Starter switch issue

[Crazcnuk]

I am inthe process of moving all my upgrades from JD to the 78E.

In the process, I inadvertently beant a bracket into the + side of one of my coils, which caused fuse blowing, etc.

Once I figured that out and fixed it, the start switch stopped working.

I can start the bike crossing the solonoid, but not with the switch. I treid the switch off of the 80G as well, but nothing.

In looking at the switch, i don't see how it works, exactly. There is no power to the Blue/white wire, from the switch, and the 2 red/whites that go to the kill switch (one is 12v one is not, until the switch is closed) are not hooked, in any way to the blue/white?

Does the switch just ground through the handlebars? If so, wouldn't the blue/white need to have power to it?

[DGXSER]

Looking at the wiring diagram in my Clymers I am a bit stumped really. Looks like what they label as the start button gets power straight form the battery which also feeds the main fuse. From the main fuse it goes to the key switch, then to the fuse box. The ign fuse there feeds the kill switch which then feeds the other side of the starter button which also has a blue white wire to it, so it would be fed form the r/w? I do not see any grounding circuit for the starter solenoid.

Like i said, confusing as all get out!

[Incubus]

I just tackled this issue with my '79F last week. I will tell you right now - it is probably the kill switch.

I assume you already polished the tip of the starter button and the contact plate. The starter button works by completing the circuit from the solenoid to ground. You should have juice to both R/W wires. If you have it on only one, then your kill switch needs cleaning. With a test light you should see juice on the L/W wire when you connect a test light to the wire and to a ground. If there is no juice on the L/W wire then the circuit cannot be completed. If you don't have juice, then either you melted a wire (probably L/W, but possibly either of the two R/W wires) when you shorted the coil or your kill switch needs cleaning.

I went to the point of running a parallel wire from the solenoid to the starter button to eliminate the L/.W wire as the issue. But the starter button only started to work consistently when I disassembled the kill switch and cleaned the little copper plate inside of it and cleaned the two contacts.

It comes apart by taking off the little c-clip on the kill switch pole. Be careful separating the halves of the kill switch, though. There is a ball bearing, some springs and the copper plate that will spring free never to be seen again if you are not careful.

Patrick

[Incubus]

BTW, if you trace the R/W wires you will find that one goes to the fuse box and the other goes to the solenoid. That is where the R/W wires and the L/W wire connect.

[Crazcnuk]

The kill switches, from both bikes, worked fine until yesterday.

Only 1 r/w has power, until you close the switch, which closes the circuit and now both sides have power.

The b/w doesn't have any power? I could see closing the circuit to ground, if it did.

The PO added a black wire to the starter switch, hooked to the little screw that holds the button in the housing. He then hooked it to the Blue/black wire that used to feed the headlight switch. This melted, along with the red/wh and blue wires that go to the headlight relay.

I had it all working, then the coil feed shorted, and now the start button doesn't work on either switch.

I think it fried the TCI, too, so I changed it.

Normally, if you cross the live red/wh and the bl/wh where the handlebar switch plugs into the harness, should it crank the engine?

Also, on these, the engine should still kick over with the kill switch off, it just won't start?

[Incubus]

One of the R/W wires carries the juice to the solenoid that the solenoid uses to activate the starter. The B/W wire comes off the other side of the solenoid wire runs to the starter button. When you press the starter button it grounds to the handlebar completing the circuit. That black wire running from the starter button screw is an additional ground that works with the handlebar ground. Mine has it, but the starter button also works without it attached.

When my starter button was bad I had no juice through the L/W wire. After I cleaned the kill switch I had juice on all three wires. Test the L/W wire at one of the wire connections with the handlebar switch installed.

[Crazcnuk]

Which is l/w? I have 2 r/w and one b/w.

"When you press the starter button it grounds to the handlebar completing the circuit"

This doesn't seem to make sense. In order to get power from the r/w to the button the entire housing would have to be live?

To me, the solonoid would have to be live, and grounding the button would complete the circuit?

[Incubus]

L/W = blue/white, which is the wire to the starter button.

[Crazcnuk]

So that wire should have 12volts when the key is on? Right now, it doesn't.

If I put power to it the solonoid clicks, but doesn't engage the starter.

[Incubus]

If you jump a wire from the point on the solenoid where the blue/white wire is soldered on and ground it to the frame the starter should turn. That performs the same function that the starter button perfroms but takes the blue/white wire and starter button out of the equation. If it does not turn the starter you might have an issue with the solenoid. If you jump that point to the frame and the starter turns, then it is either your starter button, your kill switch or a failed (melted) wire between the solenoid and the right ride controller.

When my kill switch went I had power on both R/W wires, but the contact points were so corroded the R/W wire apparently wasn't carrying enough voltage to turn make the solenoid work.

You did check the fuse, right?

Patrick

[Crazcnuk]

I will try that.

The red/white wires have nothing to do with the solonoid, or turning the engine over. The kill switch cuts power to the coils.

The engine should turn over even with the kill switch off.

[Incubus]

The engine will not turn over with the starter button if the kill switch is bad. My kill switch was bad, the motor would not turn over. I fixed the kill switch, the engine turns over. Trace the wires.

[Cobia]

Hey Cnuck,
I had a similar experience with the starter switch when I installed black painted handlebars. The starter button couldn't complete the ground circuit. All was solved when I ran an extra wire from the ground side of the switch to the frame.
As to what additional deleterious effect the shorting of the coils may have had?? I dunno!!!! Sorry.

[Crazcnuk]

Prize goes to Incubus.

Cleaned the kill switch and voila!

I find it amazing that you can take a fully functioning switch off one bike and it won't work on the other, but hey, what do I know.

[DGXSER]

You awoke the gremlin when you moved him. Had to go in and evict him!!