Battery Poll 2011

[Larrym]

If you are looking for a battery for your XS/XJ 1100 then this thread may be of help to you.

There... that first line was for the benefit of those individuals who chose to use the "search" function in their efforts to find a replacement battery.

"Why a battery Poll?"
1. One member recently made use of the site here in an effort to find a replacement battery.
2. The member pointed out that the search function provided pages upon pages of material which could take hours to read.
3. The member posted a question/request for information about what "good" batteries other members were using.

My insight/opinion:
The member was absolutely correct when he said that the search function can provide an overload of results to sort through. There have been a lot of informative discussions about batteries on the site here. If your goal is to find out "everything you needed to know about motorcycle batteries but were afraid to ask" then by all means take the time necessary to read all the "threads".

While the responses to the member's request for information were intended to be "helpful" and included information about the makes/models of the batteries along with the owners "opinion", the data to do an actual comparison between the available batteries was conspicuously absent. As one responder pointed out, there was no "definitive"answer nor the means to get that "definitive" answer with the information provided in the responses.

"The Purpose of this Poll."
1. To provide a "snapshot" of what batteries are in use by members at this time.
2. To provide the reader with the information needed to acquire those batteries.
3. To provide the reader with the information needed to compare those batteries.

How it's supposed to work: What YOU do.
1. The participants in this poll provide the information about the battery they have installed. (Right now I'm focusing on only the batteries that are installed in the OEM battery box. If you have something else installed please do not participate in this poll.)
2. Once I have that information I will update the poll with that particular battery as one of the available choices.
3. After the poll shows "your" installed battery you may vote for it.

How it's supposed to work: What I do.
1. Read your individual posts and collect the data.
2. Organize that data and when there's enough (IMO...) I will post the "charts and graphs" which provide the reader with the information needed to do a "comparison" of the batteries.


"Disclaimer/Weasel Clause"
As I am volunteering my services for this poll I will do my part as I get around to it and when I get around to it. The proposed "graphs" include: purchase price comparison, lifespan comparison, operation cost comparison, and manufacturers defect rate comparison. All of these comparisons will be based only on the data that is provided by the participants in this poll.

The poll itself has some limitations as far as the number of choices available and how long the poll can be held open. That's why I'm titling this poll "battery poll 2011". What I can do here depends on what data I get and when I get it.

This poll is not intended to be a "discussion" where personal observations, opinions, or other "subjective" material is welcomed. The one exception I can see at this moment is if someone installs a battery that has a manufacturers defect and leaks acid all over or explodes/catches fire. If that is the case then by all means use this poll as a means to warn the other members. Then please start a new thread the discuss the details.

[Larrym]

Battery Data

Battery Manufacturer: EverStart Powersport
Battery Model/PN: ES50N18LA3 Car Battery
Purchased From: Walmart
Purchase Price: $51.00
Date of Purchase: 6/2011
Date of Failure: Blank
Battery Tender: No
Sealed: No

(Please copy/paste this into your own posting and edit to include your data.)

[motoman]

Battery Manufacturer: Interstate
Battery Model/PN: original size/81XS1100
Purchased From: InterstateBatteries factory supplier
Purchase Price: $89
Date of Purchase: 9/05
Date of Failure: still in serveice
Battery Tender: No
Sealed: No

[MrOzz]

Battery Manufacturer: YUSA
Battery Model/PN: YTX24HL-BS
Purchased From: On Bike When I Bought It.
Purchase Price: Unknown
Date of Purchase: 05/2008 (What The PO Told Me)
Date of Failure: Still in Service
Battery Tender: No
Sealed: Yes

[bikerphil]

Battery Manufacturer: NeverStart Powersport
Battery Model/PN: ES50N18LA3
Purchased From: Walmart
Purchase Price: about $50.00
Date of Purchase: 9/2010
Date of Failure: awaiting failure
Battery Tender: No
Sealed: No

[Larrym]

2 Week Notice...

Hello and thanks to all those who have added their batteries/info to the database.

Wait a minute..That sounds like there's a huge crowd out there who've done this. That simply isn't the case so allow me to thank you Individually:

motoman, great to have your Interstate battery in the "horse race."
MrOzz, thanks for your Yuasa contribution.
bikerphil, Nice to see another Everstart in the running.

