Fiasco , suspension, help, LONG

[yamtom]

Hi Guys,

I sure wish I didnt have to present you all with this one to help with. It scares me just thinking about it.

My new 79 special was turning a little hard, the po had said that also, so I was trying to figure out how to loosen the steering up a bit.
I know frm bicycle days if the steering is too tight to relax the tension in the headset, the motorcycle equivelent I believe to be checking the tension that the bearings are under in the top of the triple tree.

So, I took the top nut off after releasing the lock bolt tension, I rode it around the parking lot at ten mph, thinking that might help, not really. I then loosened the top lock bolts for the fork legs on the triple tree, and tried to adjust the tension of the two locking rings, that sit atop the top bearing in the head tube. After trying to loosen those rings, and maybe they loosened just a bit, I again rode it around the parking lot at ten or so mph. The tension still felt quite heavy in steering. Not really notchy at all, but just very heavy. So I loosened the lower sets of bolts on the lower triple tree. All seemed to be ok in the creep around the parking lot but as I stopped, the suspension definitely shifted but since it was dark, I went back to the shop at five mph this time. I got to the door, and a lip in the concrete, was hit, the whole body of the bike, lowered down now, the pipes were only maybe eight inches off the floor, and the triple trees were spread about six inches too far.

I had the cell phone and got help down there to help although I need about six strong guys to lift the whole works up.

As of this moment, the whole bike is strapped to the workstand, we jacked it up and were able to put the frame and motor part on the centerstand , so it is stable at this point.

At this point, I am thinking, jack the frame unit up, wiggling the lower triple tree back onto its proper place on the forks and then tightening the works down. Ive sprayed the forks in the lower triple tree with PB blaster to hopefully loosen things as much as I can.

Have the wise men here any advice for me please???

This bike has a steel tube fork brace on it, unlike any Ive seen online here. It also has the full yammie fairing on it.

I am still not sure how to proceed with loosening that top bearing such that it loosens its grip a bit . I am assuming that the threads underneath those two locking nuts, just under the top triple tree, have a normal right hand thread. Please advise.

Have any of you found an xs 11 to have a too tight steering before, at this point I am wondering if this bike has been hit in the front in a way that I couldnt see , and maybe its steering is too tight from that, just thinking out loud here. HELP

[bikerphil]

The locknuts are normal right hand thread. If it was me, I'd inspect/grease or replace the TT bearings before trying to ride it anymore for sure. That was your original issue in the beginning, hard steering. I fixed another member's bike (temporarily) not to long ago with tight steering. I loosened those castle nuts up about 1/4 turn and it was much better. It is really worth the effort to do it right though. Silly thought, make sure you're front tire wasn't at 5 psi.

You can use a drift to tap the castle nut in the proper direction for removal/tightening.

[SFerinTEXAS]

Myself I would suggest it is time to inspect the steering bearings or is that not the issue with your question. I acquired an xj parts bike and when I took the triple tree out the bearings dropped out in pieces.

[Gyrogearloose]

I agree. You need to get the "tree" out of the neck so you can see and roll the bearings around. You might be surprised what can happen to grease after 30 yrs.! Oh, and you need a manual ( I have Clymers), invaluable. Wash the bearings, and dry, then spin them by hand to feel if they roll smoothly. If they do, it's probably just pack them with good ole' wheel bearing grease and reassemble...following instructions for adjusting.

[yamtom]

ok,, will do,,

This bike has only twenty thou on the clock and looks it, will sure get those bearing s out of there and inspect and repack if they are ok. I am assuming that these are loose balls, or are they tapered rollers. I do have the clymer manual, looks as if I better consult it.
Thanks for the help guys, channel 11 comes thru again.

[DGXSER]

Hey Tom,

Sounds like you got yourself a VERY loose front end now!! No worries though, trust me I did a similar thing once, loosened all the triple tree clamp bolts and the thing slid down the forks. Luckily it was already on the centerstand. So I just used my shoulder to lift the front end back up and tightend the bolts.

Anyway, at this point, if it were me, I'd look at those triple tree bearings. Of course you pretty much take the entire front end apart to do that. I put the bike on the centerstand and have a helper lean on the back of the bike to raise the front end up and then place a jackstand under the front frame rail

[bikerphil]

They are tapered bearings.

[SFerinTEXAS]

I cleaned and regreased those bearings without taking anything else loose except the top fork clamps and top triple tree center bolt and lock nuts.Of course the air splitter on the XJ not a factor on the XS. Use a floor jack on the front cross member and let the whole front end slide down a few inches. The top bearing cone will pull out and the bottom will drop with the lower shaft. If all looks good then clean with solvent,blow dry and thoroughly re grease. If the lower bearing is shot then a lot more work will be need to completely drop the shaft out to change it. That's a start.

[yamtom]

hahaha

Hi,
I guess the difference here is, my frame is too low now, the works is on an elevated workstand, its tied down and the tie downs are now so tight that I cant release them by hand at all.

The bike was put on the centerstand after this fiasco, by jacking it up enough AGAINST the straps, that the rear wheel ended up ten inches off the floor of the stand. That was done inappropriately at the very least but I thought that it would stabilize the works to have the centerstand down, instead, it ended up tightening those straps so hard I couldnt release them. One of the straps is actually damaged now, it was pulled so hard.

I will start by jacking it up at the rear, hopefully to take the tension off those front straps that they can be released gently, then move around to the front and raise it such that the rear wheel goes back to the floor of the stand. That should bring the works back into some semblence of its proper position, frame to forks, and then I hopefully can release those castellated lock nuts and check those bearings out and get them repacked. I am sure going to tighten those two sets of lockbolts at the lower triple tree to make sure nothing else moves inappropriately. Thanks guys, I am not going to work on it by myself, in fear that the whole works is going to end up toppling off the workstand if something else goes awry while I am trying to get it right. My buddy should be able to help, and has a very small floor jack that should be more appropriate for that workstand than that ninety pound wonder that I have been trying to use.

[Crusty Snippets]

Steering head

You may have undone a few too many bolts.
What I did.
I loosened the top fork clamps and the big nut in the middle. That allows the top part of the steering head to be eased.
It also allows the bottom part to move down with the forks but they are only moving minute amounts. We are easing not dropping.
I then sat on the back of the seat so the front wheel was off the ground.
The mechanic guy that knows more about these bikes in this area than anyone else loosened the top ( locking ring ) with a hammer and drift, then the bottom one which frees up the steering head. With each loosening the forks were turned from side to side to check for free play and then checked for any other movement.
When adjusted correctly the lock ring was tightened. I then checked the forks for alignment and tighted the rest of the bolts.


Crusty

[crazy steve]

I'm with Phil; you need to at least check and repack those neck bearings. And after having the forks move around in the trees like that, I'd strongly suggest doing a full-blown fork alignment. You can find that here: http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread...fork+alignment.

If you have a fairing, it would probably pay to take it off while you do this.

[yamtom]

back in shape

Hi All,
Thanks for the suggestions, we put the bike back on its legs last night. I just jacked the engine/frame up, and the forks gradually went back into position. Ive got the center bolt back in holding things together until I can figure out the fork alignment thing and get everything back together. I still have to use the locking ring nuts to free up the bearings themselves. Thanks crusty for elucidating with the word picture just how to do that.

Ive got lots of work to get done, thanks guys.