changing my xj1100 brakes to a more standard setup

[hordave]

Hey everyone,

I have an xj1100 which has the left front brake caliper tied to the back disk brake master cylinder. So when you press on the rear brake foot lever it not only applies the rear disk brake but it also applies the front left disk brake. When you pull on the front brake lever on the right handle bar it only applies the right front disk brake.

Okay what I want if for my bike to work like all other bikes so I want the front brake lever to operate both front disk brakes and I want the rear brake foot lever to operate only the rear disk brake.

So I am unfamilar with the xs1100 but if it has a rear disk brake and front disk brakes then I am hoping if I replace my front master cylinder and rear master cylinder with those of an xs1100 then I will be in business.

Am I correct? If I am correct does anyone have the front and rear master cylinder to sell me.

Let me know how my plan would work and if you may have the parts I need.

Thanks.

Dave...

[trbig]

Nope.. not a direct swap, but you can make due with what you have with some aftermarket braided stainless lines. For the front, you'll have to find a manifold or some way to "Y" the line and run two into one if you want to keep the stock M/C. There are some M/C out there you can run dual lines off of.

For the rear, you need to pull off the lines and get rid of the one going to the front.. it will have a rubber line going to a solid line up the frame, then back to rubber. I tried screwing the rear line directly into the proportion valve and plugging off where the other line went to the front, but the rear brake sucked that way. The harder you step on the back brake, the less pressure the proportion valve will give the rear, as it still tries to push it to the front. I doubt I could have skid the rear tire on a wet road.

So, you'll have to pull the rear master cylinder out of the bike and take off the proportion valve. There's a small solid line coming from the M/C into the valve that a regular 10m brake line end will screw into after you take it off. You're also going to like it a lot better if you replace the rubber line going to the rear with a stainless line. Matter of fact, you may need to just so the ends are right.

If you were to change the front rubber line to a braided stainless, just that one caliper in the front may do all you want. I always meant to run mine dual up front.. just never have gotten 'round to it, and it works well just as it is. So, you may try that option first before you try to run duals?


Tod

[hordave]

My worry about using the same front master cyclinder is that it may be a little on the small side to run two calipers off of. I also worry about only running one caliper off the back might make the back break way to touchy and cause me to over brake with the rear brake.

Any thoughts?

[kjohnson]

you can use the front master of an XS for the front. you would want to get the clutch handle/mount as well since the mirror mount are at a different angle. i have done it this way, but have yet to replace the clutch side handle/mount.

[trbig]

With rubber lines, the front M/C might not be enough, but it will work fine if you use the stainless lines that won't flex. I was doubtful there'd be much improvement just by switching out lines, but the difference was night and day.

Just running that one caliper on the back doesn't make it too touchy. It does change things up some, but just like cars, some you drive with really touchy brakes, and others not so much.. you'll get used to it pretty quick. In a day or two you won't even notice it any more. By switching from one to two calipers up front where all your braking power is anyway... THAT is the one I'd worry about being touchy at first. Back tire skids a bit.. pffft. Front skids a bit.. OH $HIT!!!!!!! lol.

If you are seriously worried about the back M/C, you can use one from an XS there. Not sure if some are different, but the one I had bolted up. When I did mine, I didn't like how it was with the proportion valve on, and instead of messing with it, I put on an XS M/C. I used it about a day, and it started puking brake fluid out around the plunger.. so that's when I went back to the XJ's and took off the proportion valve. I can't remember the size, but the XJ's M/C does have a bigger piston in it than the XS one, but I'm assuming that the ones that run the linked brakes like the XJ's are probably bigger also.

So.. you can change things how you want, but using what you already have and changing lines will work.

Tod

[jmnjrpa]

Say Tod,

If the rear MC applies pressure like

The harder you step on the back brake, the less pressure the proportion valve will give the rear, as it still tries to push it to the front. I doubt I could have skid the rear tire on a wet road.

Ever try reversing the valve?? I believe I will sometime soon. I have seen situations where more back brake is best. You always have the hand brake for the front.

[CatatonicBug]

The bolt pattern for the rear MC is exactly the same for all the XS11/XJ11's. It's a direct swap. If you are removing the front caliper from the rear MC, I see no reason why NOT to swap out the rear XJ master for a non-linked XS version. If you wanted to try keeping the XJ master on the rear, you can use a bolt to fill the hole on the proportioning valve where the front line connects. The bolt used to cap off the filler hole on the MC is the same thread, and a good length too. Of course, the whole proportioning valve system can be removed if you like.

If it were me, I would definitely be concerned about the bore on the stock front MC being enough to support 2 front calipers. Of course, the mounting points for the XJ front MC will make it difficult to use an XS version. Maybe the SS lines would be enough to make up the difference, but I'm not sure...

[Jerry]

If you swap out the XJ master cylinders, front or back, you will need to put jumper wires across the fluid sensor wires on the bike side connectons, else your LCD instrument pannel will show a light indicating a problem.

