Brakes, what did I do wrong...

[psycoreefer]

Ok guys, I just spent two days re-doing my brakes and they still won't lock up the front tire. I'm not sure where to go from here or what I did wrong....

New Pads, left and right
Disassembled and cleaned both calipers
Replaced rubber lines with braided stainless lines
Rebuilt master cylinder
Flushed and bled the entire system

The only thing that seems slightly strange is that when I pull the lever I can see the right side caliper twist just a little, but I think this is normal because of the strange pivot brake setup on a special.
I tried pumping them and they don't "pump up", the first pull seems exactly the same as the 20th pull.
I can pull the lever all the way to the handle bar, even with the new lines

The inside of the master seemed good, no gouges or anything, the old piston was a bit rusty but other then that I'm not even sure I needed to rebuild it.

I'm positive I got all the air out - spent a good 2 hours bleeding, put darn near half a bottle of brake fluid through it and had no bubbles coming out the bleeders for about half that time.

Help.....

[CatatonicBug]

I can pull the lever all the way to the handle bar, even with the new lines

This is the only thing that worries me. The clutch lever should do that, but NOT the brake! It really sounds like the pressure is just not there like it should be. Maybe there is air trapped in the upper part of the system? Try removing the caliper from the wheel, and holding it up in the air, above the MC. Bleed it again, and take time to allow air to climb the hose. Use a block of wood in place of the rotor, so you can put it back on the forks when you're done.

[psycoreefer]

Yeah, I know it shouldn't but I don't know, short of buying a new master what could be causing the problem. It did before the re-build as well, but I wrote it off to crappy old lines, I mean I could see the old lines swell when I pulled the lever, I assumed that with new lines I would see improved performance but really besides looking cool nothings changed.

I'll try pulling the calipers and putting them up high.

[mro]

sounds like the pressure is just not there

Either air or the MC has a problem.

mro
BTW, I don't remember seeing "caliper twist just a little" on my specials.
I'll have to go take a look.

[tinman905]

Speed bleeders are a good idea and/or pick up one of those vacuum brake bleeder kits it will save you a lot of time and stress.

[randy]

+1 The only good bleed I've ever gotten was with the calipers suspended above the master.

[psycoreefer]

I have a vacuum pump bleeder thing, I used it, I really don't think there is air left in the system but I'm going to try raising the calipers just to "rule it out". I have to do "some thing"

[oldyam80sg]

Speed bleeders are the things to have.No firm feel and there is a leak.

[crazy steve]

I have a vacuum pump bleeder thing, I used it, I really don't think there is air left in the system but I'm going to try raising the calipers just to "rule it out". I have to do "some thing"

Try putting some teflon tape on the threads of your bleed screws. I've also got a Mityvac (vacuum bleeder) and it didn't work worth a damn until I did that. Your symtoms are exactly the same ones I had without the tape....

'78E original owner

[mro]

Just looked at the two that I can get to.
neither has SS lines and neither caliper moves.
Brake hand lever travels about half way from rest to "full on".
The lever on the standard with SS lines travels less.

mro

[randy]

I've got speed bleeders and a mity-vac. The speed bleeders make it easier, but the fronts are bitch. Hang 'em up and it goes like **** through a goose

[mro]

I can't remember just what I found wrong on a specials front caliper once, but it was assembled wrong. May have had something to do with the metal bracket between the top of pads and the caliper

mro

[CatatonicBug]

I've got speed bleeders and a mity-vac. The speed bleeders make it easier, but the fronts are bitch. Hang 'em up and it goes like **** through a goose

You think THOSE are bad, try the linked front left caliper, actuated by the rear MC on the LH and XJ's! The metal tube that runs up under the tank is the high point in the system, and bubbles are just about impossible to get outta there!

[Yard Dogg]

Hey, I had the same problem with my brakes when I first started messing with them. I can't remember if you said you've rebuilt your master. I'll just say the master cylinder on these can be a PITA to get bled. Remembering what I went through trial and error wise, I can almost feel certain there is still air in your master. I tried my power bleeder, no luck, bled bled bled. I even got them bled out, then went for a ride and they would get spongy again, no leaks, it was weird. My caliper twists just a lil on my special, it could be that if there's air in your line, the caliper hasn't built enough pressure to keep the pads pressed close to the rotor. Once you get the air out, assuming there is air, that will get better. Actually what I just said doesn't make sense after rereading it, anywayz.

I ended up taking apart my master and cleaning it thoroughly so I knew what I had, then I bled it from the top down. Tap your lines to get any air to move up, go crazy on that part. Then pump it up, and carefully crack your line going into to master cylinder to bleed out your upper brake line, air can get trapped at that fitting. While you pump the lever, look down inside your fluid bowl. There is a really small pinhole sized hole in the bottom. Slowly pump the lever until all the air has escaped out of your master. Then get to bleeding your brakes calipers. If there is air in your master then these steps should start improving things right away.

Oh yeah, make sure to position your handle bars so any air in the line can move back up the master. I hope this helps, it worked for me.

[psycoreefer]

Thanks, guys.... I did rebuild the master, I'll keep at the bleeding...