Engine overhaul

[beechfront]

has anyone here done the job themselves? I did a search for overhaul and didn't come up with much.

my goal is to mechanically get this bike as close to new as possible.

[beechfront]

kits?

where would i even find a kit at? i'm not having much luck.

[Snow]

Weeeellll... for the top end, you have Wiseco that offers bigbore kits of 1179 and 1196 I believe...its funny, I can't rememer the size of the borekit I installed in my bike. You can order Wiseco's kit from just about anywhere, but Pro-Flo in Florida has them for under $400 with shipping.

Then you will need a machine shop to bore and hone your cylinders. (took my brother and I about 3-4 hours total to get to the cylinders and to get them off)

You'll also need a gasket set, I believe partsnmore has them at very reasonable prices. You can also get a bunch of other things at partsnmore such as timing chain, brake rebuild kits, etc for nice prices.

As far as the bottom end goes, can't help ya out much.

Oh yeah, buy lots of razor blades from the auto store and a can of pam. Blades are for removing stuck on gasket (*carefully!!!*) and Pam is so you don't need to use razor blades in the future. You can actually get away with reusing some gaskets if you spray them with pam before first assembly.

Pro-Flo
If you do order from Pro-Flo, tell them Pete from Tally sent ya

[TopCatGr58]

Hey there Beechfront,

I did my resurrection on my 81Sh about 2 years ago, the bike had sadly sat outside for 8 years, not covered or prepped so moisture had gotten to the cylinders. So I pulled the engine and tore it down myself. Did NOT crack the cases, just pulled the jugs, took them to a MC machine shop, $40.00 a hole!! I went with the 1179 big bore kit, cause that's already making the cylinder walls pretty thin, the 1196 makes them even thinner, and once you go there, you can't go any further, at least with the 1179, I might still have another boring option in the future!!?? You'll need a low scale torque wrench, standard ones start at 10 lbs, you will need 5 or less increments, several parts only need 7lbs torque!!! Headbolts only 25!!

Did the valve work as well, replaced the seals, lapped the valves and seats. Used the same cam and chain, wasn't too stretched!! I have 180PSI on average at sea level which equals to about 12.25:1 comp ratio. The tricky part was the valves gap clearance, and of course retiming it when putting it all back together, but not impossible, and I'm only a shadetree survivalist!! Been running over 2 years now, XSeast2002 from Va. to NY, and Fall 2002 to Asheville, NC. While I had it out, I flipped it over and did the Dremmel fixes on 1-5 and 2-4 gears dogs and slots! Narry a skip now. Email me if you want any more info or have questions about certain steps, I'll tell you what I know and did!

T.C.

[beechfront]

thanks for the feedback.

would the big bore kit be necessary? I'm not so much concerned with power as I am reliability. Could I just put in new rings? I mentioned this to my brother and he thought if put in just rings it could possibly make things worse.

[Snow]

If you were to put new rings in, you would still need to hone the cylinders - and while it is apart, you should check that the bores are within spec. As my #4 piston was able to slide left and right and front and back too easily, I decided to bore.

[beechfront]

...so i guess if i have to hone anyway i might as well do the big bore kit.


anyone replace bearings?

[xssiveone]

Originally posted by beechfront
anyone replace bearings?

Yes. Bearings are plane bearings, the same as found in a car engine. The manual describes how to determine which ones you need. It also tells what the maximum wear is for both main and connecting rod big end bearings. Don't have it in front of me, but IIRC, there are markings on one end of the crankshaft, and markings near each main bearing and on each rod cap. I ordered mine from Zanotti Motors Price was reasonable and service, as always, was excelent.

As for the cylinders and ring replacement, again, the manual describes the maximum wear and cylinder out of round allowed. You "may" be able to just put the stock size rings back in if the cylinder isn't worn too badly. Honing of some form is a must.. otherwise the rings won't seat in properly. If it just require's honing, most auto supply stores sell a honing tool that fits in your electric drill.

