needed turned many into 'old bikes' with little value...

That's my .02 worth....

[crazy steve]

...Take for example the 1969 BOSS 429 Cobra Mustang, only 856 ever made...

By the way, that number is for the '70 Boss 429. Ford only built 500 of the '69 models (the minimum number required by NASCAR to qualify the motor for racing), but the '70 models could actually be dealer-ordered. The ones they're still looking for are the two Boss 429-powered '70 Montegos that Mercury built, and supposedly there's 4-5 Boss 429 Cougars out there too... but the Cougars probably ended up as ProStocks.

[XS1100_OEM4ME]

Sorry, I said 856, I ment 859, I know, i had one, but only for a short time for resale, forgot about the two Cougars and missed by one

"1969 ModelIn 1969 there were 859 Boss 429s made by Ford Motor Company. 2 of which were Cougars for Lincoln/Mercury Race Division. There were five different colors available in 1969 (Raven Black, Wimbledon White, Royal Maroon, Candyapple Red, and Black Jade) and the only color for the interior was black. The hood scoop was the same color as the car. All these cars were a manual transmission and there was no air conditioning available due to the size of the engine".


"The Boss 429 is arguably one of the rarest and most valued muscle cars to date.[1] In total there were 859 original Boss 429s made. The origin of the Boss 429 comes about as a result of NASCAR. Ford was seeking to develop a Hemi engine that could compete with the famed 426 Hemi from Chrysler in NASCAR's Sprint Cup Series (then known as "Grand National Division"). NASCAR's homologation"

1970 ModelIn 1970 there were 499 Boss 429s made by Ford Motor Company. There were five new exterior colors (Grabber Orange, Grabber Green, Grabber Blue, Calypso Coral, and Pastel Blue) and the interior was available in Black or White & Black. The hood scoops for this year were all painted matte black regardless of the color of the car. These cars also had a manual transmission and no AC was available. The Hurst Shifter was also standard equipment for this year

By the way, that number is for the '70 Boss 429. Ford only built 500 of the '69 models (the minimum number required by NASCAR to qualify the motor for racing), but the '70 models could actually be dealer-ordered. The ones they're still looking for are the two Boss 429-powered '70 Montegos that Mercury built, and supposedly there's 4-5 Boss 429 Cougars out there too... but the Cougars probably ended up as ProStocks.

[jetmechmarty]

All of the Boss 429's left the factory as "R" code Mach 1's. The shock towers were modified to allow room for the hemi head 429....... I love this stuff.


I was unaware of the lack of parts support by Yamaha. I've been impressed with how much stuff I can buy for a 30+ year old motorcycle. I wish there was more available, but then I'd never need another bike. I have a garage full of XS650's and I can get almost anything for them. The aftermarket fills all of the holes left by Yamaha. I'm going to continue my XS650 hobby because of this. Why would I by a new Guzzi V7 or a new Bonneville when arguably I can build an XS650 that is better and less expensive? So many XS650 bikes has led to a great aftermarket. At least, until they turn them all into hardtail choppers.

When last I went into a Ford dealer seeking parts for a 15 year old Thunderbird, they told me, "Get lost." I no longer have the Thunderbird.

[Pat Kelly]

Here ya go:

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=kelly+blue+book+motorcycles

Hope this helps