Wire wheels on an XJ1100?

[Geissingerj]

This is probably something that should fit in the modifications section, but it doesn't seem like many people use that section and I was afraid no one would see if I posted there. Apologies to the mods for posting out of category, but my question is this. I was reading a thread on XJBikes where the person posting had taken the front end off a virago, and the rear wheel as well and was thereby able to run a larger rear tire and the wire wheels off the virago and also increased the rake as a result. My question is, has anyone tried this on an 1100? From what was posted in the other thread it seems that the head bearings on my XJ1100 and on an XV1100 but I don't know how much that would help me and unless I'm mistaken the XV1100 didn't use wire wheels. Anyone put wire wheels on an 82 XJ1100, or know what it would take to do so? I'm planning to make some changes to mine over the winter and would LOVE to be able to put wire wheels on it, and especially a fatter rear tire. A little more rake would be nice as well, though it's not as big of a priority for me.

Thanks in advance for any and all comments.

Here's a link to the thread I was talking about.

http://www.xjbikes.com/Forums/viewto...00.html#295800

[natemoen]

It is possible to go with a wire wheel on the rear. It is difficult and expensive. There was only one wire wheel that was made and fitted to a compatible shaft drive as our and that bike was VERY limited in production (something like 100 bikes) and it was only available on Japan. There was also someone that used a stock where and machines it down to the hub and laced it into a wire wheel. There is some discussion in this thread.

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33853

[crazy steve]

The front wheel is no problem; a laced front off a late 70s/early 80s XS650 will bolt on. It's the rear wheel that's the impossible one....

Yamaha built a limited-production (100 bikes?), only-sold-in-Japan-for-one-year XS850 that had a laced rear wheel that would bolt-on to the XS/XJ11, but try and find one; that's the 'impossible' part. There was a recent posting detailing a scratch-built wheel, but that involved cutting the center out of a stock wheel and using that for the basis of a custom-built hub... not a low-buck solution for most. Swapping a rear wheel off a XV-series bike may be possible, but you'll lose the rear disc brake; most of those had a drum rear brake.

You'll run into similar issues trying to fit a large rear tire; the maximum width that will fit without extensive swingarm mods is 5.45" wide (a 140/90-16 tire without raised white lettering will usually fit), and even with mods, the largest tire you can fit will be 6.15" wide. To go larger, a chain-drive conversion/swingarm swap will be needed (big $$$).

Not what you wanted to hear, but it is what it is....

[Geissingerj]

It is possible to go with a wire wheel on the rear. It is difficult and expensive. There was only one wire wheel that was made and fitted to a compatible shaft drive as our and that bike was VERY limited in production (something like 100 bikes) and it was only available on Japan. There was also someone that used a stock where and machines it down to the hub and laced it into a wire wheel. There is some discussion in this thread.

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33853

Thanks for the information, I'll give it a read!

The front wheel is no problem; a laced front off a late 70s/early 80s XS650 will bolt on. It's the rear wheel that's the impossible one....

Yamaha built a limited-production (100 bikes?), only-sold-in-Japan-for-one-year XS850 that had a laced rear wheel that would bolt-on to the XS/XJ11, but try and find one; that's the 'impossible' part. There was a recent posting detailing a scratch-built wheel, but that involved cutting the center out of a stock wheel and using that for the basis of a custom-built hub... not a low-buck solution for most. Swapping a rear wheel off a XV-series bike may be possible, but you'll lose the rear disc brake; most of those had a drum rear brake.

You'll run into similar issues trying to fit a large rear tire; the maximum width that will fit without extensive swingarm mods is 5.45" wide (a 140/90-16 tire without raised white lettering will usually fit), and even with mods, the largest tire you can fit will be 6.15" wide. To go larger, a chain-drive conversion/swingarm swap will be needed (big $$$).

Not what you wanted to hear, but it is what it is....