[uk1.1s]

Engineering

Sorry to state the obvious - but is there a reason for all the work?

New Rings / honing vs Big bore kit - Is there a compression problem? Is the bike burning oil? If so, fair enough - but if not just ride and enjoy and do the work when it's needed.

My engine has about 75000 miles on the clock and I've had the engine apart for other tasks - measured the barrel / ring gaps and found that I didn't need to do anything. Looked at the head and replace 1 valve, ground them all back in and replaced the valve stem oil seals. Once apart there is always a thought to do things whilst you're in there - but to get in there to rebore / re-ring withoug any symptoms seems a bit masochistic.

The XS engine takes the miles in it's stride pretty well and I'd only start tearing it apart if there was a need. The old addage - if it ain't broke don't fix it seems to apply.

Hope I'm not too blunt here - please don't take offence - there may also be something glaringly obvious written above that I missed. In my experience reliability is better if you don't have to start doing any of the major stuff. If it's reliability yuou are after I'd take a long hard look at the electrical system, particularly the old wiring and make sure those carbs are well sorted and cleaned.

[beechfront]

no you're probably right. I really enjoy working on this stuff and want to learn more - i'm probably just looking for an excuse to tear into it. I need to find an old bike that actually does need the work rather than tearing apart one that already runs fine.

thanks for the advice.

[tank]

I am rebuilding my bike at this very moment and have just run into a problem. Have you tried to remove the cluth assembly? I cannot get the bolt to budge and am afraid of tearing something up. Did you remove yours yet? If so, is it a normal thread? I have read Clymers and it just says to remove the lockwasher and nut. Perhaps I have overlooked something some where.

[beechfront]

yeah if you look under the tech tips it mentions this. I used an impact driver i bought a sears ($25) and a 27mm socket. You're going to have a tough time getting that nut off without one. If your engine is still connected to the frame, according to the tech tip you can just apply the brake to remove it. It's a bugger to get off. I whaled on it for awhile before it moved. Would have helped to have a bigger hammer though.

hope this helps.

[uk1.1s]

That damn bolt

In one manual (Haynes I think) - it suggests that you lock up the clutch assembly by inserting something like a flat bladed screw driver between where the clutch basket gear teeth pass a little cast in shoulder on the crank cases.

I seem to remember that this wasn't too easy so in the past I've stuck a hefty screwdriver between where the clutch basket teeth mesh with the primary pinion (the gear that drives the clutch) As they are all case hardened you can lock things up in this way and put quite a bit of force on the clutch nut (making sure to knock the tabs down on the lock washer first). For the unfastening I've used a long arm socket wrench which has a 2 foot handle after 'shocking ' the nut with a hammer tap (care here as the aluminium clutch basket is fragile).

Of course you need about 6 hands for all of that to happen Best of luck - it's one of the worst bits (have you taken the generator rotor off yet?) so take heart!

[TopCatGr58]

Stuck Nut

Hey there Tank,

I just put mine in gear, I think even shifted up a few gears to give better leverage to the back wheel/driveshaft, had it up on the center stand, wedged a strong piece of wood inbetween the back wheel spokes against the shocks or frame, then took the recommended size socket, attached it to a large torque wrench, and then just went at it, it's put on with about 50 or so lbs of torque, and after years of use, it's very stuck, that's why I used a torque wrench so I could see how much force I was applying to it, almost up to 100lbs before it broke loose! YMMV, HTH.

T.C.

[tank]

Thnx for the replies, however, the motor is out of the frame and sitting on the floor. We tried putting it in gear and stopping the drive shaft from moving with a socket and 230 lbs of human downforce. Then I turned the nut only to lift the weight off the ground, (my partner)! I'm thinking of moving on and removing everything else, then taking what's left to the shop and remove it there. Sorry I stole your thread beechfront. I will try a LARGE cheater bar before i give up though.