High end clutch slip.....

[TomRodgers]

Sunshine has developed this issue.....or i just dont have the clutch adjusted correctly...

For starters....

When i finally dialed the engine in with carb problems (thanks everyone for helping out on that deal!!!) i had Sunshine pointed OUT of the garage, started her up and let her warm up... pulled the clutch lever.....slapped it into 1st and HOLY $hit... launched out of the garage....hit the kill switch and backed her back into the garage... Popped the cover, loosened the nut, screw, and adjusted alll the way out....then back in until i 'thought' i felt it hit the pressure plate...then backed it out 1/4 turn like the manual says...

Tried it again....this time she wouldnt move. re adjust several times, and bike rolls on. on normal acceleration, no issue. today on way to work, i was doing about 70 mph @ 5000 rpms and goosed it....i could DEFINATELY tell i had some slippage issue.....rpm's went up to almost 9 grand but no go faster.....i eased into it and accelerated fine.

Do i need to do more adjustment or is there something else at play here????

[Incubus]

You have a couple of potential issues here, Tom. First off, I would try adjusting the clutch again. If you have the set screw too tight then the clutch will not completely disengage when you release the lever. Pressure will remain on the pressure plate and the disks will slip. If that doesn't work, what kind of oil are you using? Modern oils with additives that reduce friction also reduce clutch grip on antique wet clutches. Third, assuming proper adjustment and proper oil, if you are running the original clutch springs they might be old and tired. If your clutch springs have gone soft the bike will spin the higher rpms. How does the bike respond off the line? Any issues if you pop the clutch and wind it out from the line?

FWIW, I don't think it is your clutch friction disks. I actually have never run into a friction disk on an old bike that was out of spec. Worst I've seen is old dried out disks that disintegrated when I oput them back into service. That, however, is a whole different set of symptoms.

Patrick

[TomRodgers]

Just regular old valvoline oil. 20/50. at idle i can dump the clutch with no throttle and she lurches forward....

havent really done any hole shots with her due to being the only horse in the barn working.....dont wanna fubar something else...

i guess i will adjust some more and see what happens....

Cant really tell how many miles are on it.... the odom says 28,000....but its not the stock motor.....its a replacement....but the number are of the same model....im not even sure if the guages are the original......Sunshine was a barn find up near Detroit....

[WMarshy]

Tom,

Have you ever replaced anything in the clutch, how many miles are on it, is it stock? If your clutch is indeed adjusted properly then I think you are in need of new clutch springs at a min. Friction plates are cheap (PNM.com) but HD springs are even cheaper (like $15 shipped). Personally, if I were going in to change the springs I would change the friction plates as well, and sand the steels with some 200 grit paper to rough them up a lil. That would solve your problems, assuming your using the correct oil.

I replaced my frictions with PNM but they sent me the wrong springs. Do yourself a favor and buy the springs from Barnett or another name brand source. Just the frictions solved my slippage for a while but its starting to come back after a year, if I really wack the throttle. This winter Im going to put in HD springs. If money is no object for you and you want a bullet proof clutch I suggest you reasearch about the ALTO mod. It allows you to run an extra friction and steel while keeping the stack height the same as stock. Basically you are increacing your friction area and will have more surface to transfer power. No more worries about slip again!

[XS1100_OEM4ME]

Car or motorcycle oil?

Just regular old valvoline oil. 20/50. at idle i can dump the clutch with no throttle and she lurches forward....

havent really done any hole shots with her due to being the only horse in the barn working.....dont wanna fubar something else...

i guess i will adjust some more and see what happens....

Cant really tell how many miles are on it.... the odom says 28,000....but its not the stock motor.....its a replacement....but the number are of the same model....im not even sure if the guages are the original......Sunshine was a barn find up near Detroit....

You said 40 w 50, is that car or motorcycle oil, there is a diff. and the car oil can cause the clutch to slip

[TomRodgers]

hahaha.....money is ALWAYS an issue!! SWMBO, 4 kids rangine from 6 to 13 years old....

To be honest with you, i have NEVER touched a motorcycle clutch before. Only in my 86 GMC 3500. 4 clutch plates and one pressure plate in 487,000 miles.