Now, take a look here at the "rough" data so far:



In the rough graph of price comparison the blue is the cost of the Everstarts and the Orange/Yellow are the Yuasa/Interstate.

(Note: As MrOzz didn't include the price of his battery, I went online and used the price I found:$89. Also as motoman didn't include the part number for his battery I went online and used the part number I found:I50-N18L-A. If this info is incorrect please let me know. Just trying for now to show AMAP in a way that makes sense...)

Bigger and better?



I haven't finalized anything yet so it's all in the rough stage. Frankly, I expected (and still am...) more of a turnout showing the different batteries installed in our XS/XJ stable. But even if there aren't any more contributions we DO have something to work with. The additional graphs and details are "pending" additional input at the moment.

As far as "updating" the poll to include the batteries so far? I'm going to wait another 2 weeks in the hopes that more batteries will be added. I mean that I'm going to prevail upon the moderators of the forum here to "permit" me to edit/change the poll to include the new info. I'm going to ask them to do that ONCE and ONLY once. I dunno if it's possible or if they (the moderators) would find this poll worthy of their attention/actions. We'll have to wait 2 weeks in order to find out.

So....In the hopes that any future "discussions" about batteries will include what the batteries themselves have to say:
(I cost this much. I was installed on this date. I lasted this long. I am a better battery because...etc.)

Battery Manufacturer: EverStart Powersport
Battery Model/PN: ES50N18LA3 Car Battery
Purchased From: Walmart
Purchase Price: $51.00
Date of Purchase: 6/2011
Date of Failure: Blank
Battery Tender: No
Sealed: No

(Please copy/paste this into your own posting and edit to include your data.)

[motoman]

Also as motoman didn't include the part number for his battery I went online and used the part number I found:I50-N18L-A. //////Sorry bout that T.C. Just was lazy and didn't feel like pulling it out to get the model#. That IS correct though.

[3Phase]

Larry, the battery didn't wear out fast enough for the first round polling but here's a battery three-fer!

The first battery was a cheap one from Wally World so I could ride the bike home when I first bought my '80G:

Battery Manufacturer: EverStart Powersport
Battery Model/PN: ES50N18LA3 Car Battery
Purchased From: Walmart
Purchase Price: $45.00
Date of Purchase: 5/2008
Date of Failure: 7/2008
Battery Tender: No
Sealed: No

That battery worked just fine but it only lasted a little more than a month.

The voltage regulator failed and stuck 'high' and boiled the battery dry, killing the battery deader than a proverbial doornail. Even though the vent hose was connected, battery acid was spread all over everything on the bike from the vent hose itself or by splatter and slingback from the rear wheel. The entire bike had to be cleaned and neutralized along with the back of my helmet and riding gear. Fortunately, my pants, jacket and boots -- by intent from a lesson learned at the cellular level from a failed motorcycle battery thirty years ago! were leather and not fabric so I didn't get any burns and the riding gear didn't have to be replaced.

It was not the battery's fault but now that battery technology has advanced beyond the same basic design used in ancient Babylon I'll never use another one in a motorcycle again if I can avoid it.


The second battery:

Battery Manufacturer: Sears Diehard Gold Powersport
Battery Model/PN: 18L-BS (Sears stock# 44006)
Purchased From: Sears
Purchase Price: $95.00
Date of Purchase: 7/2008
Date of Failure: 8/2011
Battery Tender: No
Sealed: Yes

The Diehard lasted about three years and 50,000 miles. Yes, I really have put 50,000 miles on my '80G since I bought it back in May, 2008. The battery was run completely flat more than once while I worked the bugs out of the electrical system but it always charged right back up and never failed to start the engine at any time in any temperature until the day it died -- hard!

I was able to use the kicker to start the engine but the battery started to smell like rotten eggs while I was riding and putting it on a slow charge at home that night only slightly reduced the production of toxic gas. It was a very good battery and never leaked any acid anywhere at all ever even when it failed thank-you-very-much-Sears-Roebuck.

The Diehard has been replaced this afternoon with the third battery. It's the latest and greatest from Yuasa:

Battery Manufacturer: Yuasa
Battery Model/PN: GYZ20HL
Purchased From: Friendly neighborhood Yamaha dealership
Purchase Price: $130.00
Date of Purchase: 8/2011
Date of Failure:
Battery Tender: No
Sealed: Yes


So far so good!

