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**jmcmillan40** · 05-06-2010, 11:10 AM

help

well anyone

**cywelchjr** · 05-06-2010, 11:28 AM

Not having been in there I can't really say. My gears mesh really well and have never skipped on me (my original engine would skip out of second every great once in a while but that ones toast anyways). But it does look like you need to dremel the dogs. If it were me, I would do ALL of them, just to be on the safe side.

**motoman** · 05-06-2010, 11:39 AM

Wow, looks like that tranny has been hammered fairly hard. ALL the dogs and slots are rounded on edges bad enough to not stay in gear. Is fixable, and should last, but if hammered(speed shifts,etc.) won't last long as all those contact points are gonna have to be ground back farther than normal. May also have some slightly bent shift fork ends, plus those ends may be worn, gaulded like the flat surfaces between the slots on the gears. The idler gear on the fork shaft does have a snap ring on both sides of idler gear. There's not enough room to incorperate two teeny-tiny thin thrust washers between the gear and snap rings, so I just used one on the outside end so as to remove the minimal side-play of idler gear. Also as trbig would suggest, make sure the roll-pin in the fork shaft that indexes in case slots isn't mashed,broke off or damaged. From looks of slots and gear dogs, IMO would VERY carefully look over any and ALL tranny and shifter pieces before re-assembling. You very well could find several other associated issues causing this other than just plain obvious abuse!

**jmcmillan40** · 05-06-2010, 02:24 PM

so i just need to follow the guid on dremel

so i just need to foolow the guid on dremel fix.
or should i look for new gears?
i thaught the they are supost to be rounded just need not to have edges rounded further like in pic 2?
iam leary on grinding dont get it yet guess i should spend some time putiing the gears on the sgaft and seing how they fit?

so do i just under cut the dogs, smooth out the edges back to round then undercut the innerpart a little?

**motoman** · 05-06-2010, 02:58 PM

Lots of ways to go about doing the grinding. What I did was to clamp gear in a vise using a dremal with a diamond stone. Gear clamped in vise hold a bit of an upward angle not changing that angle and follow the round shape of dog back up and over untill the grinding comes out to the leading edge of dog leaving it sharply squared off. Since these dogs are badly rounded off would hold that angle ever so slight or you may end up with alot more material off the inner base part making it weak. For getting all the dogs the same initially try to hold same pressure and number of times of cycle up and over the dog, unclamp gear from vise and rotate so next dog is up at top in same position as last. Kind of a "seat of the pants" thing initially, but you can use a good set of calipers measuring from a known same point from each dog and get them as close as you can the same and the same spacing apart from each ones contact point. Don't grind the backside of dogs, just the LOAD side where the leading edge is rounded! For the slots, try to use a wheel as close to the size the slots are that way the rounded recess stays uniform, again measuring from a known point to each bottom of slot to keep the distace realatively the same. Again, ONLY on the load side of slot where rounded worn edge is. Short of having it done at a machine shop where indexing can be done, most of us here have fairly good success doing our own "shade tree" method of indexing with good lasting results. Others may chime in here with a good working method of keeping all dogs and slots relative to each other.

**bikerphil** · 05-06-2010, 02:59 PM

The tech tips for fixing the gears is well documented. If you got the cheese, buy new gears....

http://www.yamahaaccy.com/parts.aspx

**jmcmillan40** · 05-06-2010, 03:08 PM

i understand

i understand i just dont no how much to grind seems like 5 gear 2nd gear dogs look fine
and 3 to 4th
it just 4to 1st gear dogs and slots that look bad to me ?

**bikerphil** · 05-06-2010, 03:33 PM

Well then, just do 1 and 4. Problem is that 2 and 5 are not back cut (design flaw) and will eventually fail. It's not that hard to tear her apart again further down the road, is it?

**trbig** · 05-06-2010, 04:08 PM

Agree.. I would just do 1 & 4. The dogs going into 3rd are already back cut and it's extremely rare to have a problem between those two. One thing I WOULD suggest, is there in Pic #5 you can see the clip and the washer against 2nd gear. If you take that clip off, then the washer and gear, then reassmble with the washer first, then the gear then the clip (Moves the washer from one side of the gear to the other) then you get almost double the penetration of the dogs from 5th into those slots on 2nd. If it's not skipping now, that would just about guarantee it never will.

Some have doubts about running that gear against that clip, but I've been back in after a gear fix before when I tore up 1st AGAIN, and checked on that clip. I saw no wear after probably 25 or 30k miles, so it's not something I'd have any concerns about.

One thing you might do if you do this washer swap, is if you look at the shaft with the collar that the 2nd gear rested against, there is a bit of weld between that collar and the shaft. You can bevel the washer a bit on the inside to make it fit exactly flush against that collar, or throw it on as-is. It will make 2nd gear a bit tight spinning when you put the clip back on, but it loosens up quickly on it's own.

Tod

**jmcmillan40** · 05-06-2010, 05:33 PM

ok well i think iam done

well guys the dogs going from 4th gear to 1st one was so rounded that i hada to cut with cut disk to get it from being rounded the only thing is that i had to cut the others the same to match and i had to take off quiet a bit so the dogs are smaller is thjat going to be ok and 1st gear was hamerd to i tried to get the shelfs as flat as i could.

i went ahead and back cut them all but before i saw your respons i did both edges of the dogs.
hope it will be ok i am thinking i may need a new or better 4th gear and 1st gear.

also how can i test it, can i install and see if gears will go into, do i have te re asemble basket to see if it will go into gears?

**DGXSER** · 05-06-2010, 05:38 PM

As to the cutting, well, they needed to be cut and since new gears are about $100 per gear, may as well try it. Worse thing that can happen is it wears out quick and your back where you are now.

To check my cutting work, I use play dough or something like it as a plastigage and remount the gears on the countershaft and see if the gears all hit evenly both directions. After you get all the gears in and the shift side put together, you can check the gears shifting without the clutch put in.

**motoman** · 05-06-2010, 06:08 PM

They looked bad enough didn't surprise me as I originally stated that making the backcut as marginal as you could would keep most of the integrity of the dog. Doing the "bottom" slots(not open) is fine as I did that too. Likely not be an issue either way as stated, just getting a square edge on the dogs for those engagements would suffice. Again, just look closely at the shift fork ends for any grooved excessive wear. Should work fine if you refrain from any power, speed shifts. Sounds like so far your sorting it out well!

**jmcmillan40** · 05-06-2010, 06:15 PM

well hear is some pics

i had to cut alot off 4th gear to 1st dogs, and also i dont no if i got the shelves on 1 goos enough
all i did for rest of the dogs is angle the dremel and clean them up. and i just cleaned up the slots at a angle

**motoman** · 05-06-2010, 06:26 PM

Looks from pics bout as well done as can be expected considering their condition!

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