The XJ MCs are equipped with fluid level sensors that the XS units do not have. The sensors run into the LCD display computer, and it will show a warning if either the front or rear MC is low on fluid. I think you can by-pass the sensors by jumping the 2 ends on the bike side of the wiring harnes. This will fool the computer into thinking the fluid levels are OK.

[ManitoulinLad]

Hey HorDave: I have an LH but the same brake set up as the XJ. Mine have been separated. The valve was taken out the back m/c & pluged. The front M/C runs one line with a splitter - like a regular dual front brake bike. The brakes are fine. Still have rubber lines. Don't know what size the front m/c is but I stop fine. I personally don't care for the linked thing - but thats just me. I am sure the ss lines are a trememdous upgrade - just not in my budget yet. - Dan

[trbig]

Most shops have aftermarket stainless lines they can order. The lines were @ a buck an inch with the ends somewhere @ $8-10 each if I remember right. So each paycheck.. order a line, or maybe a couple ends, and before long you'll have it all there to install it. You could get the back done, but I wouldn't mix lines up front running duals. Wait until you have all of that and do it at one time.

How do you eat an elephant? Just one bite at a time..


Tod

[shutchis]

XJ Braking System

Hi guys, I just saw your postings and decided to add my comments; I hope you don't mind my inputs. I swapped my XJ11 braking to a more standard setup in '05. I used the front master cylinder as-is and replaced the rubber brake lines with braided SS lines. I ran two individual lines; one each from the left and right calipers to the master cylinder and used a double banjo bolt with crush washers (at the front master cylinder) to bolt them together. Note: A double banjo bolt is a like a single banjo bolt but longer, and is desgined to attach 2 banjos. I did NOT use a manifold. It seems to work just fine, my braking is MUCH better but not as good as modern bikes. I'm satisfied with the swap. If you install SS brake lines, be sure to buy stainless steel banjos, mine have rusted and they look terrible. I also bought clear plastic coated braided lines, which have yellowed and worn through in place. So I would buy braided lines without the coatings.

TRBIG is correct, the proportional valve on the XJ's rear master cylinder will hamper the rear brake's performance; so it must be removed. For 5 years, I haven't had a rear brake (to speak of), i.e. no skidding or lockup. This post got me motivated to fix my safety problem...thanks guys.

As of now, I haven't figured out a solution for connecting my rear SS brake line to the XJ's M/C. The XS11 M/C is designed to directly accept a banjo bolt. I've spent a few hours researching the problem but cannot find a standard brake line fitting to make the hose-to-MC connection. Tonight I plan to pull the guts out of the proportional valve and see if this will work. I might also try using the "front" port on the proportional valve to get more braking pressure. Wish me luck; I'll let you know the results soon.

[shutchis]

XJ11 Rear Brake Master Cylinder

Good morning guys, I hope everyone had a nice weekend. Here's my status report;

I connected my rear brake line to the front port of the XJ11 rear master cylinder; and I was lucky, the braided brake line was just long enough to reach the port. It definitely has improved the rear braking pressure, but I need more riding time to evaluate the change. Hmm...I'm wondering if removing the guts from the proportional valve will improve the braking? It's VERY HOT in Houston right now, but this might be worth the sweat. Stay tune for my next report. Stan H.

[SFerinTEXAS]

Not adding much to this topic I will say on my XJ restore I decided to restore the linked system just because I needed to try it before I could really have a true opinion of it. Only rode it on dry roads so far and have to admit while I have the same concerns about not having a separate control over the rear , there is a strangely good feeling when front and rear come on with the pedal. On my last test ride on an unfamiliar street, early morning sun in my face doing about 45mph with a passenger come suddenly to an unseen stop sign, not knowing if the cross street had one too. Slammed on all the brakes and almost threw my supprised passenger and me into the bars. On my SF that would have locked the rear brake for sure. And never stop that quickly. SO gonna continue with the way it is until convinced to change it. Just being more aware than ususual of the road conditions before I use that pedal . Road testing ongoing.

[xj11john]

On my ride in to work, I stopped to check air pressure in front tire and noticed front rotor on left hot. Thought to my self, "I just put new pistons and kits in that rotton front caliper".

Then I remembered the "spooge hole" inside the rear master cyl. can get clogged, and I havent cleaned it in a year or so, so that will be my next break fix tomorrow hopefully.

Good luck on the brake swap/fix with the linked system, I am waiting to hear how it works for you, I have also thought of getting rid of my linked system also, and still up in the air about it- (no pun intended! )

Good luck, and stay safe.

[shutchis]

XJ11 Rear Master Cylinder Front Port

Good evening guys, I went riding tonight; I was NOT able to lockup the rear brake and skid the rear end with the XJ1100 plumbed using the front port on the rear master cylinder. I'm going to remove the guts from the proportional valve and evaluate the change. Note: The front-port configuration provided very good braking and may be the best setup, because locking up the rear end isn't a good thing. For evaluation purposes, I'll gut the proportional valve. Stay tuned for details. Stan H.