Actually although I would have liked an easier alternative, this is all great information. Thanks for the speedy response, and I appreciate all the info you guys have given me. I don't think the scratch built wheel is really a viable option for me, plus I like the disc brakes so that's not really something I want to go away with. I don't think I'll go through swapping the front if the wheels won't match, so maybe I'll just clean these up and go from there.

I doubt they would be in my price range, but are there any motorcycle shops you know of that make aftermarket wheels for this bike?

[fredintoon]

- - - - Anyone put wire wheels on an 82 XJ1100, or know what it would take to do so? I'm planning to make some changes to mine over the winter and would LOVE to be able to put wire wheels on it, and especially a fatter rear tire. A little more rake would be nice as well, though it's not as big of a priority for me. - - -

Hi Josh,
as has been posted, a front wire wheel from an XS650 will plug right in. Three different styles of them.
The back wheel is the problem, you'll win a $100 million lottery before you find that super-rare Japanese rear so it's DIY time.
You will need to have or have access to a lathe, a TIG welding set and the necessary operating skills.
Cut the hub from a cast wheel, turn two registers on it to accept two spoke rings, align the spoke holes and weld them on.
Lace the hub into the rim of your choice.
Note that the fattest tire that will clear the swingarm is a 140 and only some of those.
The only way to change the rake is to cut'n'weld the frame. You sure you wanna do that?
When I was younger and had more ambition I swapped my XS650's cast wheels for wire wheels and yes! The bike looked great.
My son whined the wheels off me for his XS650 and now his bike looks great.
But we both agree, wire wheels are a right swine to keep clean, he still thinks it's worth the effort.
He's even willing to switch back to tubed tires to run those wire wheels.

[crazy steve]

...but are there any motorcycle shops you know of that make aftermarket wheels for this bike?

There is almost no aftermarket 'custom' parts for these, so the short answer is no. There are some wheel makers who make 'modular' style wheels, but those are big $$$ ($600+ per wheel) and you'd still need a custom hub.

[Geissingerj]

Hi Josh,
as has been posted, a front wire wheel from an XS650 will plug right in. Three different styles of them.
The back wheel is the problem, you'll win a $100 million lottery before you find that super-rare Japanese rear so it's DIY time.
You will need to have or have access to a lathe, a TIG welding set and the necessary operating skills.
Cut the hub from a cast wheel, turn two registers on it to accept two spoke rings, align the spoke holes and weld them on.
Lace the hub into the rim of your choice.
Note that the fattest tire that will clear the swingarm is a 140 and only some of those.
The only way to change the rake is to cut'n'weld the frame. You sure you wanna do that?
When I was younger and had more ambition I swapped my XS650's cast wheels for wire wheels and yes! The bike looked great.
My son whined the wheels off me for his XS650 and now his bike looks great.
But we both agree, wire wheels are a right swine to keep clean, he still thinks it's worth the effort.
He's even willing to switch back to tubed tires to run those wire wheels.

Well the way you worded it makes it seem a lot less difficult than I had previously thought, any ideas what it would cost to do this? My dad has a lathe, and a TIG welder and keeping the new wheels clean would be worth it to me too. Where would I find the other parts I need to complete this (i.e. spoke rings, rim, and anything else you think I might need.)?

Thanks again for your help!

[crazy steve]

It's still not quite as easy as Fred makes it sound....

Finding a rim is no problem, as that's a common replacement item (about $60-100 for 40-spoke rim). Spokes will probably have to be custom-made or put together out of a couple of sets (figure $120+ at least). The 'spoke rings' will have to be made or cut off another hub.

Here's a bit more detail on what's involved.... http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread...eel#post339921

You'll need more than just a lathe...

[fredintoon]

It's still not quite as easy as Fred makes it sound.... You'll need more than just a lathe...