[TopCatGr58]

The POLL is OPEN for VOTING NOW!!!

Battery Manufacturer: NeverStart Powersport
Battery Model/PN: ES50N18LA3
Purchased From: Walmart
Purchase Price: about $50.00
Date of Purchase: 4/2011
Date of Failure: awaiting failure
Battery Tender: No
Sealed: No

I had the same battery in it from just a year ago that was only 1 year old, but had not monitored it like I should have, had very DRY winter air in the non-climate controlled garage the bike was in, and let the battery DRY out too much...exposed the cells for who knows how long..weeks/months?

So...I filled that old one back up, charged, it just didn't have the charge depth to provide the 10.5 volts for the TCI while cranking, so bought a NEW one for reliability on my XS East trip to western Virginia....riding the bike there instead of trailering it. It's still working fine, and I'll be checking it more frequently this coming winter...probably even take it out of the frame and put it IN the house(climate control) for storage and monthly charging. I do have a tender, but not sure if it will help keep it stronger and prevent sulphating better than monthly strong charging??? COMMENTS by Electrical GURUS on this regarding Lead Acid batteries!?

I had the same battery 4 years ago, and it lasted for the expected 3 years/seasons as well!

The Poll has been editted, and votes cleared, so please RE-Vote if you actually did vote earlier when folks had been asked not to!

T.C.

[Elevener]

This was a great idea Larry, but this is like tires or oil. No real reasoning is involved. People believe what they want to. I havent had an acid battery in any vehicle in years but others will say they only last a year or two. Whatever.

And the poll still needs fixed, unless you only want these batterys in it?

[3Phase]

T.C., Were all the cells low on electrolyte or just one? Unless you took the vent caps off of the battery and left a fan blowing across it all winter then cold dry air wouldn't evaporate the water out of the electrolyte all by itself.

The XS11's alternator isn't all that strong but it will boil the electrolyte out of a battery pretty quickly if the battery starts to fail and maxes out the charging system just to stay alive. Once the electrolyte drops enough to uncover the plates in one cell the battery will get hotter and hotter and take more and more current until something burns or melts.

[KA1J]

Deka EXT18L AGM

I'm done with conventional lead acid. I don't know which batteries are the most powerful or last the longest but I know I'm tired of acid overflowing & corroding my frames. When I got the XJ650 I needed a new battery so I went on a fact finding mission & found AGM batteries have no leakage. Next was to find the max CCA I could get that would fit. For the XJ650 Maxim it was the DEKA EXT15 with 210 CCA. A really awesome battery that never seems to run out of power. I had to loosen the airbox to get it to fit but it fits fine.

When I got the XJ11 I looked for what I could find from DEKA being made in PA I went to their website http://www.dekacatalog.com/ under power sport motorcycle yamaha & XJ1100 & it says
weight - 18
height - 6/375
length - 8.125
width - 3.5625
volts - 12
CCA at 0 degrees F - 325
10 amp hour rate - 20

325 at 0 F is pretty sweet, it spins the starter beautifully in realistic weather.
The same part # corresponds with the XS11 as well.

I'm trying to remember where I bought it from, having a brain freeze... got it for a better price (like $85 shipped) on the internet than at the local carquest (who were as I remember overly indifferent to my asking what they had to fit my bike).

[Larrym]

DING!!!! Time's up.

Well, it's been a month already and that's all the time I've allowed for this poll to acquire a “snapshot” of the Batteries in use on the XS/XJ stable. Thanks to all who offered their “info”. 8-)

Here's what we got:



It's just a graph showing ALL the batteries(7?) in the poll all side-by-side in a purchase price comparison. (If there were more participants in the poll it would've looked a lot more impressive:Imagine 25-50 entries...). What you see are the actual prices paid for each battery wherever they were acquired. The “order” of the batteries is only that order in which the owners responded to the battery poll. Sorta just the starting point for the Data: collecting it first without making any attempt to organize it yet. Technically, this is just a “Simple Random Sample” which uses the info and ONLY the info provided here in this “Poll”. If your battery is not represented in the poll or on the graphs then it's because you didn't enter its info in this little “horse race.”

