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**Ivan** · 06-09-2010, 06:44 PM

Chances are the rings had some coke (carbon buildup) behind them and were causing them to seal, and the sea foam removed the coke and caused slack in the oil rings and is causing your smoking.

If it really bugs you, synthetic oil doesn't smoke as badly as regular oil, only problem is that most of the so called synthetics any more are just regular oil that performs like a synthetic. I think Amsoil is one that truly is synthetic, there are a couple others. Pretty expensive stuff to blow out the pipe though.

**jmnjrpa** · 06-09-2010, 07:07 PM

May be your valve guides. Usually when they are bad it smokes all the time and especially on startup. I go with Ivan on the rings. Whats your compression?

**TopCatGr58** · 06-09-2010, 08:38 PM

Well,

I have to respectfully disagree. My rationale: He never got the oil filter cup off. There is about a 1/2 quart of oil in there along with the filter, and so it's oil that was still "contaminated" with seafoam. It thins the oil a fair amount. Even a few ounces of gasoline can thin the oil considerably...from what I've read and heard on here from other's posts, as well as those of great mechanical knowledge. So...I'm suspecting that it's the residual seafoam and thinner oil that even though mixed with the new oil, is still thinner and more easily leaks past the oil rings, as well as it thinning the new oil as well!?

I'm not saying that the other possible explanations are not real or true, but until he's able to truly get the OLD seafoam oil out and all fresh new thicker oil, then he really can't say what's causing the smoking, or even if the smoking will continue with the totally new oil!

I would not have recommended him continue to ride it until he were able to get the oil filter cup off and the rest of the seafoam/oil out. The thinner oil could lead to bearing damage...especially under considerable loads...ie. full throttle bursts, etc.!!!

If this were his only means of transpo, then I would have suggested that he either get some more...3 quarts of cheap oil to put in, run at idle to help pull/mix with the seafoam to then drain out again before putting even more fresh oil....to further reduce the seafoam to oil ratio!

T.C.

**cowboybob998** · 06-09-2010, 10:01 PM

Does the oil drain into the sump and then into the filter and then into the motor, if so I would say it is the sea foam that was in the filter that is warshing down the cylinders and causeing the smoke, I agree with topcat, get the seafoam out of the motor before you ride it any more, just my two cents worth

**DGXSER** · 06-10-2010, 05:05 AM

Cowboy, not sure if that was a question or not, but to clarify it just a little...The oil form the engine and tranny drain into the drain pan, there it is picked up by the oil pump and pumped into the oil filter and its cup, through the oil filter and into the engine and tranny.

Leading to the situation TC described. I had that same thought, just did not think that bit of oill with its amount of seafoam then diluted into the new oil would be as harmful as it seems it could be.

**Guy_b_g** · 06-10-2010, 05:35 AM

If it is the seafoam causing the smoking from dilution of the oil then he shouldn't be riding it.

If it's not then no harm/no foul...but there is really only one way to find out...he should get the seafoam out of there.

I'd go with a cautious approach here.

**jmnjrpa** · 06-10-2010, 06:38 AM

Hmmmm, I'm not a "GURU"

I see where ya'll are coming from. I agree that he needs to get the filter changed ASAP without a doubt. I still have to stand by my previous convictions because

This year I decide to put a small quantity of Seafoam in the crank case let it run and change my oil. So I do let it run for 10 minutes and start to drain the oil

Assuming the small quantity was within the range to not overfill the oil then it was less than a cup. After changing the oil it would have been reduced to 12 percent if a half quart of oil remained in the engine. That would most likely leave a teaspoon of seafoam. Don't think that would do it---- but then again, as Ivan would say "there you go getting all realistic on us".

JAT

**Ivan** · 06-10-2010, 07:19 AM

While I am not trying to step on any toes here, I don't think seafoam in the oil would cause the smoke.

My reasoning:

First, seafoam is highly volitile. It won't hang around for very long. If the engine were run with a few ounces of seafoam to operating temp, chances are it would all evaporate. Engine damage from dilute oil nearly always comes from either flooding the engine's crank case with thinning agents or from a constant source that trickles into the oil.

Second, the smoke comes from ash. Seafoam burning won't cause ash. Thinned oil won't get passed GOOD rings much faster than straight oil. Undoubtedly, the rings won't last long if subject to thinned oil, but if they are good, they should seal against pretty much any fluid. If they are weak, then thinner oil will get through faster, but the root cause would be the rings, not the oil.

Last, smoking related to engine speed is nearly always related to bad oil rings, when its a blue oil smoke.

However, I agree that it is a bad thing to run with dilute oil. Plus, you're going to need to get that filter off at some point, might as well be now.

**yozzie** · 06-10-2010, 07:47 AM

When revving an engine or accelerating and there is oil smoke its usually rings in my experience. It can smoke all the time when they are really worn. When valve seals are gone I've seen smoke on start up as it burns the small amount of oil that dripped through the guides as it sat. I guess if the guides were really worn and the seals were shot it could smoke a lot as well, but i've never been lucky enough to see that.

**DGXSER** · 06-10-2010, 07:55 AM

Interesting concept is this. The consistant idea is that oil is getting past the rings. Now, the part of this that reminds me of the old which came first the chicken or the egg question is, are the rings bad and the normal oil is getting past? Or is the oil thinned out and getting past the normally tight rings?

Seems much cheaper to eliminate the thinned oil by changing the filter than to tear in for a rings. And if after replacing the oil it still burns like that, well, then the rings are still no more expensive and the oil filter is easier to remove. Just my thoughts.

**jmnjrpa** · 06-10-2010, 08:02 AM

+1

No matter what the filter has to be changed.

**Ivan** · 06-10-2010, 08:03 AM

Yup, try the cheap stuff first.

With that little bit of smoke, I'd probably keep a new set of plugs on hand and clean up the oil and ride the thing. I was just trying to explain the root cause.

I guess I forgot to mention that I have seen this same scenario played out several times as a tech, so that's why I went with the diag I offered.

**fabfabinc** · 06-10-2010, 04:40 PM

thanks guys appreciate everything ...... not to worry I have done maybe a whole 20 kms on this oil so yes the filter is coming off this weekend and new oil and I will keep you guys posted on the smoking....... thanks again

**Ivan** · 06-10-2010, 05:32 PM

Well, I hope it all works out for the best.

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