Hi Steve,
I never said easy. And Josh has a dad with a lathe and a TIG welder so he's a great deal forward already.
Besides, IMHO everready went overcomplicated in turning the donor hub into a cylinder to shrink & key a flanged spool over it.
As I see it, chop the hub out with a Sawzall and lathe the spoke stubs off so it looks nice.
Now turn a spigot on each side as big a diameter as you can get and still have the spigot 3/16" deep to fit the spoke rings.
The spoke rings can be rough cut from 3/16" aluminum plate with a sabersaw then turned on the lathe.
Absent a vertical mill with an indexing head the spoke holes can be made on a drill press or even drilled by hand.
The hard part is aligning the two spoke rings so that the spoke holes and countersinks are all in the right place before they are TIG welded into place.
And any fool can lace up a wheel. I know because I are one. First time takes a while, is all.

[crazy steve]

I think you'd need a dished ring on the drive side (which is how Yamaha did the one they built) to get the right spoke 'angle' for strength. I've thought about this a few times (I've got a lathe and mill, but I'm not that good a machinist), but looks like an awful lot of work....

If you didn't have your heart set on a spoked wheel, I think a custom cast wheel could be done much easier. Harley uses a cast 'disc' wheel on several models (Fatboy, several 'custom' models, V-Rods, etc) that can be gotten for a reasonable price used (I see these on eBay for $100 or less, even different styles) and it looks like you could machine the hub out of these and install a suitably machined XS hub in their place. Some additional research would need to be done, and you'd need a lathe with a big swing (18-20") to do this, but I see the degree of difficulty being much lower....

[XJOK2PLAY]

May I ask a few silly questions?

Why would you want to? A wider tire?
Looks like any handling improvement you might gain with a 140 would be erased by the sloppiness wire wheels would provide?
Really would give up tubeless tires to go back to tube-types?

Wasn't the driveshaft / torque issues of the 11 a main reason for why Yamaha went with cast wheels? For strength?

Or do ya just hate the swirly wheel look?

Just wondering...

[fredintoon]

May I ask a few silly questions? Why would you want to? A wider tire? - -

Hi XJ,
the only reason I can see for wire wheels and a fatter rear tire is that whoever is doing it prefers the look.
FWIW, I swapped my XS650 Heritage Special's cast wheels for wire wheels because I wanted the look.
I swapped back to the cast wheels after the wire wheel's rear tire balded out because I was sick of cleaning the wire wheels, I'd gotten a bargain on a 16" rear tire and preferred the added safety of going back to tubeless tires.
Switching to the rear wire wheel's 110/90-18 tire from the cast wheel's 130/90-16 tire made the bike quicker in the corners but less stable in a straight line. As Saskatchewan has very few twisty roads and lots of straight ones, that worked out OK too.

[Eveready1100]

I'm innocent! It wasn't me that made up the hybrid cast / spoke wheel. It was Jonesey, one of the members on the AU site, as I quoted in the post.

That mystery bike you're all talking about was a GX750, not an 850, but yes, there was only about 100 made for the local market.

If you were to go to the trouble of getting a rear wheel laced up from scratch, You could probably safely aim at getting a 150 tyre on there at least, maybe a 160 even, by getting the rim offset more to the other side away from the shaft tube, and adjusting the swingarm bearings over as far left as possible to compensate. Remember, it's the tube that is the limiting factor here. There's plenty of space on the other side, but no-one looks over there.

[crazy steve]

...If you were to go to the trouble of getting a rear wheel laced up from scratch, You could probably safely aim at getting a 150 tyre on there at least, maybe a 160 even, by getting the rim offset more to the other side away from the shaft tube, and adjusting the swingarm bearings over as far left as possible to compensate. Remember, it's the tube that is the limiting factor here. There's plenty of space on the other side, but no-one looks over there.

Actually, you still can't get a bigger tire in there; there isn't enough room between the drive tube and the caliper anchor pin. Same goes for the FD; there isn't enough room between it and the other side to get a bigger tire in.

I know this because I have fitted a bigger tire; a 160/80-16. But this required serious swingarm mods (deeper 'relief' at the driveshaft and a removable anchor pin), and requires removing the FD to get the tire/wheel assembly in. If you do all this, it fits.... but just barely...