Like i said, Sunshine was a barn find...after changing the fluids, doing the brakes and carbs, she runs pretty good....will check on way home or at lunch about the idle to high end roll out and see if it slips...

The oil i use is 20 w 50 motorcycle oil....

[WMarshy]

hahaha.....money is ALWAYS an issue!! SWMBO, 4 kids rangine from 6 to 13 years old....

To be honest with you, i have NEVER touched a motorcycle clutch before. Only in my 86 GMC 3500. 4 clutch plates and one pressure plate in 487,000 miles.

Like i said, Sunshine was a barn find...after changing the fluids, doing the brakes and carbs, she runs pretty good....will check on way home or at lunch about the idle to high end roll out and see if it slips...

The oil i use is 20 w 50 motorcycle oil....

Tom, I figured money was an issue, I dont know anyone who doesnt think so. I dont know the actual cost of the ALTO mod but it not the cheapest way to solve your slip problem.

TopCat made a nice tuitorial that is a step by step process on how to disassemble and re-assemble the clutch. I had absolutely no experience with working on clutches and I was able to work through it no problem. I doubt you would have any problem working on it, it wouldnt take but a few hours of work.

[DiverRay]

Just putting in a set of NEW clutch springs will take care of the slip 95% of the time. You can put the bike on the side stand, remove the bolt holding the drivers foot pegs, and remove the clutch cover WITHOUT draining the oil. should only take about 20 minutes to R&R the springs, and your back on the road.
I needed to do that with the MNS, as the springs were 30 years old and soft. It slipped a LOT in high gear, and is good now.

[Incubus]

I think rebuilding a clutch is one of the easier jobs on old motorcycles. Since money is a concern, if adjustment doesn't work, buy new heavy duty clutch springs (they will give your left hand a workout. I have them on one of my XSes) and scuff up the steel plates. Like I said, I would not bother changing out the friction disks unless I took the clutch apart and found them out of spec, which I consider unlikely. The springs alone would probably fix it, but deglazing the steels certainly won;t hurt and won't cost anything more.

Frictions will set you back at least $40 for the cheapest ones on PNM. Good ones are more.

Play with the adjuster for a while until you get a feel for it. If you don't figure out how to adjust it properly then buying all new parts will not fix the problem.

Patrick

[cywelchjr]

Just putting in a set of NEW clutch springs will take care of the slip 95% of the time. You can put the bike on the side stand, remove the bolt holding the drivers foot pegs, and remove the clutch cover WITHOUT draining the oil. should only take about 20 minutes to R&R the springs, and your back on the road.
I needed to do that with the MNS, as the springs were 30 years old and soft. It slipped a LOT in high gear, and is good now.

You don't even have to remove the bolt there, just loosen it enough that you can rotate the right side peg back out of the way and your good. I figured that out having to go into mine after the engine change about 5 times before the idiot working on it got it right. Rotating the peg towards the back with the bolt loosened a bit worked just as well as removing it, and you didn't have to fight to get the stupid thing back in afterwards, just tighten it back up (after rotating the peg back into position.

[natemoen]

before the idiot working on it got it right.

Are you calling yourself an idiot

[cywelchjr]

Are you calling yourself an idiot

I am indeed, at least in that instance. But then, if I can't take a joke I shouldn't gotten this thing.

[TomRodgers]

On T.C.'s post on adding steels...am i correct in saying that i can skip the part about backing the screw out enuf to accomodate the extra steels???

[cywelchjr]

On T.C.'s post on adding steels...am i correct in saying that i can skip the part about backing the screw out enuf to accomodate the extra steels???

If your actually adding the extra steel, then you need to do that, if not then no. If your doing the mod with the aftermarket set that gives you the extra without extra thickness, as I understand it then no. However, whatever you do, just do the clutch adjustment and your good. If the pack is thicker, it will be out more, if not it won't. I believe the point in his post, was that after adding the extra steel, the pack will be thicker and because of that the screw will be out further after a proper clutch adjustment.

And it's still distracting as heck to read your posts. I have a hard time keeping my eyes on the post instead of your avatar (at least while replying the avatar's not there.)

[TomRodgers]

I will try to adjust more this evening or this weekend... The clutch lever is rather stiff...but i guess it wont hurt to replace springs and scuff up the steels....