Here's something Useful:



It's a graph showing just the different types of batteries (as entered in the battery poll...) along with the AVERAGE purchase price. Again, imagine that there were 25-50 entries made by owners and I just refined the info down to the “essential/usable” stuff. For example, if someone were looking at buying one of these batteries and found that the “supplier” in their area wanted $30 more than than the average price shown in this poll for the same battery. (XX@!!!) Or someone who already bought one of the batteries could know if they should go back to the same battery vendor. (Or NOT!) Usable and useful stuff, right?


Well, sorta....(sigh.) These graphs along with the “Popularity Poll” at the top of this web page do provide some “usable” information. The individual posts made my responders tell where to GET the battery(s). Unfortunately, the data needed to actually compare the batteries between themselves just isn't present in this poll. I mean, what is the “average” price when there's only one battery/entry to do the averaging with? Which battery has a longer/shorter lifespan? (Measured in months...)What battery gives the best bang for our buck as in gives us the longest life for the dollars paid? (Purchase price divided by the time/months the battery lasted.) Is there a battery which clearly isn't worth the high price tag because it fails to give a better “value-over-time” than the less expensive ones???


Of course these are all rhetorical questions because the hard data to actually make additional charts/graphs and use them to qualify/quantify (what makes one battery better or worse than the next and by how much...) isn't in this poll for me to collect and organize into something meaningful.

Other Unanswerable Issues:

Battery Tenders lead to a longer lifespan or not?

Do XS/XJ owners who have installed “additional” lighting/electrical loads get the same lifespan out of the same battery or less than the average?

Sealed batteries definitely Do or Do Not justify the additional price by lasting longer and giving a better “value”?

Based on the date I or anyone bought their battery, should we or shouldn't we replace it before we take that “Iron-Butt” marathon trip to see friends and family? I mean I'm asking questions about a basic component (A Battery...) that we all need in order for our motorcycles to operate.

I can't answer any of those questions with something “definitive” and based upon objective data gathered/organized/interpreted in the real world or from the data provided in this forum. The point here is that these questions could be answered and the foundation for those answers verified IFF (a logical term meaning “If and ONLY If”...) the data had been presented.

Still, the Poll was a Success according to the objective I stated in my first post in this thread:

"The Purpose of this Poll."
1. To provide a "snapshot" of what batteries are in use by members at this time.
2. To provide the reader with the information needed to acquire those batteries.
3. To provide the reader with the information needed to compare those batteries.


So.... if you are looking to find something “beyond” price or popularity as factors in your search for a battery then may I recommend the Astrologist/Palm Reader who lives up the road. She has just as much of a chance as I do of guiding you to choosing a “good” battery that you'll be happy with.

Final words:

Acquiring a battery may be just one of the many tasks required to make your XS/XJ roadworthy. If that's the case then by all means get yourself a battery and move on to the next item in your “Plan-your-Work-Work-your-Plan”. Just don't forget WHY you're doing the things you are doing:


CLICK_THE_PIC.


Don't expect a "Battery Poll 2012". I mean, everybody knows that the world ends then according to the Mayan Calendar. Just try to have your XS/XJ running so you can take that final ride.

[Clyde K.]

Battery manufacturer: Everstart Lawn and Garden
Battery Model/PN: U1P-7, 350CA/275CCA
Purchased from: WalMart
Purchase price: $27.00
Date of purchase: 10/10
Date of failure: N/A
Battery tender: No
Sealed: No

[CaptonZap]

Battery Tenders have been used to maintain batteries over the non riding season, and have been known to "boil" the battery dry.
So here is what I suggest. Take a volt meter, check it with three or four others, to see if it is accurate, and check the voltage of the battery after the Battery Tender has been on a week or so. If the voltage is above 12.8, the Tender is charging to high.
A lead acid battery will last almost indefinitely if kept at 12.5 volts, or a little above, and is periodically discharged a little, no lower than 12 volts, then recharged back up to 12.5+.
If the voltage is allowed to drop, (when off the charger, or because of usage and not being recharged,) below 12 volts, bad things start happening to the plates. If allowed to drop to 10.5 or below, for any length of time, it is almost always ruined, due to sulfation.
When the riding season returns, charge it back up to 13 volts, and it will be good to go.
I use an old uninterruptible power supply, as used for computers, and hook the battery leads from it to the battery in the XS. Keeps it at 12.7 or 8, and does not boil the battery dry.
An accurate volt meter is your best friend when it comes to battery maintenance. CZ