Ok, what to do?

[cywelchjr]

Ok, here is my dilema. I bought an engine from a dismantler, condition unknown (he didn't know why it was removed from the bike). Everything I can see look really good and clean, but no clutch side cover, no clutch basket, no ignition hardware. Now, short short of cracking the cases (which I don't really want to do at this point if I can avoid it, how can I get a decent idea if the bearings and such are likely ok? I want to avoid any teardown that I can as I intend this to be a temp engine while I tear down and rebuild my original (has a knock, has fins broken on the head and on the jugs on the left side but runs and shift great other than that).

Any ideas or suggestions? Of do I really HAVE to crack the cases and pull the head to know the condition of the engine?

Please tell me there is a way, as I just want this thing to buy me a couple of years to do a first class rebuild on the original (I plan to replace or refurb any worn parts and replace the head and jugs, maybe with an 1196 kit (I know, I'll still have to find a set of jugs and get them bored for the bigbore kit)).

Is this even something that is doable?

Thanks.

[Hawkins]

I'm no expert, but this is what I did when I was forced to call my spare engine into active duty.

1.) clean around spark plugs and intake ports

2.) make sure there is sufficient clean oil in the base

3.) make sure cam adjuster is in place (front)

4.) remove all spark plugs

5.) remove ignition timing case (left side)

6.) rotate engine by hand several times

7.) if all feels ok, hook a battery up to a set of booster cables, clamp the neg terminal on the engine, and us the pos terminal on the starter terminal to get her cranking.

8.) check compression on all cyls

9.) if compression is good, just tune her up and use it. If bad, try a compression test with some oil in the cyclinders and also try a leakdown test.

Mine had poor compression on cyls 3 and 4, but I sprayed some engine restore into the cyls and let her sit (overwinter in my case). Next check I did the compression was much better, but still bad. I decided to install and use the engine and after some use all four cycls read 150 psi cold at sea level.

hth and good luck

hawk

[Hawkins]

Another thought - I'd suggest you change the oil and look for metal filings etc. in the filter bowl and on the magnetic tip of the drain plug.

Also take note of the plug color as you take them out. If they don't all look the same, note which cylinder(s) is/are odd.

Don't force the hand rotation - with the plugs out and the tranny in neutral (probably doesn't matter much if the clutch is missing), it should be easy to spin the engine with a 19mm spanner on the timing plate. Be sure to rotate clockwise, and go slowly at first. Others may correct me, but I think your biggest worry here is a piston hitting a valve that's stuck open.

[cywelchjr]

That might be well and good, but since it has no side cover or clutch basket I can't change the oil, there isn't any. I guess I need to get the clutch cover (I have the clutch basket) and get it assembled and then put oil in it and compression test it. Hopefully I'll be able to hear if there are any unusual noises.

[trbig]

Holy cow! You have the engine right there. 34 bolts that are all numbered for you to take off in order. 1/2 on one side.. flip the motor over and 1/2 on the other. Get a piece of cardboard and punch holes in it and number them.. put the bolts in their apropriate hole. There's two pry points at the front of the motor where there's a little more "Beef" on the cases. Tap a medium sized screwdriver in there with a hammer and pry the shells apart.

If the motor has a shifter cover, that and the hardware must come off with the two little oil gallies that have the torx screws. Get a tube of Yamabond for when you put the cases back together.

Maybe 30 minutes to split the cases from where you're at.... how pissed off are you going to be to get it all back together in the bike and fire it up.. only to find the bearings are wiped out? Doesn't seem like a very smart shortcut to me.. but it's your decision.


Tod

[Thee_oddball]

Holy cow! You have the engine right there. 34 bolts that are all numbered for you to take off in order. 1/2 on one side.. flip the motor over and 1/2 on the other. Get a piece of cardboard and punch holes in it and number them.. put the bolts in their apropriate hole. There's two pry points at the front of the motor where there's a little more "Beef" on the cases. Tap a medium sized screwdriver in there with a hammer and pry the shells apart.

If the motor has a shifter cover, that and the hardware must come off with the two little oil gallies that have the torx screws. Get a tube of Yamabond for when you put the cases back together.

Maybe 30 minutes to split the cases from where you're at.... how pissed off are you going to be to get it all back together in the bike and fire it up.. only to find the bearings are wiped out? Doesn't seem like a very smart shortcut to me.. but it's your decision.


Tod

+1 do everyting while the motor is out...nothing more depressing than puttign everything together only to hear thud thud thud coming from the bottom end

[dbeardslee]

Tod - that was an excellent post! I actually cut and pasted it onto my computer, so I won't have to go digging when the time comes. Your economy of speach was a thing of beauty. Really, I'm not kidding - that should be a tech tipette . Thanks.

[cywelchjr]

Ok, I guess I was just trying to avoid doing that, but your right, it's the right way to do it and since the engine is out and sitting on a pallet right now it makes sense to turn it upside down and crack the cases, and while I'm in there I'll check the gears for wear (in case I need to do the dremel fix on them). I guess I better get some plastigauge as well and check the clearances. This is NOT going to be fun, I'm trying to avoid working on the innards of this thing sitting in my driveway (I don't have a garage or any shelter available). So while I know it's gotta be done the right way, I'm really not looking forward to it (with the way things are going in the economy right now bills keep going up and pay doesn't, but at least I still have a job).

Thanks, I'll let you all know what I find when I crack the cases.

[oseaghdha]

Ok, I guess I was just trying to avoid doing that, but your right, it's the right way to do it and since the engine is out and sitting on a pallet right now it makes sense to turn it upside down and crack the cases, and while I'm in there I'll check the gears for wear (in case I need to do the dremel fix on them). I guess I better get some plastigauge as well and check the clearances. This is NOT going to be fun, I'm trying to avoid working on the innards of this thing sitting in my driveway (I don't have a garage or any shelter available). So while I know it's gotta be done the right way, I'm really not looking forward to it (with the way things are going in the economy right now bills keep going up and pay doesn't, but at least I still have a job).

Thanks, I'll let you all know what I find when I crack the cases.

I built a 400ci V-8 in my laundry room once.
Almost didn't fit through the door on the way out.

[trbig]

You start with the motor right side up.. you'll need a 10 and 12mm socket. Also, in another post, I mentioned the vent cover on the back right of the motor. 4 Allen bolts takes that off and there's one of the case bolts under that cover. You start at #34 and go backwards to disassemble.. then at # 1 on re-assembly. On the front of the case, there's also a #11 and an 11a. I think it was an afterthought.. so mark your cardboard appropriately.

Personally.. if you're just checking things out, I wouldn't even bother with the plastigauge. With that, you have to re-install the case, retorque all the crank bolts, then remove again. Instead.. simply take a look at the crank bearings and look for copper color (Bad) A tiny bit of copper color and you can probably get by for a little while. If the whole thing is pretty much copper.. the bearing is gone and crank will probably need to be checked.

On re-assembly, the main thing to watch for is to not get Yamabond up against the crank bearings so that it squeezes into them when the shells are stuck back together. You need to leave a little gap like in this pic I've circled in red... but it's necessary to get it around those bolt holes..





As for the gears... check out one (Or more) of the 2nd gear fix threads. If the gears look OK.. I'd still move that washer to the other side of 2nd gear.


Tod